Talk:Elle Macpherson

Gay Icon Project

In my effort to merge the now-deleted list from the article Gay icon to the Gay icons category, I have added this page to the category. I engaged in this effort as a "human script", adding everyone from the list to the category, bypassing the fact-checking stage. That is what I am relying on you to do. Please check the article Gay icon and make a judgment as to whether this person or group fits the category. By distributing this task from the regular editors of one article to the regular editors of several articles, I believe that the task of fact-checking this information can be expedited. Thank you very much. Philwelch 21:38, 24 March 2005 (UTC)

Pronunciation

Why do some people (Americans?) pronounce her name "mc-fear-son" instead "mc-ferr-son"? --*Paul* — Preceding undated comment added 07:09, 5 April 2005 (UTC)

Because they don't know any better. It's hard to discern the pronunciation from a name from the way it's spelled. How do you get "win" from "Nguyen"?

A girl I knew had the surname "Macfarlane." Everyone called her "McFarlane" even though her name was correctly pronounced "MAC-Farlane" (one word). Even her official documents had McFarlane and MacFarlane, since the "Mc" and "Mac" are common prefixes. Soon she got tired of correcting people and just let them call her by the incorrect pronunciation of her last name. :-S — Frecklefoot | Talk 16:03, 5 April 2005 (UTC)

Except that getting "fear" rather than "ferr" from "pher" is the least likely option. In addition, we (Australians) pronounce it "ferr" so presumably Elle does herself. So the question remain, where did the "fear" come from? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.168.198.102 (talk) 03:03, 16 November 2008 (UTC)

Actually I have known people of that name (in the US) who used the mc-fear-son pronunciation. Pronunciations of names sometimes change within families, especially when they come to a new country. Maybe the family I knew was a one-off, but in any event at least some people really pronounce their names that way who have this surname. Maybe it is more common pronunciation in the US. I think in this case it does not help that the people on TV have consistently mispronounced her name. In fact I've actually never heard this name pronounced that way for anyone including her. The guy above you is right. We just don't know any better. 01:35, 30 November 2010 (UTC)

I recall that when Macpherson was mentioned on Seinfeld they used the MacFEARson pronunciation. WWGB (talk) 02:23, 30 November 2010 (UTC)

Date of birth

Does anyone know the true date of birth of Elle? According to IMdB she was born in 1963 but other sites say she was born in 1964. Jester2001 10:52, 21 May 2005 (UTC)

Well, I just set it up to say '63 or '64 for now. Most likely it's '63 and she's just tried to shave a year off her age at some point, but who knows. We'll need a definitive source to resolve it one way or the other. Everyking 08:35, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

I'm very inclined to believe that Elle's year of birth was 1964 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 115.69.47.212 (talk) 13:25, 28 November 2013 (UTC)

I wouldn't worry about it. If you look hard enough, you'll find an age discrepancy for practically every celebrity. I'd just go with the year imdb gives.--Fallout boy 11:51, 3 February 2006 (UTC)

Someone changed it to '64, citing elle-macpherson.com, which is not her official website. I changed it back to "1963 or 1964", adding a footnote to indicate that sources can be found for both dates. dbtfz^talk 08:01, 30 March 2006 (UTC)

This needs fixing

"Macpherson is the most financially successful of all the world's supermodels. A 1997 estimate placed her net assets at $40.3 million. Cindy Crawford is a relatively close second with $41.2 million."

Elle can't be both the most financially successful and yet Cindy Crawford is said to be 'close' with a figure that's slightly higher as that a contradiction.

Breast cancer advocate?!

"McPherson is a breast cancer advocate who launched the inaugural campaign Fashion Targets Breast Cancer in Dublin in 2005. Designer T-shirts were sold to raise money for Action Breast Cancer, a project of the Irish Cancer Society, and Europa Donna Ireland."

Surely no one advocates breast cancer. Changed it to "breast cancer awareness advocate", but if anyone can be more specific (i.e., research, funding, what have you), go ahead.

