Talk:Doctor Fate

Action Figures or Collectibles?

I was wondering if it would be more appropriate to have the sub-heading Action Figures read Collectibles instead? After all, the helmet replica is not an action figure, and changing to a collectibles sub-heading would allow for a cleaner way to denote any past or future Doctor Fate merchandise outside of television and film. DBHughes (talk) 23:26, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

Proper name for the helm?

I think its proper name is the "Helm of Nabu", but I've read here how some people call it the Helmet of Fate. Are they used interchangeably? Which is considered the primary term; we should use that. I've altered the heading in the article to reflect the "original" use for the helmet, but I welcome any cited references that contradict that view - hopefully, with some discussion beforehand. - Jack Sebastian (talk) 20:02, 20 October 2011 (UTC)

Four endings for Gerber run?

In my tpb copy of the Gerber run on Dr. Fate, there are four different endings, written by four of Gerber's friends after his death. But when I added that to this page, it was reverted. Is there a reason why that info cannot be kept on the page? Aristophanes68 (talk) 00:50, 2 July 2013 (UTC)

I can't say why it was reverted, but I can say it doesn't belong where it is. The fictional biography section should be fictional only. The real world information like the writer's death should be in the publication section. Argento Surfer (talk) 17:42, 2 July 2013 (UTC)

Okay, I get that. But my problem was that there are FOUR endings, and that the section as it now stands simply mentions one of them. I know in all four, Fate recovers, but otherwise the endings are different enough that it seems too simplistic just to say "here's what happened". Does that make sense? Aristophanes68 (talk) 18:30, 10 July 2013 (UTC)

Are the events of the ending significantly different enough to include the variations in the plot summary? Have any of their unique events been referenced over others in later canon? Were the alternate endings availble separately outside of the collection you mention? If the answer to all of these is "no", I think mentioning their existance in the publication history section is enough. Argento Surfer (talk) 14:55, 11 July 2013 (UTC)

Khalid Ben-Hassin

I think it's real important to note that this guy is from Earth 2 68.173.11.102 (talk) 04:21, 30 September 2014 (UTC)

Jasper Winters

I am wondering if anyone knows if this name has ever appeared in association with Doctor Fate. Episode 1 of the now-airing Constantine TV series had the Fate Helm of Nabu or whatever you want to call it in the lair of Winters, but I do not see him listed as Fate. It made me wonder if Winters might have been a supporting character of sorts who might have held the helm in between its use by characters who took on the role. --Ranze (talk) 08:35, 25 November 2014 (UTC)

External links modified

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Hatnotes

As there are multiple pages with the title "Doctor Fate," some of which include further disambiguation, they should each be included as a hatnote to this article or on a disambiguation page linked to this article as per WP:SIMILAR. AllegedlyHuman (talk) 21:27, 25 May 2021 (UTC)

If you read WP:SIMILAR, you may notice that that concerns similar names of completely different things. This page is about characters named Dr Fate. if there was a place called Dr Fate, New Hampshire, or some such, then we might need to disambiguate, but not when they are a shared topic on the same page where they are already disambiguated. - jc37 04:50, 26 May 2021 (UTC)

You're just looking at the one example given. The text says nothing about required dissimilarity: "When two articles share the same title, except that one is disambiguated and the other not, the undisambiguated article should include a hatnote with a link to the other article." There are other Wikipedia pages with the title "Doctor Fate" and then parenthetical disambiguation. Either those pages should be renamed, or they should be linked here per policy. AllegedlyHuman (talk) 06:03, 26 May 2021 (UTC)

No, I'm actually looking at the whole page. (As well as WP:NCC and WP:CMOS). And by the way, the hatnotes that you are looking for are already in the article, at the top of each relevant section. Here are just a couple quotes from WP:SIMILAR:

"...Mention other topics and articles only if there is a reasonable possibility of a reader arriving at the article either by mistake or with another topic in mind..."

"...Ideally, limit hatnotes to just one at the top of the page or section..."

Anyway, these pages are disambiguated, in several ways. Adding duplicative clutter to the top of the page is not the intent of WP:SIMILAR. - jc37 06:41, 26 May 2021 (UTC)

"Anyway, these pages are disambiguated, in several ways." I think you may be misunderstanding the meaning of "disambiguate" on Wikipedia. There is exactly one way of doing that. This page does not, so long as there is not a hatnote. WP:NCC in fact has relevant guidance on this; see Wikipedia:Naming conventions (comics)#By codename. Given that multiple articles have the same title, some of which use parenthetical disambiguation, there absolutely is "a reasonable possibility of a reader arriving at the article either by mistake or with another topic in mind." The hatnote I added was also collapsed into a single hatnote, rather than a stack, as per policy. If you or any other editor feels inclined to coalesce those into a disambiguation page to further reduce clutter I would have no issue with that, but so long as another article has the same title as this one it needs to be linked at the top of the page. That is the intent of WP:SIMILAR, and I am not convinced that anything you have provided refutes that point. AllegedlyHuman (talk) 22:24, 26 May 2021 (UTC)

Well first, I might suggest that you read WP:DAB. This page is, by design, one that disambiguates. Just because we have a specific type of page called a "disambiguation page", which follows a particular format, does not mean that other types of pages do not disambiguate. See also Wikipedia:Stand-alone lists and Wikipedia:Set index articles.

Second, all of those Template:Main links in each section on this page are hatnotes. So we shouldn't also be adding duplicative hatnotes at the top, per the quote I listed above.

And third, you may want to check the edit history of WP:NCC and find out who wrote that section of the guideline, and quite a bit of the rest of it... It's possible that I may be rather well-versed in the intent of WP:NCC.

All that aside, the goal here isn't to be difficult. Nor to blindly follow laid out guidelines. They are there for particular reasons. In this case, our overall goal is to be helpful to our readers, both to help in navigation, but also to reduce clutter to increase readability. And adding duplicative hatnotes at the top of this page when the sections below all already have them is, by definition, duplicative clutter. And we avoid clutter on Wikipedia in several ways, for several reasons. One of which is Banner blindness. It's also why guidance like Wikipedia:Avoid template creep exists. Noting that Template:For, is of course, a template. See also - MOS:DUPLINK and MOS:LEADLINK among many other policies/guidelines.

So yes, this page is a list which (among other things) disambiguates, with specific sections referring to the main articles for each of the various characters.

I hope this better clarifies. If you have any questions on any of the policies or guidelines noted above, please feel free to ask. I am happy to help. - jc37 03:46, 27 May 2021 (UTC)

Typo in "General Powers"

In General Powers, for this sentence: "...they temporarily coalapse into one being with combined powers..."

Is that word supposed to be "coalesce" or "collapse"? --Techielaw (talk) 20:01, 1 June 2022 (UTC)