Talk:Caning in Singapore

DYK comments by Alarics

[It is a pity this appeared on the main page, because it is wrong: the cane is made of rattan, not bamboo, and the number per year is actually over 6,000.]Alarics (talk) 08:55, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Comments by IP

Is there any information on the amount of damage caning can result in? I checked the wiki page for general "caning", but could not find any information on this either. I am interested in what kind of "pain" this form of punishment is capable of dealing, and how successful it is in detering future crimes. 68.102.37.191 08:01, 20 August 2006

Would you please sign your additions with four tildas (~) so that everyone can follow the thread of the conversation and keep comments below the message box above? As for caning, damage is related to the type of instruments with which the beating is administered. China traditionally flogged with two sorts of bamboo - the heavier bamboo being a more serious punishment than the lighter. Those bamboos could split the skin, scar permanently and in fact kill. Singapore uses a light rattan I believe. I was told that in the Fay case that the skin broke and there was blood, but it is unlikely there would be permanent scars. I am sure there are any number of people who for the right price would show you just how painful it is. In the Fay case it was not that successful considering his criminal career afterwards - something Lee Kwan-yew seems to think justifies caning Fay. Singapore has a very low crime rate, but what causes that is impossible to know. Lao Wai 09:49, 20 August 2006 (UTC)

I think I read those crimes Fay committed were in the U.S. or elsewhere, and not in Singapore. An interesting point that you said it Fay's caning would not cause permanent scars, since his defense claimed that his crime would not fit the punishment, since it WOULD cause permanent physical and emotional scars. (Well we don't know about permanent emotional part, but I bet he certainly did not return to Singapore). I was also interested in the method of their caning. Specifically, I heard that if the criminal receiving the caning passes out, they revive them with smelling salts, before resuming the caning. I thought I would find that information in the wiki, but that might be a myth. Also they bring in a caning expert with 'xx' amount of skill. All interesting stuff. 68.102.37.191 22:08, 20 August 2006 (UTC)

I don't know where you read that but it is not true. It is rare that countries allow prosecution of someone for 'crimes' commited in other countries. Read the Michael P. Fay article for more information... Nil Einne 12:47, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

There really isnt much to respond to the above comment when it is devoid of viable sources. And what is deemed "interesting" is only relative to how ignorant the reader is. Singapore's methods of caning is not that different from most contemporary methods, if not slightly more humane.--Huaiwei 13:10, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

School Caning

What is the rationale for schools making its boys change into PE attire before caning? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 218.186.12.228 (talk) 09:51, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

One can only guess. Some schools in England used to do this, and the British Navy training ships did something similar. The material might be thinner than ordinary trousers (though this seems unlikely to be significant in Singapore, where trousers are thin anyway because of the tropical climate). It might be a way of making sure the boy is not wearing any underpants. Maybe it is deemed to add to the sense of ceremony. -- Alarics (talk) 10:20, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

Reminds me of my school days when I witnessed a total of 7 public canings, 2 in primary school and the other 5 in secondary school. I came from mixed-sex primary and secondary schools. In primary school, the DM always made the boys change into PE attire, but the PE shorts were not really significantly thinner than my ordinary school trousers. In secondary school, the DM did not bother to ask the boys to change into PE attire. He just whacked them over their uniform trousers. He pulled up the boy's trousers and tucked a file into the waistband all the time. I heard from a friend from a boys school that his DM also made the boy change into PE attire before caning. He carried a bag with him whenever he was going to cane someone. Guess what was inside the bag? My friend told me that the DM just fished out a pair of PE shorts from the bag and passed it to the boy to change. Apparently, the pair of shorts have not been washed after use, because the boy took a sniff and you can guess what his facial expression was. Singaporean748 (talk) 09:57, 23 November 2009 (UTC)

How is it done?

This article does not give enough detail in what actually happens. For a start, the article does not exactly say what part of the body is caned. It is implied to be the buttocks, but could easily be the legs. How long is the cane? How thick and wide? How far does the cane guy stand from the guy being caned? Anybody know? --Commking 03:37, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

All these points have now been answered in the article. Ffaarrrreellll 10:14, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

Ok i've gotten a link to one of the videos of Canning in Malaysia under the references. I believe its an officially released video as I've seen it on Orgish before and the Singapore goverment sent an explanation to orgish about it which was posted on the same page. However, i can't prove it. the rack used by Malaysia and Singapore/Brunei is slightly different btw. but mainly same procedure. Fatfool 14:41, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

New to Wikipedia- I just want to say that I removed the sentence that "caning is mandatory for ... visitors who overstay their visa". I know this not to be true and it seems like spam. If anybody can find any reference backing this up, please re-insert it into the article again.[First editor] —Preceding unsigned comment added by 155.69.163.244 (talk) 11:59, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

It is indeed mandatory if they overstay by more than 90 days. I have clarified this in the text and added a link to the relevant legislation. -- Alarics (talk) 16:55, 7 October 2009 (UTC)

news story

maybe this story can be incorporated into the article somehow??

http://www.reuters.com/article/oddlyEnoughNews/idUSSIN4600620070717?feedType=RSS

This case has been included in the article under "Notable cases". Alarics (talk) 08:57, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Separate sessions

I'm not sure if this is true, but a friend of mine who just visited Changi Prison told me that the prison officials told him that the strokes are not given in one session, especially if it's a heavy sentence. Can anyone verify this with some up-to-date sources? 116.15.187.53 (talk) 08:15, 12 November 2009 (UTC)

As an example to gender discrimination?

109.65.20.195 (talk) 19:10, 4 February 2010 (UTC) wasn't logged in Shiftadot (talk) 19:53, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

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Counter arguments

There is an entire segment titled "objections to caning", but not a single link to any source arguing in favor. This is rather biased. 98.223.23.29 (talk) 04:18, 21 August 2016 (UTC)

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Prune

No, we should NOT be listing every individual example of caning in Singapore. The article lists "notable" cases, and that's already problematic, in the sense of a. why should we list examples? and b. what's notable?. As is usual with such articles, "notable" should be taken to read "having a Wikipedia article". In addition, listing living people who have undergone this cruel punishment, but who are not deemed notable enough to have a biography on them, that's a clear BLP violation in my mind. Leave them be--there is no good encyclopedic reason to have their names in this article. Drmies (talk) 16:43, 22 April 2022 (UTC)

@Drmies: This is a late reply but I agree, in fact, it has gotten worse. @NelsonLee20042020:, what is your obsession with making such an excessive indiscriminate list? This article has become unreadable. 42.118.15.178 (talk) 10:38, 26 May 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for the note--I did prune it some and will probably prune it some more. Drmies (talk) 13:38, 26 May 2024 (UTC)

I am sorry if it had caused some discomfort in terms of reading experience, I just added the cases and not to make the article unreadable or something

And I actually was about to suggest split the info of those cases into a separate list where people of whichever nationality are given caning in Singapore but it seems now that this had been settled in another solution now

The only thing is how the other editors may view this too. NelsonLee20042020 (talk) 05:24, 30 May 2024 (UTC)