Talk:Cao Yu

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 1 September 2020 and 22 December 2020. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Ra5en. Peer reviewers: Brittanyli, Siyuan Cheng, Reuentahl404.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 16:42, 16 January 2022 (UTC)

Transcription Systems vs. Ideogram Sets

You seem to be confused between Pin-yin and Wade-Giles Romanizations for the sounds that Chinese utter when they pronounce Chinese characters in Mandarin (or Modern Standard Chinese), and the simplified and the traditional way of writing the same Chinese character (regardless of the Chinese language (Hokkien, Hakka, Cantonese, etc. you might choose to use to pronounce them).

I suggest that you examine this question, and revise this minor detail. Anyone who knows anything about Chinese is so used to such things that they may not even notice your slip; however it could be a source of considerable information for anyone who is not aware of this stuff. Best to youLindsay658 08:23, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

You are right that I am completely unfamiliar with the systems and request that you, as someone who is obviously much more conversant than I with the systems, and much better situated to do a proper job, be bold and fix whatever I cocked up!--Fuhghettaboutit 22:26, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

Sorry, if I came over as being super-critical; all I meant was that what you have as:

(pinyin: 萬家寶; Wade-Giles: 万家宝),

should read either (traditional characters: 萬家寶; simplified characters: 万家宝), or (Wan Chia-pao, in Wade-Giles transcription) depending upon your intention -- although I suspected it was the first, I wasn't sure, and that's why I left you the note.

Also, in terms of any Chinese issues it is always best to show the two sets of characters, and you are to be congratulated for doing so. It can also be strongly argued that, due to the complications of English language literature, it is also best to provide both the Pin-Yin and Wade-Giles transcriptions for anything prior to, say, 1990 (as you have done at the head of the article). Keep up the good workLindsay658 23:05, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

I didn't take it as critical at all! but I also would find it hard to fix as it really is completely outside my experience. My only familiarity with Cao Yu was translating the article from the Spanish Wikipedia article and doing outside research to try to make it correct. Let me put it a different way, please fix what I don't believe myself competent to fix:-)--Fuhghettaboutit

Done! Glad to help. Lindsay658 23:55, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

Thank you!--Fuhghettaboutit 00:23, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

Noticed that you were having trouble with born and born. Have moved the text and made slight alteration so that it now seems very fluent. Hope it meets your approval. Also, "Good Luck" with your GA (I can't vote because I have contributed). BTW, I used the term "literary name"" because it is not clear whether it was (a) a Zi, (b) a Hao (see Chinese style name), or (c) a nom de guerre (I really hate the English, pseudo-French expression "nom de plume"; and, anyway, the term "nom de plume" does not seem to match the Chinese usages in the way that "nom de guerre" does -- but I think that "literary name" give the best "feel"). Best Lindsay658 01:55, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

Good Article

This is not a good article because:

• It has NO footnotes.
• It has NO pictures.
• It has difficult for people from a non-Asian culture to understand.

--GoOdCoNtEnT 07:02, 10 August 2006 (UTC)

No footnotes: agreed. Unfortunately, the features Spanish Wikipedia article I translated this from did not (they have much lower standards in general). Guess I would have to hit the library in order to get good references, Very little online.

No pictures: Incorrect, but the one picture it has it admittedly, meager and trivial as not a picture of Cao Yu but of a school he attended.

Difficult for people of a non-Asian culture to understand: Can you expand on that because reviewing the article, I have no idea what you can be referring to.--Fuhghettaboutit 14:07, 10 August 2006 (UTC)

External links modified

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• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20060418200334/http://english.ccnt.com.cn:80/?catog=drama&file=040301&ads=service_001 to http://english.ccnt.com.cn/?catog=drama&file=040301&ads=service_001
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20050409151508/http://espanol.chinabroadcast.cn:80/1/2003/12/05/1@749.htm to http://espanol.chinabroadcast.cn/1/2003/12/05/1@749.htm