Unreferenced (and somewhat nonsense) claim from article

"Macpherson is the most financially successful of all the world's supermodels. A 1997 estimate placed her net assets at $40.3 million. Cindy Crawford is a relatively close second with $41.2 million." Thue | talk 19:37, 28 August 2006 (UTC)

Suggestions

NO is calenders, for mi is calendars. About cancer I like spokeswoman. And I think no is chick model agency, is Click http://www.femmesfatales.com.ar/en/ellemacpherson

An article about a model, which has no picture

Only on WP does an article about a damn MODEL not have a picture. How much irony is that? Thank the Copyright Nazis for that, because I'm sure there have been plenty here over the years. Just ridiculous.

You know, granted that she's a model, I think her physical appearance is pretty relevant. Not that I'd waste my time uploading a picture so the Copyright Nazis can delete it. Instead, I propose that someone write a detailed textual description of her, put it in a box the size of a picture, and put it in the article where a picture would go if this site weren't run by a bunch of paranoid asshole sheep. mdash;Dan 06:18, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

I don't approve of calling people "paranoid asshole sheep" but I do agree with the substnce of your argument, if not the style. The trouble is that a small handful of vocal people are trying to turn throw out the fact that this is an encyclopedia in favor of furthering their free content crusage. They don't want to allow any fair use photos, not even those freely distributed as publicity photos, if there is even a remote possibility of getting a GNU or creative-commons licensed photo. That is a real shame. We already have the commons to push for free photographs. They have forgotten that we are trying to make the most usable, most informative encyclopedia possible. Johntex\^talk 17:34, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Spelling of the name

If Macpherson is correct why is it spelled MacPherson throughout the article? I will change all the incorrect spellings so the article is consistent.Gr8white 19:07, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

I corrected the spelling except where an external reference is misspelled and added [sic] in those cases.Gr8white 20:17, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

Kids

The birth dates of her sons are totally wrong. it should be 14 February, 1998 for Flynn and February 4, 2003 for Cy. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.178.181.153 (talk) 23:08, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

See also

Her name doesn't appear on the List of famous tall women referenced here so either the section should be removed or the list modified.Gr8white 20:23, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

During the mid 1990s there was an incident at a South Australian shopping centre where a man rushed at Macpherson and called her a name, he then jumped over a railing to his death. I can find no information on the incident that would not involve contacting the Adelaide Advertiser or a similar publication. The man's name, and what caused his actions would be of public interest. Barrison 13:18, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

The man's name was Garry Moore, he was 22 years old, and the incident occurred on October 9th 1992 at Rundle Mall.Barrison 02:19, 18 March 2008 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Barrison (talk • contribs)

Law?

Okay, this is nit-picking a little, but did she really get into law at the University of Sydney? Everywhere I've read it says she was "pre-law", which means nothing really since law is either a combined Bachelors degree, or is done as a post-graduate degree. You can do any degree before doing law as a post-graduate degree, so getting into law is quite different to doing something "pre-law". Example - "Elle gained a place at Sydney University to study pre-law, but left after a year when she was spotted by a modelling scout while on a holiday in Aspen." http://www.okmagazine.com.au/celebrities.html?p=celebrityProfile&celebrityId=90 Yippeedoodah (talk) 06:04, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

Rhino horn?

