Talk:Feijoada

History of feijoada

I just included some factual information last night and someone erased it. Don't know why, but anyway - I am not Brazilian, but I am somewhat familiar with the culture as a few of my friends are. I'm also a [Capoeirista]. This information doesn't make complete sense to me. Please provide a source to clarify. For example, slaves ate nothing but rice and whatever scrap/unwanted parts of animals left-over from the slaveholders pickings. Last night I added in some info to show the connection between Brazilian feijoada and [Hoppin John] in the United States. I consider myself a great source because I eat both dishes on several occations. I'll include it again below. Muito axe pra voce...--70.220.247.144 (talk) 01:22, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

• Feijoada is almost identical in taste to Black-Eyed Peas and Rice cooked with Ham Hock or other pig parts, which is popular among the slave states of the southern United States. It is strongly believed that this dish came to the U.S. through South Carolina by way of West Africa. In South Carolina this dish is referred to as Hoppin John or "Hopping John." Other places in the U.S. (and Caribbean) simply refer to it as peas and rice. This dish is also eaten with collard greens in both Brazil and in the United States. It is a long-time tradition in the African-American community to eat this meal on New Years Day.

The story of feijoada told here is just myth. It has been long stabilished that feijoada descends from french cassoulet, and it was slaveholders' stuff, while slaves were fed mostly carbohidrates which gave them energy to work but were otherwise poor nutrition, this being one of the causes of high slave mortality.

So I will rewrite the thing.

I`ve never heard that Feijoada is a directly descended from cassoulet (I`m brazilian and currently living in Brazil), although it would be logical. Indeed, I`ve read in many diferent sources that Feijoada came to be as a food from slaves, so if Leandrod (the author of above post) could please provide a reference (internet or otherwise) of where it`s proves that feijoada came from cassoulet, it would be appreciated.--Vertigo200 15:57, 19 May 2005 (UTC)

I agree with you. The act to joint pieces of animals was praticed in many parts of the world, especially at times of hunger. In northwest of Brazil has variations of these, made with parts of Goat and Bovid (recipe names: Buchada, Sarapatel). Feijoada is really one of most simply of the techinic aplied by men in certain times. --Mateusc 20:21, 2 August 2005 (UTC)

I'm not convinced. Most regions in portugal have their own variants of feijoada, based upon the ingredients popular in that region. It's much more likely that it's based on the portuguese dishes than on a french dish. -- ascorbic 15:37, 20 May 2005 (UTC)

Ok, thanks for the link. I only made a slight alteration, since the author himself admits that it's the most likely thesis, but that one can't be 100% certain (which the text seemed to implie). I think you'll be happy with the changes.--Vertigo200 02:41, 23 May 2005 (UTC)

• Cassoulet is very different from feijoada. The taste is completely different, the preparation etc, the common feature are the beans, but a completely different dish. I'll remove that sencente. It is not the first time that leandro hads the most remarkable and bright sentences that he heard here and there or create in his mind. --Pedro 28 June 2005 11:55 (UTC)
• Actually, Leandrod had provided a link on his personal discussion page, but strangely his personal page has disapeared with the link. Still, a quick search on the net found me this [1] (Terra is a reliable site, since it is a large ISP here in Brasil, second only to UOL) where it clearly states that the real origin of feijoada could be the "mithical" version, portuguese influence or the Cassoulet. I'm thus incorporating all these and stating that real origin is unknown.--Vertigo200 28 June 2005 18:23 (UTC)

• The cassoulet is very differently prepared, even the looks is completely different. And if it was inspired why doesnt the Portuguese feijoadas use the salsicha (i don't know the name in English), the salsichas are very common in Portugal, but are not used in feijoadas, but are in cassoulets, most ingredients of cassoulet exist in Portugal naturally, but arent used. Terra is so reliable that created a inexistent region in Portugal: "Estremaduram di Alto Douro" - this is probably on planet Mars, I believe. There is an Estremadura region and the Alto Douro Region. I don't know where it came from, but the cassoulet doesnt seem to me reliable. If you find more links confirming that, it would be better. --Pedro 22:42, 31 August 2005 (UTC)

I am the person who wrote that Brazilian Feijoada comes from the European, and most likely Portuguese, cuisine. The slave origin of feijoada is as myth, although the belief is very strongly held among almost every Brazilian (by the way, I am Brazilian myself). Obviously no one can tell EXACTLY where the dish comes from, but is is most likely from European origin; and since Brazil was mostly colonised by the Portuguese, the dish is most likely derived from Portuguese cozidos than from the French cassoulet. Here are a few websites (some from Brazilian chefs) that state that the feijoada is of European/Portuguese origin (unfortunately the sites are all in Portuguese): [2], [3], [4], [5], [6]. Fsouza (talk) 02:13, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

