Talk:Eran

Requested move 11 May 2017

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Not moved per consensus. (non-admin closure) - Yashovardhan (talk) 16:26, 21 May 2017 (UTC)

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Eran → Eran, India – There are many Erans on wikipedia. They should have a dab page. This therefore needs a more specific name. Can someone do the honors? Thank you. 2604:2000:E016:A700:B854:4D4B:5962:765D (talk) 12:30, 11 May 2017 (UTC)

Oppose Create a separate Eran_(given name) index page or a disambiguation page instead and mention it in a hat-tip here.--Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 12:51, 11 May 2017 (UTC)

Hi. A couple of things. First, it would not solve matters to create a "given name" page. As you can see in the "many Erans" link, not all of them are given-name Erans. See, for example ERAN and Ērān and the province Eran-Khwarrah-Yazdegerd and the movie Eran trecento.

Second, I agree there should be a dab page for Eran, listing all of these. But it does not seem as though this geographical Eran (distinct, for example, from the Iranian geographical Eran), is the "common name" of Eran. Quite the opposite -- the other Erans in aggregate are searched for many more times.

Plus, it is normal in geographical names such as these to list the country in the title. See WP:PLACE -- "It is often the case that the same widely accepted English name will apply to more than one place, or to a place and to other things; in either case disambiguation will be necessary... In some cases, the article title should include additional text, such as a country name or province name, for example, Paris, Maine or Red River (Victoria). The additional text is called a disambiguation tag. The disambiguation tag provides context to the reader, and helps uniquely identify places when multiple places share the same name." But, per that guideline, I guess since this is in India, it is better to retitle it "Eran (Madhya Pradesh)".--2604:2000:E016:A700:9517:3B4D:B22F:5197 (talk) 19:55, 11 May 2017 (UTC)

None of those are an exact match for Eran. The other Erans are largely partial matches or redirects. The relatively uncommon given name Eran is the only serious contender, but is not a primary topic and only warrants an index article. See Iran, Paris, Hawaii, etc. for examples of how this usually handled.--Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 09:27, 12 May 2017 (UTC)

• Oppose. No evidence that either of the Erans on the ERAN dab page or any of the people named Eran, or their combination, displace this Eran as the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC. That said, there should be an Eran (given name) page as well as hatnotes to it and the dab page at Eran. --В²C ☎ 00:57, 12 May 2017 (UTC)

If, as suggested at the primary topics guideline, you check using one of the tools suggested -- Wikipedia article traffic statistics, you will see that -- not only are there two dozen(?) other Erans, but this one is not even the one with the plurality of the searches (let alone the majority of the searches. See here. And that's with the skewing caused by readers who are looking for the other Erans ending up on this page by accident - it is still of interest to a minority of readers searching the Erans. 2604:2000:E016:A700:4494:BEC0:88F7:4C3D (talk) 04:49, 12 May 2017 (UTC)

Page views are useful when the page in question is likely to be sought with the term in question. Are people searching with "eran" likely to be looking for articles about people named Eran? I don't look for John F Kennedy by searching with "John". --В²C ☎ 05:42, 12 May 2017 (UTC)

If I'm looking for people named Eran, I search Eran. If I'm looking for Eran in Iran I may look for "Ērān Iran," and if I'm looking for Eran in India I move search for "Eran, India" or for the province Eran-Khwarrah-Yazdegerd. Or for the movie Eran trecento. In all cases I may search for just Eran, or I may add (either a surname or more specific location). Most Erans on wp are people, but as pointed out above, there are a number that are locations or abbreviations, etc.

Finally -- as to your example. "John" brings us to a dab page for John. Which includes people named John. Not, as your approach would suggest, to the song "John". So .. your example does not hold. 2604:2000:E016:A700:4494:BEC0:88F7:4C3D (talk) 06:03, 12 May 2017 (UTC)

• Comment. The strongest candidate for dislodging the ancient Indian city from the primary topic position is probably Eran, the Middle Persian name for Iran (suitable articles to link to are Greater Iran and Iran (word)). – Uanfala (talk) 01:45, 18 May 2017 (UTC)

• Oppose per WP:PRIMARYTOPIC, i.e. this is it. The other uses are partial title matches. Furthermore, the format "Eran, India" implies a modern settlement. —  AjaxSmack  00:07, 21 May 2017 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Explaining edits & the removal of copyvio

Much in this article was a copyvio of Chadhar. I do not see OTRS ticket. Even if we had an OTRS, there are serious WP:RS issues. All WP:SPS are a questionable source. I can't find any mainstream or non-mainstream scholar citing Chadar. It makes sweeping claims about "earliest Sati pillars". Sati is a topic studied by numerous scholars, and is much debated. Chadar's sweeping claims are WP:FRINGE (see reviews by Alex Michaels and David Brick, e.g.). We need better multiple peer-reviewed sources for exceptional claims. Even Eran is an important archaeological site with many publications, which this article should try to summarize. Ms Sarah Welch (talk) 02:09, 11 December 2017 (UTC)