Talk:Honeynut squash

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Cwmhiraeth (talk) 06:23, 16 September 2019 (UTC)

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• Article history

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Whole honeynut squash

• ... that although honeynut squash (pictured) originated about forty years ago, it has only been in markets for four years? Source: Specialty Produce
  • ALT1:... that honeynut squash (pictured) is a cultivated miniature butternut squash? Source: Bon Appétit

• Reviewed: Capture of Wakefield

Created by Ɱ (talk). Self-nominated at 17:01, 5 September 2019 (UTC).

• Starting review --valereee (talk) 14:51, 15 September 2019 (UTC)

General: Article is new enough and long enough
New enough: Long enough:

Policy: Article is sourced, neutral, and free of copyright problems
Adequate sourcing: Neutral: Free of copyright violations, plagiarism, and close paraphrasing:

Hook: Hook has been verified by provided inline citation
Cited: Interesting:

Image: Image is freely licensed, used in the article, and clear at 100px.
Freely licensed: Used in article: Clear at 100px:

QPQ: Done.

Overall: valereee (talk) 14:51, 15 September 2019 (UTC)

• ALT 10 sourced and interesting. --valereee (talk)

• ALT 21: I think since the article says it's a cross between butternut squash and buttercup squash, we need a sourced statement in the article to call it a miniature version of butternut? (Or am I missing that already explicitly there and sourced?) Also I'm wondering if we might want to point out that it's a sweeter version, as that might make this hook more interesting to a broad audience. --valereee (talk) 15:20, 15 September 2019 (UTC)

• Pic: MJ, I see these are your own photos. I don't suppose you took one next to a regular butternut? They really are very different and seen beside one another, clearly not simply a smallish butternut. Might be a more interesting pic? --valereee (talk) 15:23, 15 September 2019 (UTC)

We could just go with Alt 1. Most of the popular sources covering the squash refer to it as a 'miniature butternut', a term I don't use in the article to be more formal, but I explain that it is bred to be a smaller alternative. We could just go with Alt 1; I was just providing an alternative. As for the photo - yeah I took one with a real butternut, but the photo isn't nearly as good, and the only butternut I had was a half-size one anyway, so it's not a good size comparison. Sometime I might redo it with a typical butternut and the honeynut. ɱ (talk) 15:38, 15 September 2019 (UTC)

My bad, we were discussing ALT0 as being sourced and interesting, ALT1 as still needing work. Good to go with ALT0. --valereee (talk) 16:55, 15 September 2019 (UTC)

References

"half" the size?

Are we sure it's "half" the size of a butternut? If it's half the length and half the width, it's likely closer to a quarter the size by weight? Maybe look for average weights for the two? --valereee (talk) 15:48, 15 September 2019 (UTC)

I gave a general figure for the lede, then specifics later on. It is about half the length and width it seems, and in terms of weight I am finding it ranges from .5 to 1.5 lbs, while butternuts range from 1 to 5 lbs, averaging at 2 to 3 lbs. I think there is enough variation, but half to a third of the size would be an accurate estimate. ɱ (talk) 16:14, 15 September 2019 (UTC)

I'll add weight to the article soon. ɱ (talk) 16:15, 15 September 2019 (UTC)

Great article, btw! The squash and the Barber story are ringing a bell for me, probably from his appearance on Chef's Table, but I may have actually written/edited something about it in another article at some point. Wish I had your photography skills, mine are crap. I'm always happy to work on or review food-related stuff, ping me at will! --valereee (talk) 12:20, 16 September 2019 (UTC)

Thank you! I haven't seen his Chef's Table, but perhaps I might now... Thanks about the photography, it's been a ton of trial and error and spending too much... I'll be happy to include you in later food projects; there's more missing than most areas of Wikipedia, not enough people to fix all of it. ɱ (talk) 14:08, 16 September 2019 (UTC)

Yes, not that many people interested in food. Completely inexplicable to me. EVERYBODY EATS. And yet every Australian-rules broomball player with ten minutes in a pro match has an article lol --valereee (talk) 15:02, 16 September 2019 (UTC)

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Honeynut squash/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Ealdgyth (talk · contribs) 20:24, 31 January 2020 (UTC)

I’ll get to this shortly. Ealdgyth - Talk 20:24, 31 January 2020 (UTC)

GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)

1. It is reasonably well written.

   a (prose, spelling, and grammar): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists):

2. It is factually accurate and verifiable.

   a (reference section): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR): d (copyvio and plagiarism):

3. It is broad in its coverage.

   a (major aspects): b (focused):

4. It follows the neutral point of view policy.

   Fair representation without bias:

5. It is stable.

   No edit wars, etc.:

6. It is illustrated by images and other media, where possible and appropriate.

   a (images are tagged and non-free content have fair use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):

7. Overall:

   Pass/Fail:

• General:
  • What makes this site a reliable source?