Nobody knows with certainty the origin of the feijoada. There are legends that feijoada has portuguese origin and there are legends that it originated in Brazil in brazilian slaves (of african origins). But the fact is that in every article of wikipedia, in all languages, feijoada is presented as brazilian dish. Only english wikipedia presented feijoada as portuguese dish. Feijoadas types exist in many countries around the world, but the typical FEIJOADA, with black beans, is brazilian. In the wikipedia in "portuguese", a language spoken in Portugal and Brazil, FEIJOADA is a brazilian dish and brazilian cuisine. Only "feijoada à transmontana" is from Portugal. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.226.141.25 (talk) 10:52, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

1. New discussions go at the bottom, putting them at the top makes you look more like a peacock than you already do.
2. Sign your posts, it makes you look uneducated when you don't.
3. We capitalize proper nouns and demonyms in English, it makes you look uneducated when you don't.--Chris (クリス • フィッチ) (talk) 13:49, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

Portuguese Vs Brazilian

I'll be editing this a bit. I'll try and keep the history part separate, but try to further distanciate the brazilian and portuguese versions. Pedro Pinheiro 01:06, 26 September 2005 (GMT)

I have created separate sections for Brazilian and Portuguese feijoadas. However, I think that they should be two separate articles. I have never tasted Portuguese feijoada, but, judging by the description, there seems to be little in common between the two dishes besides the name and the clay pot. Even the beans are quite different.

you should then before making remarks that pretend that one is diferent form the other in such broad terms. I'm portuguese. I've tasted both. And like they are just like the language.

Describing the two dishes together only makes the article very confusing, especially to a reader who does not know either of them.
It reminds me of a great chapter in Tom Wheeler's Cvtltvre Made Stvpid:

Many people avoid talking about Roger Bacon and Francis Bacon for fear of confusing the two. That fear is unjustified since their lives are basically the same. Francis or Roger Bacon was born in 1214 or 1561, and died on 1626 or 1294. He was a prominent lawyer and Franciscan monk, who spent most of his life at Oxford or London... 8-)

All the best, Jorge Stolfi 23:50, 28 January 2006 (UTC)

• The feijoadas are all different and all the same. Obviously people use that they find on their region, Brazilian feijoada is not that different from the Portuguese one, in fact I Find Feijoada Transmontana more different, in looks and taste, from Feijoada poveira than Poveira with Brazilian, but maybe because i dont like some ingredients of Transmontana, although this is probably the most popular feijoada around. But it is also very different. The African is also different from any of these. The dish feijoada is like that in fact, one gathers what they have to eat in the kitchen. There's no Portuguese feijoada, there are regional dishes, there are other dishes such as Tripas which in fact, are a different dish, it even as a different name. The cassoulet thing, this idea, etc. make this article not reliable as editors are editing by pure speculation. In fact, even Africa was putted in Portugal, these are independent countries, although still exceptionally linked with Portugal. -Pedro 11:08, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

Angolan feijoada

Question: Is the feijoada of Angola and T&P closer to the Brazilian one, or to the North Portugal one? Jorge Stolfi 23:53, 28 January 2006 (UTC)

• Also different. San Tomeans put fish! -Pedro 10:58, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

Where is a sample recipe?

I came to this page from a link on a list of Brazilian foods and I see a section here labeled "Recipe" - but it is really just a description of some of the ingredients. Is there somewhere in Wikipedia or an external link that has an actual recipe - a set of instructions so I could try this dish (I don't think I'll find it in a restuarant in Phoenix, Arizona. Best Wishes, Steve 21:17, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

If you are curious, here's the Portuguese Feijoada recipe: http://www.saveur.com/article/Recipes/Feijoada-Completa-1000059067 Pedro Vaz (talk) 09:43, 12 December 2010 (UTC)

here's a source [Feijoada Cultura Brasileira ]which has a little more of the history of feijoada and has also revenue.

Pronouciation

How do you pronounce it?Other dictionaries are better (talk) 21:56, 19 May 2011 (UTC)

It's pronounced 'fezh-WAH-dah'. — Preceding unsigned comment added by WillJohn68 (talk • contribs) 13:00, 6 September 2011 (UTC)

Roman origin seems irrelevant

And frankly, a stretch; I find it hard to accept that Romans have some sort of claim on the concept/dish of 'pork cooked with vegetables', as it seems like it'd cover vast swathes of global cuisine, even that of cultures that had little recorded contact with the Romans (the Chinese). Past that, I don't agree that the lineage can be traced so clearly; the Romans didn't have beans, and feijoada is a bean and pork dish. Does it trace its lineage through pork dishes or bean dishes? So I'd like to edit this section down and remove what seems like an aside about the Romans. Obonicus (talk) 17:22, 31 January 2017 (UTC)

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Served With

I have made feijoada several times and I have even made carne seca for it. Isn't farofa always served with it? It's nearly impossible for me to find where I live so I have looked into making it myself (not really info or easy). I think oranges and couve mineira (Brazilian collard greens are nearly always served along side. I will let an expert change the text of the article.