Interview with Elle Macpherson in which she admits to using powdered rhinocerous horn as an alternative medicine:

http://women.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/women/fashion/article7139977.ece?token=null&offset=12&page=2

Anyone else think this should be included? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.130.144.100 (talk) 13:34, 25 June 2010 (UTC)

Damn right it should be included! If her philanthropic work goes in, so should this, and it has now been added! Caissaca (talk) 19:43, 2 July 2010 (UTC)

I am not convinced that it belongs at all, because it was later clarified that this was an unfortunate joke. This article contains more information and the updates that I just did are probably not sufficient to establish the facts fully, but I'll leave it as is for the moment, waiting for others to weigh in.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 09:42, 19 January 2011 (UTC)

Once more, it seems a member of the Macpherson family has a direct line to Mr Wales. WWGB (talk) 10:02, 19 January 2011 (UTC)

What does that mean? Lots of people have a direct line to me, it's called an email address: jwales@wikia.com. You can use it, too.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 11:18, 19 January 2011 (UTC)

"Joked" is Elle's own later statement of clarification. The sources stated don't independently confirm it was a joke. The ABC headline puts it in quotation marks, suggesting they are only willing to attribute it to Elle, not claim it was a joke themselves. So I don't think saying "joke" outside of quotation marks and linking it to the two sources is strictly accurate. How about: "McPherson stated X. She later said it was a joke, and released a brief statement saying..." --Mkativerata (talk) 09:21, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

These were excellent changes, Mkativerata. I made a few more changes, as follows. First, rather than quoting the formal statement released on her behalf, I have quoted her directly from an interview. Second, I moved her claim that it was a joke to the very first bit of this section - lest a careless reader get the wrong impression of how this ended up.

I am now turning my attention to "Animal welfare groups such as IFAW strongly condemned her support of an illegal trade which is hastening the extinction of several rhinoceros species." I don't really doubt that this is true, but the reference given doesn't support it for a number of reasons.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 09:59, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

Looks good. The cited source for that does not seem at all reliable even if it did support the material. In the circumstances (IMO, a "controversy" section in a bio is always asking for trouble) it's not the only statement that needs better sourcing -- perhaps "illegal under CITES" can be taken as common knowledge (although I have no idea), but "has been shown to have no health benefits" sticks out. --Mkativerata (talk) 10:17, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

I've made this edit largely to clarify another important point: that IFAW et al condemned the remarks before she later claimed they were a joke. The sentence I've drafted isn't great ("Before issuing her statement...") but I have to go to bed now. --Mkativerata (talk) 10:32, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

As a side note to judging the severity of the IFAW's concern, I note that a search of their site reveals that they don't even mention her. Presumably a reporter called them for a comment and they said what they said, as opposed to them starting a campaign against her. Or, if they did issue a press release (which I can't find), they may have taken it down after they realized it was just a joke. I am not suggesting any changes at the present time.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 11:23, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

Ok, I think we are getting close. Certainly the event is presented much more fairly now. I think it's time to raise the deeper question: is this even relevant to her biography? It's a relatively minor incident that resulted in no further press. If we believe, as I do, that she made a lame joke and forgot the smiley-face, then the whole thing is just stupid.

The evidence for her having simply made a joke is that she was already an animal rights campaigner even before this all started. There is little in her career or values that would suggest that she really meant it. If Jon Stewart or Stephen Colbert had said it, we'd understand that right away.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 11:16, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

Another option we have is to merge a brief mention of it into the "Humanitarian and philanthropic work" section of the article (perhaps with a different section title). Once we have a separate "controversy" section it's hard to keep it under control. It does put too much weight on an incident that, according to my search of google news archives, didn't get any ongoing coverage. --Mkativerata (talk) 17:51, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

I've now had the time to do some research and work on some words: see a userspace draft here. The interesting thing is that the article makes no mention of a controversy that received a fair bit more attention: Macpherson starting to model in fur despite earlier campaigning against it. The draft I've done tries to achieve some balance: outlining her extensive philanthropic work but also mentioning the animal rights "issues" and also her statements and actions to further animal rights causes. --Mkativerata (talk) 19:38, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

Just performed this edit to carry out the above. --Mkativerata (talk) 19:08, 22 January 2011 (UTC)

Contradicting years of birth

This article gives her year of birth as 1963 in the lede but 1964 in the caption box. Manning (talk) 19:22, 8 March 2011 (UTC)

