Talk:Ehengbuda/GA1

GA Review

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Nominator: Vanderwaalforces (talk · contribs) 12:47, 2 July 2024 (UTC)

Reviewer: Fritzmann2002 (talk · contribs) 21:16, 12 July 2024 (UTC)

Hello Vanderwaalforces, I will review this article in the next few days. If there are any similar GAs that you used as a template / role model, linking them for me would make my job a ton easier! Looking forward to working with you. Fritzmann (message me) 21:16, 12 July 2024 (UTC)

@Fritzmann2002 Heyy, it's great to see you picked this one, anticipating working with you. I just went through Category:GA-Class biography (royalty) articles randomly but I looked at Andriamanelo too for context. I really hope you'd be available to review more of my royalty bios in the future, I am planning on nominating quite a handful of bios like this I've worked on. Happy reviewing. Vanderwaalforces (talk) 22:31, 12 July 2024 (UTC)

Prose

• There are quite a few people here that should probably be links, most of all Orhogbua in the lede which I've gone ahead and added. I won't go to the lengths of listing all the ones I think should be linked here, but if you could do a sweep of the article and look for additional bluelinks (or redlinks, if the terms should have articles) it would benefit the lay reader immensely.

   Done I did all-round wikification, it should look good by now. --Vanderwaalforces (talk) 22:40, 14 July 2024 (UTC)

• "solidifying control over tributary states" ...such as x, y, and z, perhaps.

   Done Mentioned the states. --Vanderwaalforces (talk) 22:53, 14 July 2024 (UTC)

• "During his father's absence at war" do we know which war?

  I haven't come across the war being named, not even in the source. --Vanderwaalforces (talk) 22:53, 14 July 2024 (UTC)

• What is Uwangue? Does it just mean "senior chief"? This could use a touch of elaboration, considering it seems like his first act was to deprecate the post

   Done I expatiated on it a bit. --Vanderwaalforces (talk) 22:53, 14 July 2024 (UTC)

• "the Oyo or the Nupe" who are these fellas? I'm not familiar with them

   Done It's actually Oyo Empire and Nupe people, I have wikilinked them. --Vanderwaalforces (talk) 22:53, 14 July 2024 (UTC)

• Paragraphs three through five of Military campaigns don't seem to fit the theme. Perhaps a new subheading like "Domestic relations" or "Court intrigue" or "Internal challenges" would be more appropriate?

   Done I used "Internal challenges and domestic relations" --Vanderwaalforces (talk) 00:05, 15 July 2024 (UTC)

• The lang template on emada confuses the grammar; it should be something like "emada, or state-swordbearer,"

   Done --Vanderwaalforces (talk) 00:05, 15 July 2024 (UTC)

• Is there a timeline for any of these internal challenges? As in, do we know roughly when any of these events took place?

  It is really hard to tell exactly when. Sources did not mention that, hence why I could not add, I also don't want to make speculations, especially unsourced. Because, for example, with my knowledge of the history, I would say Ekpennede's situation was at very early reign of the Oba. --Vanderwaalforces (talk) 00:05, 15 July 2024 (UTC)

• Same issue with the lang template on his nickname, may just need to be written in plaintext

   Done I reformatted it now. I guess I will have to do same for the one first removed entirely above. --Vanderwaalforces (talk) 00:05, 15 July 2024 (UTC)

• Does the nickname "Arun-aza" correlate to the coral collar at all?

  I wouldn't say it correlates to the coral collar. --Vanderwaalforces (talk) 00:05, 15 July 2024 (UTC)

• The final paragraph is probably not needed. If it were perhaps changed to how scholars today perceive his legacy and were framed that way, it would make sense to include. However, it now serves as just a re-statement of the lead. I recommend merging this last paragraph into the lead and renaming the final section

  I have, in fact, removed the entire paragraph as I don't see it necessary too. It looks like a repetition really. --Vanderwaalforces (talk) 00:05, 15 July 2024 (UTC)

• The article on Andriamanelo discusses his issue. Did Ehengbuda have any children, and if so what is their story? Also, I don't see any discussion of succession either, which should probably be briefly mentioned (especially in the lead).