References needed

I am surprised at how badly this important article is in need of references. Most of the content is fine but this deficiency needs to be addressed to meet Wikipedia's source standards. Some of it is found in the sources already referenced but the references aren't invoked everywhere they should be. I will be putting some effort towards addressing this in the coming weeks.Gustav Benedictis (talk)

Feijoada Compleada - Song

Chico Buarque, a notable Brazilian singer/songwriter, has a 1978 song "Feijoada Completa" that's about the preparation of the dish. I'm not too well-versed in the editing of articles, but might this be a relevant addition to the "in popular culture" section? 50.203.178.234 (talk) 21:16, 25 April 2022 (UTC)

Thanks for the suggestion. I've added a line on the song, feel free to expand it! SailingInABathTub (talk) 22:44, 25 April 2022 (UTC)

Origin of Feijoada

"(...) feijoada is a national dish rooted in a Portuguese recipe of beans and meat. The African slaves adapted this dish by adding manioc flour and replacing beef with less costly cuts of pork available to them..." Page 154 of the stated reference.

How is this not what it says on the source? It's painfully obvious that Brazilian feijoada was adapted from Portuguese feijoada. Thus it makes no sense for the article to state that feijoada originated in Brazil, especially when it's very source states the opposite. The fact that I am banned from editing the page is a crazy powertrip. User:Ohnoitsjamie what you are doing here is called cultural appropriation. If you want to make an article specifically about Brazilian feijoada, that is fine. But don't say that feijoada as a whole originated in Brazil. Wikipedia is supposed to be about facts.

FeijoadaOriginatedInPortugal (talk) 21:53, 26 May 2022 (UTC)User:FeijoadaOriginatedInPortugal

You're fortunate that I only banned you from editing one page. Further disruption or personal attacks will result in a full block. The current source does not say that that the dish originated in Portugal; it says that Portugal introduced beans to Brazil. OhNoitsJamie ^Talk 22:28, 26 May 2022 (UTC)

With all due respect, you are completely out of you depth here. Beans are native to South America. How can the reference possibly state that Portugal introduced beans to Brazil when they are native to the region?

Furthermore, the source is very clear. It mentioned a Portuguese recipe of beans and meat. And it explicitely mentions that this recipe was adapted by African slaves. The source is very clear. I am asking you to be reasonable. At the asbolute very least you would have to mark the origin of the dish as being disputed. You can't reasonably say that the source indicates the dish as having originated in Brazil once you understand what I am saying. FeijoadaOriginatedInPortugal (talk) 22:57, 26 May 2022 (UTC)

Until you can produce sufficient reliable sources that say explicitly that Feijoada originated in Portugal, there's nothing more to discuss. OhNoitsJamie ^Talk 23:04, 26 May 2022 (UTC)

"Primeiro, vale salientar que as raízes da feijoada estão além do Oceano Atlântico. A Europa já conhecia e consumia uma variedade de feijão. Já o emprego da palavra deve-se aos portugueses, “[...] escrita pela primeira vez, em Portugal, no século XIII. ”"

"First, it is worth noting that the roots of feijoada lie beyond the Atlantic Ocean. Europe already knew and consumed a variety of beans. Already the employment of the word is due to the Portuguese, "[...] first written, in Portugal, in the 13th century." (translated by DeepL)

Source: https://periodicos.ufrn.br/mneme/article/view/6210/5824 FeijoadaOriginatedInPortugal (talk) 23:21, 26 May 2022 (UTC)

That simply says it has roots in Portugal, which is not the same thing as originating in Portugal. OhNoitsJamie ^Talk 23:38, 26 May 2022 (UTC)

So you're telling me it's a coincidence that Portugal has a beans and meat dish called feijoada and that Brazilian feijoada is rooted in a Portuguese dish consisting of beans and meat? You're telling me this Portuguese beans and meat dish that is the origin of Brazilian feijoada is completely separate from Portuguese feijoada?

You asked for a reliable source and I gave you one. Both texts are clear as day. Have a good one. FeijoadaOriginatedInPortugal (talk) 23:58, 26 May 2022 (UTC)

Move discussion in progress

There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Feijoada (Brazilian dish) which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 17:38, 27 February 2024 (UTC)