It's a proper digital magazine, with editors and professional writers. This writer is a nutritionist, and has a master's degree in nutrition. The article is very factual and informative, all content accurate, matching the other sources. ɱ (talk) 17:47, 2 February 2020 (UTC)

• Attributes:
  • "The skin is dark tan to orange, also referred to as a "deep honey color", giving the squash its name, in addition to its sweetness." the "in addition to its sweetness" is tacked on and a bit unclear what its referring to. Can we reword a bit here?

Saying that the skin color gives the squash its name, though its sweetness is also attributed to why "honey" is in the name. Pretty complex thing to say; I don't know any better way. ɱ (talk) 17:47, 2 February 2020 (UTC)

I reworded to "The skin is dark tan to orange, also referred to as a "deep honey color". The color of the skin as well as the sweetness of the flesh is what gives the variety its name."

Alright, thanks! ɱ (talk) 18:01, 10 February 2020 (UTC)

• • "and turns dark tan to orange on the vine in the last few weeks" but we were already told the ripe color above, so this is redundant. Suggest "and turns honey-colored on the vine in the last few weeks" or similar.

Agreed, thanks. ɱ (talk) 18:11, 2 February 2020 (UTC)

• • "The squash average 2.5 to 4 inches wide, and four to five inches in length, as opposed to most butternuts at 10 to 11 inches long." Two things here - you need all numerals here per the MOS, and you really should have conversion templates also for the non-imperial using rest of the planet.

Done, sorry! ɱ (talk) 18:11, 2 February 2020 (UTC)

Nothing to be sorry about! It's hard to remember everything... Ealdgyth - Talk 14:31, 7 February 2020 (UTC)

• • "grow on a restricted vine" I'm a gardener and I have only the vaguest idea what is meant by "restricted vine" ... is this similar to the "determinate" tomato vines (that still take over my garden .... )

This was the term used in the source, and apparently many similar plant breeding sources. I can't seem to find a clear definition, but I'm guessing the vines are pruned so they don't get out of hand, similar to how grapevines are kept so orderly in vineyards. ɱ (talk) 18:11, 2 February 2020 (UTC)

Ha! [https://books.google.com/books?id=6LrTV5hqqJEC&pg=PA93&lpg=PA93&dq=%22restricted+vine%22+gardening&source=bl&ots=RVdCNIH96k&sig=ACfU3U05PMd_btVAZHTIc8zJ14HbbzjoEg&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwijlOv00L_nAhXNZs0KHUcSDn4Q6AEwBXoECAkQAQ#v=onepage&q=%22restricted%20vine%22%20gardening&f=false Google books result shows it basically means "dwarf vine" ... Ealdgyth - Talk 14:31, 7 February 2020 (UTC)

Okay, but then articles like this seem to state that they are pruned and managed to a certain size, which probably also gives them more energy toward bearing fruit (grapes or gourds). ɱ (talk) 18:00, 10 February 2020 (UTC)

• • How do they can? (As much curiosity on my part - hubby is a squash fiend...)

This is such a new variety, I don't think anyone's tried this! I don't see any information on it, unfortunately. ɱ (talk) 18:11, 2 February 2020 (UTC)

• • How do they compare in storage to the butternut variety or other winter squashes? -

Added. ɱ (talk) 19:30, 2 February 2020 (UTC)

• History:
  • "professor emeritus of horticulture" was he emeritus at the time?

Presumably. This is the same way the articles I cited refer to him. I can't find a bio for him. ɱ (talk) 19:34, 2 February 2020 (UTC)

• I randomly googled three phrases and only turned up Wikipedia mirrors. Earwig's tool shows no sign of copyright violation.

I've put the article on hold for seven days to allow folks to address the issues I've brought up. Feel free to contact me on my talk page, or here with any concerns, and let me know one of those places when the issues have been addressed. If I may suggest that you strike out, check mark, or otherwise mark the items I've detailed, that will make it possible for me to see what's been addressed, and you can keep track of what's been done and what still needs to be worked on. Ealdgyth - Talk 15:28, 2 February 2020 (UTC)

Ok, replied to all. ɱ (talk) 19:34, 2 February 2020 (UTC)

Sorry for the delay - got home Tuesday from being out on the road with hubby and promptly got sick. Am feeling better today should be able to pick this back up tomorrow. Ealdgyth - Talk 18:16, 6 February 2020 (UTC)

Sounds good, thanks. Hope you feel good soon! ɱ (talk) 20:38, 6 February 2020 (UTC)

Mostly done ... just two things ... Ealdgyth - Talk 14:31, 7 February 2020 (UTC)

@Ɱ: Sorry to nag... Ealdgyth (talk) 14:42, 10 February 2020 (UTC)

Sorry, let's see... ɱ (talk) 17:51, 10 February 2020 (UTC)

Looks good. Dealing with the paperwork now. Sorry for the delay... still recovering from whatever crud I picked up. --Ealdgyth (talk) 14:42, 19 February 2020 (UTC)