Talk:Disklavier

Comments July 2006 - April 2008

What is "CFIIIS"? -- Mikeblas 14:50, 29 July 2006 (UTC)

CFIIIS is the model designation for the nine-foot Yamaha concert grand. Jamesmarcus (talk) 11:57, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

This article reads too much like an advertisment for my liking.--Johnwrw 11:40, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

Any article about a trade-name product may seem so. This is what separates Wikipedia from an encyclopedia. But consumer products are delt with in life on a general basis and deserve coverage as well. Jamesmarcus (talk) 11:57, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

No, Wikipedia is an encyclopedia; it is this article that is the problem. Much of it reads like an ad because at least some of it, and I suspect a lot of it, is lifted directly from Yamaha material. See [1].

The more I search, the more I see that this page is mostly pieced-together copyvio from various sources. I don't have time to hunt it all down, so I'm just deleting all the ad-copy sounding sections. --Allen (talk) 07:31, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Even the first sentence was copyvio. I just replaced the whole page with the copyvio tag.

May 2009 - blatant advertising

The article has been returned to an unencylopedic, piece of PR for Yamaha, which again is full of cut/paste copy vio and close paraphrasing (as per the above comments). To the editor who restored this version, this article will be reduced to a stub unlesss this is fixed in the next 48 hours. Voceditenore (talk) 22:23, 15 May 2009 (UTC)

Since the creator and chief contributor of the article has removed all the maintenance tags without remedying the problems, I will record the problems here:

The tone of this article reads like a brochure or press release for the company. Examples:

• "In 1999, Yamaha introduced the first "Disklavier Pro" to the American market. The "II Pro" was its first incarnation, marked by a decidedly more accurate playback over anything preceding it.

• The Pro utilized both an "Enhanced" and "XP" mode - the latter utilizing special "XP data" which subdivided the standard commands associated with traditional midi. Thus, 127 degrees of midi velocity were converted to 1015 such degrees. Additionally, pedal data was vastly increased to measurements of 256 increments of measurement allowing for fine half and quarter pedaling by the artist. This enhanced detail of servo-controlled measurement gave the Disklavier Pro playback a much-greater "human" sense of musical reproduction."

• "Yamaha Disklavier IV has naturally found its way into music teaching studios across the United States and, to a lesser extent, abroad. Experimentation and development is now underway on a new, revolutionary system of teaching called "Remote Lesson"..."

• "Disklaviers have also been used, frequently, as a feedback tool for teachers and students wishing to illustrate strengths and weaknesses in a performance..."

This article has no reliable, sources, independent of its subject. Until they are provided, and it should very easy to do, given the claims being made, the article remains unencylopedic. It stands out a mile to any neutral observer as a piece of coporate PR inserted into Wikipedia, regardless of whether it was intentional. The tone and lack of referencing from neutral reliable sources actually does the company and its product a great disservice. Voceditenore (talk) 06:27, 16 May 2009 (UTC)

Use in Education

I stumbled upon this aricle kind of accidentally. I love classical piano but I don't play (only plunk) and had never heard of a Disklavier until I saw this article. I did see one years ago, a reasonably long grand, as I vaguely recall, playing unattended in an upscale retail store to provide "ambience". In the context there I thought it was in poor taste, actually, and I assumed it was just another "player piano", albeit in a grand case. ( Sorry, guys. ) After learning about it from the web, though, I've become convinced that assumption was very incorrect. But despite my new-found appreciation for the instrument as a teaching tool, I'm in complete agreement with the previous comments lamenting POV. So I thought I'd try to do something about that, even though pianos aren't within my area of expertise at all. Almost all my effort to do so went into trying to move the "Education" section in the direction of NPOV. I did include one source I found that I think passes WP:Reliable for the section, viz. USC, but I didn't really spend time looking for others. I suppose there are others?

What caught my attention in the first place was the ability to connect two of the Mark IV's. Yes, I understand that the "Remote Lesson" system could plausibly be described as vaporware by an unsympathetic mind since it has only been demonstrated at trade and music shows and "captive" events, and only released (as I infer) to interested academics and piano professionals who have access to Internet2 through the institutions they're affiliated with. But even if standard internet never gets upgraded to the point that it consistently satisfies the demand for very low network latency that "real time" applications inherently present ( all those VoIP users sure are going to be mad ;) I'd still say "Remote Lesson" is significant-enough to include in the article, both as an advance in itself and just for the value it has about Yamaha's strategy for the product line. Besides, it's the Disklavier itself that has to pass WP:Notability, not each of its capabilities or its planned features individually, as I understand it.

I'm not entirely satisfied with my reworking of the small "Education" section: I know the refs probably aren't formatted to whatever the current standard is, for example, and I wasn't sure, either, about whether my description of the USC article for the references section as "Report on a new kind of at-a-distance piano lesson" was alright, in place of the actual USC title. I hope so: I made the substitution because I didn't think the actual title of "It's Here: The Bicoastal Piano Lesson", fit the article's actual content, and it's too specific to the U.S.A. besides. There are still problems with the section, of course, ones I just don't have any more time to try to fix. But I hope other editors will see my attempt as an improvement, even though a very incomplete one. ( It always surprises me how very long it takes to create or carefully edit even a paragraph or two on Wikipedia anything like well. ) Btw, a search engine tells me that Encyclopedia Britannica mentions the Disklavier, but I find I can't access the whole article. Cheers, Ohiostandard (talk) 06:13, 19 November 2009 (UTC)

Neutral Point of View - April 2010

Significant edit: Given the comments that the article has probably done Yamaha a disservice by being presented in a blatantly promotional way, I have edited the entire page to give a more objective and encyclopedic tone and style. I'm happy to leave any detail and other development to others. I have had no previous involvement in the article and I have made no attempt to cite additional references. I am an ordinary satisfied user of a Mark IV Disklavier, with no ties to Yamaha. Like others, I found the promotional nature of the article rather offensive, but did not want to see their achievement undermined by poor writing or unwise advertisement copy.

Markcsg (talk) 17:49, 5 April 2010 (UTC)

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