Talk:Giallo

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Some discussion relevant to this topic has been had at the nomination of this article for Cinema Collaboration of the Week. You can see that discussion here.

Introduction

I am having doubts on my introduction to the giallo genre. Is giallo related to horror, or the French Fantastique?

from the intro:

Giallo is an Italian 20th century genre of literature and film. It is closely related to the French fantastique genre, crime fiction, horror fiction and eroticism.

This section

I toni e le atmosfere del romanzo giallo si possono, poi ritrovare in vari generi letterari differenti, iniziando dalla letteratura gotica, di cui grandi interpreti sono Mary Shelley con il suo Frankenstein e Bram Stoker che ha interpretato in chiave romanzata la vita di Vlad III, trasformandolo in vampiro. D'altra parte sia Poe, sia Conan Doyle, i padri del genere, si sono prodigati in romanzi e racconti del terrore, contribuendo anche alla letteratura horror: uno dei suoi più grandi interpreti del nostro tempo, Stephen King, ha imparato la lezione della suspense che così tanti autori del giallo hanno sviluppato nel corso di questi due ultimi secoli.

seems to confirm the link with horror

--Jahsonic, Jul 18

English whodunits

It also needs to be said that the early period of giallo novels were mainly translations of mainly English whodunits. (see bibliography in links section)

--Jahsonic, Jul 18

• i looked but only saw Robert Louis Stevenson and A.A. Milne as (known) english language authors? dont forget the italian authors used english-name pseudonyms.

• Aren't the original titles listed on the right-hand side of the page (see http://www.lfb.it/fff/giallo/mondador/1929-1941.htm) ?

SS Van Dine is real, Edgar Wallace too, have not checked the rest.

--Jahsonic, Jul 18

Poe influence

I notice it mentions one film that was based on Poe. I know Poe had a good deal of influence on detective stories in general, but was there a special Poe influence on these films? Jztinfinity 16:40, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

simply that both poe and giallo feature strong psychological themes of madness, alienation, and paranoia.Zzzzz 09:49, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

Feminist issues

Can we discuss other social issues like the whole misogynistic parts of the movie (see oneself as a killer stabbing knives into vaginas in "what have you done to solange," for instance?) i think this would fit with characteristics

only if there is a reliable secondary source that discusses it. Zzzzz 10:17, 6 August 2006 (UTC)

A number of giallos have strong female characters or killers who are women. But yeah, Zzzzz has it right. Шизомби 15:33, 20 November 2006 (UTC)

Notable giallo films

What criteria are being used to determine notability? Шизомби 15:33, 20 November 2006 (UTC)

I removed Black Sunday, Suspiria, and Stage Fright, because they are in no way Giallos. Italian horror films? Yes. Giallos? No.71.206.172.134 02:27, 21 August 2007 (UTC)

Agreed, and thank you for tidying that up. Monkey Bounce 06:59, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

Once again, Black Sabbath and Black Sunday are NOT giallos. Monkey Bounce (talk) 10:23, 16 January 2008 (UTC)

I agree, Black Sabbath and Black Sunday are not giallos. I agree Suspiria is not one either, being a supernatural film about witches, though it has elements of the giallo. Stage Fright could be considered one, though it's perhaps better described simply as a slasher (Michele Soavi's one anyway). But again, what crtieria are being used to determine notability? Шизомби (talk) 13:01, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

I've removed the following films: Twitch of the Death Nerve, Camping Del Terrore, The New York Ripper, Deliria and Opera - they are all horror/slasher films completely unconnected with giallo and don't even have a murder-mystery element to them, which is one of the basic prerequisites of the genre. Ramore —Preceding undated comment added 02:12, 22 June 2009 (UTC).

I disagree with you on at least some of those. My giallo reference is in storage at the moment though, when I can get to it, I'll elaborate. Шизомби (talk) 03:18, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

Yeah, I also disagree. Some gialli may also be slasher films for example, but they remain gialli. Let's take New York Ripper for example. Above all, it certainly isn't a horror movie. Then it's about an anonymous killer stabbing women in a city, and about a policeman investigating the murders. Plus gore and sex. Made by an Italian director with giallo roots. Thus, I'd call New York Ripper a giallo, although a quite late example of a genre that had it's peak between 1970 and 1975. The setting in a foreign city is not untypical. Sergio Martino's Lo strano vizio della Signora Wardh for example is set in Vienna, Austria. Other cities who served as locations for gialli were London or Athens. --Catgut (talk) 10:02, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

Turkish giallos

The focus in this article is on Italian productions, and rightly so. But Turkey released a number of contemporaneous, and sometimes copy-cat, giallos. If there is a general consensus that they should be mentioned, I can cobble together a paragraph or so to outline them. Monkey Bounce 07:02, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

That would be interesting. Шизомби (talk) 13:09, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Chimage.jpg

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BetacommandBot 02:35, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

There is a fundamental problem with this article

Giallo is an Italian word. In Italy, it is used to refer to crime and suspense films and literature of any origin and time period---not just domestic films from the 60s and 70s that feature killers wearing black gloves. That is, to give just a few examples, the novels of Agatha Christie and the film Se7en are giallo in the Italian sense. The Italian Wikipedia entry that corresponds to this one, found at [1], should make this clear.

