Talk:Driftless Area/Archive 1

Cleanup requested

I don't know if the article was originally translated from some other language, but the name of the area is "Driftless Zone", not "Driftless Area" in every source I've found, so I moved the article to Driftless Zone. That said, the article is in serious need of cleanup... Tomer ^TALK 03:03, Jun 27, 2005 (UTC)

Every source I've ever come across refers to it as the "Driftless Area," including the DNR, the USGS, and a geological guide to Wisconsin written by two Ph.D. University of Wisconsin-Madison faculty... a Google popularity contest between the two phrases seems to agree: "Driftless Area" Wisconsin "Driftless Zone" Wisconsin — 24.211.0.91 18:46, 27 September 2005 (UTC)

This seems to be a terminology adopted by the UW faculty in the mid 1980s. Until they become the ultimate arbiters however, their option remains a neologism, no matter how much literature they pump out, nor whether or not the WDNR adopts the appellation. If I could go out and do a survey of people who live in the Driftless Zone, over what they call the region, those who don't respond "the coolee region" would overwhelmingly respond "driftless zone", since that's what textbooks up until a few years ago said almost exclusively. Also, while I'm harping, the zone extends outside the state of Wisconsin, so I can conceive of no particular reason why "Wisconsin" should be required as a search term. Tomer ^TALK 01:09, 7 November 2005 (UTC)

"Wisconsin" was added as a search term to help limit it to a geographical context with Google... less chance of counting webpages discussing the driving sport of drifting, or marijuana use and entering a "driftless zone," for instance. Driftless Area is the official USGS designation of the region, and the one used on all maps and government documents. Most people might say they live in America, but the proper designation (and the one this encyclopedia uses) is United States. Sames goes for United States Supreme Court vs Supreme Court of the United States... the former is popular while the latter is proper. 72.131.44.247 23:57, 6 January 2006 (UTC)

Wikipedia is not an extension of the US government. Wikipedia:Use common names says we should prefer the name most people are likely to search for. Tomer^talk 12:15, 13 January 2006 (UTC)

I'm glad you mentioned that, as Wikipedia:Use common names refers the reader to Wikipedia:Google test regarding popular usage. "Driftless Area" clearly passes the test.

You seem to keep adding on reasons as to why your move was the proper choice. Returning to the oringinal statement of "...but the name of the area is "Driftless Zone", not "Driftless Area" in every source I've found" I will reiterate that the majority of sources use "Driftless Area." 72.131.44.247 03:38, 14 January 2006 (UTC)

Actually, if your assertion were correct, I would go a step further and insist that the article should actually be moved to Coulee Region. Tomer^talk 03:58, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

I'll agree to that! :) Although supplanted (the reference comes from French settlers), it does seem to be in popular use with business names and the like (ie: Coulee Region RV Center)... either one would be better than "Driftless Zone" which only has 3,570 results at Google. Would you like to make the move or shall I? 72.131.44.247 06:06, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

If you make a move to Coulee Region, I will fully support the move, as long as you make appropriate redirects and clarify in the article that "Coulee Region" is the colloquial name for the area, that it is popularly referred to as "Driftless Zone" and since the mid-1980s in official documents coming out of the UW, as the "Driftless Area". Tomer^talk 09:15, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

(i.e., make any necessary disclaimers, just make sure to mention that it's colloquially referred to, especially in the southern half of the region, as the "Coulee Region" Tomer^talk 09:17, 15 January 2006 (UTC))

Hmmm...there for a minute, I was about to reverse my decision, but I've decided to stick with it. Since the main gist of this article is the visible manifestations of the geologic region, let's let it remain at "coulee region" and introduce a section indicating why the eastern 1/3 of the region is so flat {i.e., Glacial Lake Wisconsin). Really, the Coulee Region refers only to the "hilly" part of the Driftless Zone, but as far as topography goes, that's by far the most notable (and commentworthy) feature. Tomer^talk 09:23, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

Decision

It was requested that this article be renamed but there was no consensus for it be moved. Ryan Norton ^{T | @ | C} 10:23, 15 October 2005 (UTC)

Glaciers

Okay, so this area was bypassed by glaciers... but why is that? I think it should be mentioned in the article. Ubermonkey 16:34, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

Good idea. Done. (SEWilco 02:47, 30 May 2007 (UTC))

Glacial River Warren et al.

¶ Glacial River Warren drained the immense Lake Agassiz, carving the valley of the Minnesota River (a puny stream today, in contrast to the canyon is occupies). Similarly Glacial Lake Duluth drained to the Mississippi via what is today the Saint Croix River. And of course there is Glacial Lake Wisconsin. All of this is said to have created the rather remarkable gorge of the Upper Mississippi River; in the interest of touristically oriented public relations, I like to characterize this something approaching a Grand Canyon. ¶ The article states there were ice sheets to the north, south, east and west of the driftless area. How did the Mississippi exit, then? Did we have a vast freshwater lake falling over an ice dam to the south? Since I'm writing from NE Iowa, I really am curious about just how this extraordinary chasm got carved out. ¶ The Iowa portion needs beefing up a little. The Upper Iowa River and Yellow River (Iowa) valleys are little grand canyons in their own right, unlike anything you'll see elsewhere in Iowa. I'm thinking about it. --Ace Telephone 04:36, 9 June 2007 (UTC)