   Done I expanded on the Princess' story. --Vanderwaalforces (talk) 00:47, 15 July 2024 (UTC)

References

• The infobox states he is buried in Benin City, but I'm not seeing where that is stated or cited in the body. I also don't see where the claim of his "Traditional" religion is supported, nor any discussion of religion at all

   Removed --Vanderwaalforces (talk) 00:05, 15 July 2024 (UTC)

• I lack access to most of the sources used unfortunately, but a spotcheck of Akomolafe shows that the change from Owo to Olowo is verifiable, and that the reference is on-topic. Assuming good faith that the other references are also such.
• The reference list is well-organized and consistent.
• Earwig gives a 0.0% copyvio prediction so I have no concerns there.

Miscellaneous

• Article is stable
• A map of some kind would benefit the article greatly, especially of the conquests. I am someone unfamiliar with the history of this region, and I had to keep checking different articles to orient myself geographically. However, this is not required for GA by any means, just a thought for future improvement.
• I am hesitant about the image in the infobox. It isn't Ehengbuda, just a head of an Oba. Perhaps noting this more specifically in the caption would help, along with the given timeframe of the artifact of the 16th century (which is at least close to Ehengbuda's reign)

  I guess I will have to remove the image entirely. Would you mind suggesting what to do here since there's not image or at least a bronze statue of Ehengbuda on Wikimedia Commons? --Vanderwaalforces (talk) 00:47, 15 July 2024 (UTC)

• Perhaps an image of Orhogbua could be included in the Early life and Accession section?

   Done --Vanderwaalforces (talk) 00:47, 15 July 2024 (UTC)

• Is there an image of the Lagos colony that could be included in the death section?

  Could not find any useful one. --Vanderwaalforces (talk) 00:47, 15 July 2024 (UTC)

Summary

Overall the article is very well-written and quite close to GA. The biggest changes are a few content gaps to be filled, a couple of prose nitpicks, and a handful of questions about the images. Once those have been addressed, I am more than happy to promote this excellent article to GA. As an aside, I'm currently competing in the Developing Countries WikiContest and would be happy to review more of your articles, especially if they are from varying developing countries. So, if you nominate anything from another country for GAN drop a ping on my talk page and I'll try to pick it up for review! Fritzmann (message me) 14:10, 14 July 2024 (UTC)

@Fritzmann2002 Okay thanks, I have started attending to this one. There's also Talk:Udagbedo who was another Oba and Talk:Battle of Ekiokpagha. Most of my nominations would be Benin royalties like this, not from another country, so I hope you'd be ready to become enlightened in Benin history ;) Vanderwaalforces (talk) 22:56, 14 July 2024 (UTC)

I have addressed everything, apart from the Head of Oba image. Vanderwaalforces (talk) 00:49, 15 July 2024 (UTC)

On the image: I would either remove entirely, or at least specify the timeframe of the image ("...from the 15th century"). On the expansion of the princess section, I think that may have gone a bit overboard. It reads like a story, and seems to be given a bit of undue weight in the article. There is also extensive editorializing (words like "poignant" and "tragic") that should be avoided. The reference it is taken from is also highly suspect; is there anything that makes edoworld.net reliable? Fritzmann (message me) 13:30, 15 July 2024 (UTC)

@Fritzmann2002 I have added "from the 16th century" to the caption of the image. I hope that is okay now. For the princess' expansion. The only reason I consider edoworld.net reliable is that they also do quite a handful of research is proven to be true considering that I have seen their stories and the one's from other reliable sources tally. I have never really cited that site before because of reliability concern obviously. But I have no prejudice against reverting to the way that section was before (without the princess thingy). I just wanted to talk about the Princess there, since I don't think there's sufficient details to talk about her on a standalone page. What do you suggest please, should I cut the story short or revert back to the former based on the reliability of edoworld.net? Like I said, only a single button should revert it and I don't have any prejudice against the removal :) Vanderwaalforces (talk) 15:45, 15 July 2024 (UTC)

If there are reliable sources that include that material, include them and reduce the section. If not, revert it back to the way it was. Either way, I think after that action is taken the article will be ready for promotion. Fritzmann (message me) 15:50, 15 July 2024 (UTC)

@Fritzmann2002 Okay, that's great. I reverted it since, with all my resources, I have not come across this story the way it was narrated in edoworld.net, even though some of them were factually correct. Vanderwaalforces (talk) 16:03, 15 July 2024 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.