It is, of course, idiotic to use the word giallo in the sense of the current article. It is like using the English word thriller to refer only to Hitchcock movies. It is particularly sad to see this foolishness perpetuated in Wikipedia. Nevertheless, there are, of course, non-Italians who use the word giallo in this wrong-headed fashion. But the article, if it must exist at all, should then be rather about this phenomenon---the incorrect usage of the word giallo---and not about Italian suspense thrillers from a certain time period.

Oh, and the same goes for the use of the word krimi for the German Edgar Wallace films, of course.--Baphomet V (talk) 21:05, 6 July 2008 (UTC)

I see no problem, no wrong-headedness. There are plenty of words which have meanings different than their original meaning. Шизомби (talk) 12:48, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

Oh, to be sure. But here the Italian word giallo is used to refer to a type of specifically Italian film. Italians do not use the word giallo to refer specifically to these Italian films. Are the Italians wrong, then, in their understanding of how the word should be used, and the genre defined?

It is to be noted that the article starts out by explaining how giallo came to take on the meaning it has in Italy---because a prominent series of crime novels was published in yellow covers. But nowhere is it explained where the extremely narrow understanding of the term that the article really deals with comes from, and why it should be taken seriously. These particular thrillers, but not others, are called gialli, we learn from the article. But by whom are they called that---certainly not by Italians---and why?--Baphomet V (talk) 00:23, 8 July 2008 (UTC)

Those are good questions that the article should address, I agree with you there. Шизомби (talk) 01:11, 8 July 2008 (UTC)

You are right in the sense of that Wikipedia in an encyclopedia that has to be very clear about the usage of a word and its origins. However, it would be far-fetched to question the right of this page to exist since there are many-many countries where the word "giallo" has a meaning different from the Italian one (even if it is not a well-defined one - but why should it be? there is hardly a genre that has 100% punctual "borderlines" and no debates over which movies are part of that genre), and for these many countries, such an expression is meaningful and real. So in my opinion mentioning this difference in the usage of the word in the article suffices. Virtualdog (talk) 10:49, 23 Aug 2010 (UTC)

WorldCat Genres

Hello, I'm working with OCLC, and we are algorithmically generating data about different Genres, like notable Authors, Book, Movies, Subjects, Characters and Places. We have determined that this Wikipedia page has a close affintity to our detected Genere of mystery-fiction. It might be useful to look at [2] for more information. Thanks. Maximilianklein (talk) 23:41, 5 December 2012 (UTC)

Don't Look Now??? Comment

Wouldn't Nicholas Roeg's 1973 movie be considered an upscale giallo-type thriller??? It is primarily set in Venice.User:JCHeverly 16:04, 2 November 2013 (UTC)

It's not down to us to say that a film is or isn't part of a genre; but if a reliable site like Allrovi or the BFI were to class it as such then sure, add away. GRAPPLE X 18:26, 2 November 2013 (UTC)

• Will do some research on that as time permits and will either make an edit or not. Thanks for the input.User:JCHeverly 03:33, 5 November 2013 (UTC)
• Although, "Don't Look Now" is a thriller set amongst the eerie Venetian canals and begins with the death of child and ends with a cold-blooded murder, it is not in the tradition of the giallo as it is NOT based on lurid pulp fiction. It is from a short story by Daphne Du Maurier, which would make it "middle-brow"???User:JCHeverly 20:40, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

Italian Connotation

Actually in italy "giallo" is simply the term for murder mystery novels, with no particular correlation with horror, classic english whodunits sherlock holmes style being the stereotype. It is true that italian murder mystery novels often have horror elements or are otherwise very gory, which I guess must have given this perception overseas. The term comes from the the publication -initially monthly and later bi-weekly- "Il Giallo Mondadori" that had a yellow cover, to distinguish it fromordinary, mainstream books of the same publishing house, and initially only published classic english whudunits -most of agatha christie was published in early numbers, for example - later it started to accept more and more italian novels of the same genre - murder mystery - that were often gory and sometimes had horror or supernatural elements. "giallo", in Italy, is just the common, italian name for murder mystery novels, it doesn't indicate a separate "italian" genre, classic english murder mystery novels are considered "gialli", although I understand that for english-speaking countries it instead indicates 20th century italian-style murder mysteries. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.202.107.20 (talk) 11:32, 16 May 2016 (UTC)

True. Barjimoa (talk) 17:20, 7 December 2019 (UTC)

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Removed film from list

I've removed a film by Piero Regnoli from the list. The source next to it said nothing about it being part of the genre (specifically just "Ti Aspettero all'Inferno (1960, Verdstella Film). One of the first dramatic films with thriller elements, it helped pave the way for the Italian horror movie.""). Not exactly winning evidence. Andrzejbanas (talk) 18:17, 11 May 2020 (UTC)

Please do not add films that happen to be Italian that are just referred to as thrillers or even "dramatic films with thriller elements"| that's barely enough to qualify them a thriller let alone a giallo. I state this following WP:STICKTOSOURCE. Andrzejbanas (talk) 16:51, 14 May 2020 (UTC)