Edit request on 26 August 2012

Alejogeovanny (talk) 11:51, 26 August 2012 (UTC) There are two birth date for Elle Macpherson. You must specify which one is the right date: 29 March 1964, or 29 March 1963. Thanks

Done 1963 is correct. Thanks for catching this. RudolfRed (talk) 19:51, 26 August 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 19 April 2013

Elle MacPherson is born on 29 March 1963. Therefore she said that she's 49 on the 28 March! Why should she otherwise say that she's 49 the day before her 50th birthday. The Sun had an article about her on 1 April as well, were she, as a 50 year young beauty queen posed in a bikini. Please fix! 194.255.43.133 (talk) 07:24, 19 April 2013 (UTC)

Not done:. Her Tweet says that she turned 49 in 2013 and that the Sun has her age wrong. RudolfRed (talk) 01:38, 20 April 2013 (UTC)

Note: "her tweet". Quis separabit? 22:00, 7 July 2013 (UTC)

Rudolf the Red knows .... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 211.28.24.49 (talk) 05:57, 31 May 2013 (UTC)

She's remarried ...

The Elle_Macpherson (this page) page is way out of date. She married someone else in the last few days. Can someone fix / update / correct the page please? Arpad Busson is sooooo 2009...

http://www.smh.com.au/national/elle-macpherson-marries-in-fiji-20130804-2r6yy.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by Noasshats (talk • contribs) 23:58, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

An editor has added the info. --NeilN ^{talk to me} 00:51, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Now she is getting a divorce. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-4616344/Elle-Macpherson-reportedly-earns-79million-divorce.html

122.108.156.100 (talk) 14:20, 19 June 2017 (UTC)

"sirens" should be a link

Shouldn't the first reference to the 1994 film Sirens be a link to Sirens_(1994_film)? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.78.228.100 (talk) 23:19, 24 November 2013 (UTC)

It is. In the "Rise to fame as model" section. --NeilN ^{talk to me} 23:23, 24 November 2013 (UTC)

Name change

It is not correct that "a clerical mistake in registering at her new school meant that her surname was changed from Gow to Macpherson". Schools record the name they are given. School records are not a formal recognition of legal name. The school could have known her as Elle Gaddhaffi - that does not mean that her name was changed from Gow to Gaddhaffi!Royalcourtier (talk) 00:29, 6 January 2016 (UTC)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 8 external links on Elle Macpherson. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20131219050145/http://www.thebiographychannel.co.uk/biographies/elle-macpherson.html to http://www.thebiographychannel.co.uk/biographies/elle-macpherson.html
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20091016135713/http://www.lifelounge.com/elle-macpherson-tab-commercial.aspx to http://www.lifelounge.com/Elle-Macpherson-Tab-Commercial.aspx
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20150617190228/http://biotherm.com.my:80/about-biotherm to http://www.biotherm.com.my/about-biotherm
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20121011202148/http://www.look.co.uk/fashion/elle-macpherson-closes-the-louis-vuitton-2010-show to http://www.look.co.uk/fashion/elle-macpherson-closes-the-louis-vuitton-2010-show
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20150721132144/https://www.welleco.com/about-welleco/ to https://www.welleco.com/about-welleco/
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090816083604/http://cwtv.com:80/shows/the-beautiful-life/cast to http://www.cwtv.com/shows/the-beautiful-life/cast
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20100902172327/http://www.theglobalfund.org:80/en/privatesector/red/?lang=en to http://www.theglobalfund.org/en/privatesector/red/?lang=en
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20130808082606/http://au.lifestyle.yahoo.com:80/who/article/-/18363434/elle-macpherson-marries-jeffrey-soffer/ to http://au.lifestyle.yahoo.com/who/article/-/18363434/elle-macpherson-marries-jeffrey-soffer/

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true or failed to let others know (documentation at {{Sourcecheck}}).

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

• If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
• If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 23:34, 22 December 2016 (UTC)

Height in metres?