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Requested move 4 March 2018

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Not Moved.(non-admin closure) –Ammarpad (talk) 15:32, 18 March 2018 (UTC)

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• Cao Yu → Cao Yu (playwright)
• Cao Yu (disambiguation) → Cao Yu

– No primary topic here. Usage wise, Cao Yu (Three Kingdoms) receives about the same pageviews as Cao Yu even though the playwright occupies the primary spot. [1] I also don't think the 20th-century playwright can claim long-term significance over a person who died over 1700 years ago. There's also a 3rd Cao Yu (Cao Yu (cinematographer)). Timmyshin (talk) 04:42, 4 March 2018 (UTC)--Relisting. —usernamekiran(talk) 11:26, 11 March 2018 (UTC)

• Oppose per WP:PRIMARYTOPIC. Cao Yu is a giant of modern Chinese literature, recognized as "China's Shakespeare" according to the The Columbia Anthology of Modern Chinese Drama. whereas Cao Yu (Three Kingdoms) was not a significant historical figure, known mostly as a son of Cao Cao. The recent traffic spike for Cao Yu (Three Kingdoms) is probably caused by his appearance in the 2017 TV series The Advisors Alliance. Long term traffic pattern shows that the playwright gets far more page views in the long run. See also Lu Xun vs. Lu Xun (Three Kingdoms). -Zanhe (talk) 20:10, 4 March 2018 (UTC)

• Over the long run, Cao Yu averages 19 hits/day, Cao Yu (Three Kingdoms) 9/day, and Cao Yu (cinematographer) 8/day since it was created 1-2 months ago. That's only 53% of the total traffic, even smaller if it's disambiguated. "China's Shakespeare" is irrelevant since unlike Lu Xun (who averages ~300 views/day) very few en.wiki readers are interested in Cao Yu, as the numbers show. (BTW if you google "China's Shakespeare" you see far more references to Tang Xianzu and Guan Hanqing, in fact I don't see Cao Yu in the first 3 pages of the results.) Timmyshin (talk) 22:44, 4 March 2018 (UTC)

• Even if the playwright does not get a lot of traffic on English wikipedia, he still averages more than the other two combined. And pageviews are not the only criteria for determining primary topic. Do a Google books search for "Cao Yu" -wikipedia, and most of the results are about the playwright. As for the Shakespeare comparison, Tang Xianzu comes up more often because he was Shakespeare's contemporary (and Guan Hanqing was even older), but as far as modern drama is concerned, Cao Yu is "widely viewed as China's leading playwright of the 20th century". (see [2]) -Zanhe (talk) 06:31, 5 March 2018 (UTC)

• Oppose per Zanhe and both parts of WP:PRIMARYTOPIC: the page views over time and the historical significance of the playwright. Dekimasuよ! 20:29, 16 March 2018 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Origin of Cao Yu as His Penname

On Mandarin Chinese Wikipedia, they write "曹禺这个筆名是取自他本姓正體“萬”字，拆为“草字头”和“禺”，草字頭换为曹，“萬”就成了“曹禺”。". I was taught this as well. It seems reasonable, but I don't want to add this to the page and assume that this is true without a good source. Geographyinitiative (talk) 20:45, 14 November 2020 (UTC)

Pen name of Cao Yu; the first "Golden age" in Chinese spoken drama

I added the origin of Cao Yu's pen name and his positions in Chinese drama associations in the lead section. There is a journal article written in Chinese talks about the origin of the pen name. Here is the link:

I also re-organized the structure of the content a little bit by adding a new section named "The First "Golden Age" of Huaju (spoken drama) in the Mid-1930s" and changing the original "Thunderstorm" and "Sunrise, The Wilderness" sections as the sub-sections of the new added section. I think it is necessary to mention the "golden age" of Chinese spoken drama here because the content is relevant to Cao Yu's drama literatures. New reference is also added to the article. Ra5en (talk) 06:19, 20 November 2020 (UTC)

References