Talk:Deborah Martinez-Martinez

JaneClawsten (talk) 20:49, 19 January 2024 (UTC)

Notability

I'm not seeing how this page meets WP:N? Beyond WP:GNG, given who Martinez-Martinez is, the page could potentially try to meet WP:AUTHOR, but on my assessment this would seem impossible. JaneClawsten I appreciate your contributions however I'm struggling with this one. Your thoughts would be appreciated. Cabrils (talk) 00:23, 20 January 2024 (UTC)

Hi @Cabrils, considering how limited the coverage of Hispanic/Latinx/Chicanx people is available, I'm trying to address the racial bias on wikipedia. It's hard to find secondary sources about local figures who provide care for the community, and they are incredibly important. I've been especially looking at figures who have historical collections but there's just a lot less biographical info out there. If you have tips on making that notability decision, I would appreciate it! I'm still figuring it out. JaneClawsten (talk) 02:02, 21 January 2024 (UTC)

Hi JaneClawsten. Thanks for the prompt reply. Yes, I understand your motivation, however we are still bound by the relevant policies. If I were to be reviewing this page as a draft, this would be my comment:

Well done on creating the draft, and it may potentially meet the relevant requirements (including WP:GNG, WP:ANYBIO) but presently it is not clear that it does.

As you may know, Wikipedia's basic requirement for entry is that the subject is notable. Essentially subjects are presumed notable if they have received significant coverage in multiple published secondary sources that are reliable, intellectually independent of each other, and independent of the subject. To properly create such a draft page, please see the articles ‘Your First Article’, ‘Referencing for Beginners’ and ‘Easier Referencing for Beginners’.

Please note that many of the references are not from sources that are considered reliable and should be removed (including blogs, company websites).

The draft does not appear to show any notability beyond the average coverage in trade publications for similar people (see WP:ROTM).

Also, if you have any connection to the subject, including being paid, you have a conflict of interest that you must declare on your Talk page (to see instructions on how to do this please click the link).

Please familiarise yourself with these pages before amending the draft. If you feel you can meet these requirements, then please make the necessary amendments before resubmitting the page. It would help our volunteer reviewers by identifying, on the draft's talk page, the WP:THREE best sources that establish notability of the subject. You may also wish to leave a note for me on my talk page and I would be happy to reassess. As I said, I do think this draft has potential so please do persevere.

Hopefully you will find some of the suggestions and links in that comment helpful.

Again, given your history of editing you seem to know what you're doing, although to achieve your goals you still need to meet the notability criteria. In this case, if reliable sources can't be found to establish notability then my position would be that the page should be moved into draft space until notability can be established. Cabrils (talk) 22:34, 21 January 2024 (UTC)

Ok, thank you @Cabrils! I found another article about her book, would this work as another independent source for notability? I appreciate your guidance! JaneClawsten (talk) 18:43, 22 January 2024 (UTC)

@JaneClawsten -- That's a helpful citation and would be considered a reliable source, but it is worth noting though that the Greenley Tribune is still only a regional newspaper (["We cover Weld County, the ninth-largest agricultural-producing county in the United States"]) so it doesn't go very far in establishing notability, as defined. Perhaps another 3+ like this would do the trick... Cabrils (talk) 04:16, 25 January 2024 (UTC)

@Cabrils Bet!

• Powerful Women Paper Dolls And Their Stories
• Chicana activist Shirley Romero fighting for land, race teachings as part of legacy
• Book signing, social justice arts event on tap
• Pueblo's Columbus statue site of further protests as community members seek it's removal
• Fresh version of Pueblo's past revealed

I guess I didn't use these before since they are about her works, and not her biography. I really appreciate all your responses! JaneClawsten (talk) 21:48, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

@JaneClawsten: Again, I think these are helpful. Would you please add them to the page (and any relevant content from them) and then we can reassess the page. As I said, we are wanting the article to meet WP:N, WP:ANYBIO, WP:AUTHOR etc. I still have concerns over whether these will be sufficient to establish notability, but adding them should make that assessment easier.

Note that the article already contains one (offline) reference to The Pueblo Chieftain, so I would suggest identifying and adding only the best 2 articles (including the one article that is already on the page) that establish Martinez-Martinez's notability.

It would then be helpful if you could please identify here in this thread:

1. the 3 best sources; and

2. with specificity, exactly which criteria you believe the page meets (eg "I think the page now meets WP:ANYBIO criteria #3, because XXXXX").

Thanks. Cabrils (talk) 02:30, 27 January 2024 (UTC)

Thanks, @Cabrils!

1. The three best sources are:

• Author highlights stories of Colorado Chicanas in new book
• Fresh version of Pueblo's past revealed
• Return of the Corn Mothers: Inspiring Women of the Southwest

Martinez-Martinez is notable because:

I believe the page meets WP:AUTHOR criteria 4B: Her book El Movimiento de Pueblo has accompanied the History Colorado exhibit about the Movement when it moved from Denver to Pueblo, and was assigned as the textbook for the university class that followed the exhibit. The exhibit had major coverage in Colorado. Additionally, criteria 4D: her research and other materials are an important collection in the Colorado State University-Pueblo Library.

It meets WP:BIO criteria 1, since she has written at least 3 books that have been nominated for or finalists for the Colorado Book Awards (Trade on the Taos Mountain Trail, El Movimiento de Pueblo, and Chicana Activists of Colorado).

I hope that is sufficient. Thanks!

JaneClawsten (talk) 21:28, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Hi @JaneClawsten. Thanks for this. My thoughts below:

• "I believe the page meets WP:AUTHOR criteria 4B: Her book El Movimiento de Pueblo has accompanied the History Colorado exhibit about the Movement when it moved from Denver to Pueblo, and was assigned as the textbook for the university class that followed the exhibit. The exhibit had major coverage in Colorado."

What are the reliable sources supporting these statements?

• "Additionally, criteria 4D: her research and other materials are an important collection in the Colorado State University-Pueblo Library."

What are the reliable sources for this?

• "It meets WP:BIO criteria 1, since she has written at least 3 books that have been nominated for or finalists for the Colorado Book Awards (Trade on the Taos Mountain Trail, El Movimiento de Pueblo, and Chicana Activists of Colorado)."

I think you mean to refer to WP:ANYBIO #1? If so, I'm not sure that "the Colorado Book Awards" is considered "a well-known and significant award or honor" but will see if I can find a comparable. What are the reliable sources for this?

Thanks for your ongoing help and patience. Cabrils (talk) 01:30, 2 February 2024 (UTC)