Since When? Next we'll be listing football players' weight as 0.113 tonnes.--45.72.141.216 (talk) 02:04, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 5 external links on Elle Macpherson. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

• Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.biotherm.com.my/about-biotherm
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20120530002153/http://www.glamourmagazine.co.uk/celebrity/celebrity-news/2005/06/08/women-of-the-year-winners to http://www.glamourmagazine.co.uk/celebrity/celebrity-news/2005/06/08/women-of-the-year-winners
• Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.cwtv.com/shows/the-beautiful-life/cast
• Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.theglobalfund.org/en/privatesector/red/?lang=en
• Corrected formatting/usage for http://au.lifestyle.yahoo.com/who/article/-/18363434/elle-macpherson-marries-jeffrey-soffer/

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

• If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
• If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 16:33, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 3 external links on Elle Macpherson. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20100707234814/http://www.vogue.co.uk/news/daily/100702-elle-macphersons-wanted-to-be-a-la.aspx to http://www.vogue.co.uk/news/daily/100702-elle-macphersons-wanted-to-be-a-la.aspx
• Added archive https://archive.is/20120910023937/http://www.nacoa.org.uk/about.htm to http://www.nacoa.org.uk/about.htm
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20060624065736/http://www.ginnydougary.co.uk/2005/11/23/the-essence-of-elle-la-belle/ to http://www.ginnydougary.co.uk/2005/11/23/the-essence-of-elle-la-belle/

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

• If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
• If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 18:37, 19 September 2017 (UTC)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified one external link on Elle Macpherson. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20120621162455/http://www.everywoman.com/ewawards/finalists to http://www.everywoman.com/ewawards/finalists

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

• If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
• If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 08:41, 9 December 2017 (UTC)

External links modified (January 2018)

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified one external link on Elle Macpherson. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20071024111354/http://harpersbazaar.com.au/Fame/2007-10-1_Fame_Celebrity+secrets_Elle+Macpherson.htm to http://www.harpersbazaar.com.au/Fame/2007-10-1_Fame_Celebrity+secrets_Elle+Macpherson.htm

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

• If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
• If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 07:48, 21 January 2018 (UTC)

Andrew Wakefield

Doesn't mention relationship with Andrew Wakefield 2A02:AA16:5681:F00:8858:88D4:4E2A:F156 (talk) 15:19, 23 January 2022 (UTC)

Any mention of it keeps getting removed, even if the sources are exactly the same ones that appear in the Wakefield article. Claidheamhmor (talk) 06:03, 24 January 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 1 July 2023

Include Andrew Wakefield in list of partners info box between 2017-2019. This information has been added and removed several times by paid editors from her agency Kruger Cowne. User Karkius11 is likely one of them as their only edits have been adding agency information to celebrities represented by Kruger Cowne and removing this information from MacPhersons page who is also represented by Kruger Cowne.

This information also appears in the section 'personal life' but is missing from her info box. GrandmaPoss (talk) 01:58, 1 July 2023 (UTC)

Several other of her partners are missing from the info box as well, including two to whom she was married. I assume Busson is in the infobox because he's the only one with whom she has children. What do you think, @WWGB? Xan747 (talk) 01:26, 2 July 2023 (UTC)

"Spouse" is a separate field in the infobox where her husbands are listed. "Partner" refers to live-in non-marital guys, not every boyfriend. If she shacked-up with Wakefield then he should be listed. WWGB (talk) 04:17, 2 July 2023 (UTC)

 Not done: Just 'dating' is not necessarily a reason for it to be added into the infobox. A number of references support this in the Personal Life section, but that is probably all that needs to be said. Mattdaviesfsic (talk) 05:52, 2 July 2023 (UTC)

Mixed up with Christie Brinkley

The relationship part first paragraph is wrong. Billy Joel was married to Christie Brinkley and never was with Elle. Brinkley was in the music video for uptown girl 99.167.205.211 (talk) 13:30, 15 September 2023 (UTC)