Talk:Ignacy Jan Paderewski

What was that famous speech?

Although his "famous speech" is said to have ignited the Greater Poland Uprising, and this fact is mentioned on both pages, neither says what the speech was about. There are no details on the speech, other then the time and location circumstances, and that it started the revolution. What was the speech about? Obviously, it was an important part of his life and the Greater Poland Uprising. You'd think it woul merit description on at least one of these pages. (I'm in a cranky mood. Sorry) -Monk of the highest order^(t) 01:48, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

Birthplace

He was born in the German Empire, technically -- so how could he have been from a Polish Province if Poland was not a nation at that time? 68.251.69.62 10:09, 27 December 2005 (UTC) In fact he could. Podolia was a province of "Kingdom of Poland", established on Vienna Congress - till 1863 in union with Russian Empire (after 1863 the Kingdom was legally incorporated into Imperial Russia). MWeinz 14:37, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

Technically, where he was born was part of the Austrian Empire. Kuryłówka was part of the province of Podole and that was part of Galicia and Lodomeria. I made the proper changes. Norum 31.07.2006

Regarding the birthplace of Paderewski, this oxymoron prevails because Poland was politically chopped up over the passage of time and new geographical names were imposed. I tell people that my ancestors came from Poland because that's the current name of that area. But technically, they came from the Prussian Empire. My paternal grandfather had a Polish name but was conscripted into the Prussian Army and served from 1885 to 1888. If I were to say "they came from the Prussian Empire" hardly anybody today would comprehend that, except perhaps, a history professor with a Ph.D.

In some respects, this is analogous to Indo-China being divided into four countries and then Siam becoming Thailand.

Musicwriter (talk) 06:04, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Poland WAS a nation - a nation is one's ethnicity, or a people - Poland was not a STATE at the time. Just to be clear.HammerFilmFan (talk) 05:27, 31 July 2017 (UTC)

There seems to be some disagreement about this. As of now, our article says it was in Russia. Slonimsky says Podolia was in "Russian Poland". Grove V says he was born in "Kurylowka, Podolia" without specifying the country, but calls him "a Polish pianist". If in fact Kuryłówka was a part of Russia at the time, the primary name of the town should be the Russian name, in both Cyrillic orthography and English transliteration, and the Polish orthography should appear as an alternative version of this name, not the primary name. JackofOz 02:14, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

His father's occupation

I can't help thinking that the statement "his father was working there as an economist in the local mansion" is a mistranslation. It should probably be accountant or (land) agent/steward. Chicheley 09:18, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

Grove V says his father was "an administrator of very large estates". I'll make the change. JackofOz 02:16, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

I cleaned up this article yesterday, especially passive constructions like "was an administrator", then on my way home searched on my phone and learned the current Encyclopedia Brittanica says his father was the steward of a large estate.Jweaver28 (talk) 15:07, 17 November 2019 (UTC)

Ignaz

Please add a brief explanation on variation in names, i.e. Ignaz vs. Ignacy. A-giau 04:59, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

Poland was occupied by Austria, Russia and Prussia [Germany] [for 123 years] - when you were born in the prussian part you had a prussian version of your name. Ignacy is polish name, Ignaz is germanized. [btw: Paderewski of course has nothing to do with german blood]

Birth Date

The Wikipedia birthdate given for Paderewski is November 6th. All other sources state it as November 18th. If Someone can verify and correct this, please do so. Denismgagliardo 12:07, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

Not all others - see [1]. November 6 was the date in the Julian calendar in use in Russia and many of its outlying territories at the time. The Gregorian equivalent was November 18, the Gregorian calendar being 12 days ahead of the Julian in the 19th century. We should probably make this clear, and mention both versions of the date. For now, I've changed the date to 18 November. -- JackofOz (talk) 12:19, 29 September 2009 (UTC)

Infoboxes

TWO large infoboxes, repeating pretty much the same information? Why? -- ALoan (Talk) 10:21, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

This is the perfect illustration of the basic absurdity of the "biobox". They just aren't flexible enough to cope with human beings so we end up with this. A monstrosity this length doesn't even cover one important aspect of Paderewski's life, his career as a composer; whereas the basic facts about P.'s life can be elegantly handled by the introductory paragraph using plain old text (and you don't even need a degree in computer coding to write it!). --Folantin 11:51, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Agreed, I've scrapped them. The officeholder one was perhaps slightly more useful (or not), but it still presented a one-dimensional caricature. Fireplace 14:10, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

January 16 – January 9, 1919 ????

Probably December 9 or 1919 - 1920?--Payakoff (talk) 14:37, 4 November 2008 (UTC)

December 9, corrected. Thanks, Michał Sobkowski (talk) 07:36, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

Composer project review

I've reviewed this article has part of the Composers project review of its B-class articles. This article is basically B-class, but it is deficient in information on his composing activities, in addition to other flaws. My full review is on the comments page; questions or comments should be left here or on my talk page. Magic♪piano 14:53, 13 January 2009 (UTC)

Modern-day assessment

Listening to his records now, one is struck by his lack of skill in some ways. His very mannered style, and his apparently total inability to play a chord together, would get him kicked out of any piano competition in the first round these days. We need something about how he's viewed by modern commentators. -- Jack of Oz ... speak! ... 23:11, 25 April 2010 (UTC)

• I think this is true. But the modern assessment need not necessarily be the 'correct' one. It is just conceivable that many people these days have less artistic imaginations than listeners had in earlier decades. Paderewski belonged to the Romantic tradition, where the performer was co-creator of the musical score, not just a mechanistic reproducer of it. If Paderweski played fragmented chords, it was because he wished to do so for artistic effect. Whether that effect is felicitous or unfortunate depends entirely on the subjective judgment of the listener. Certainly what can be said is that Paderewski was a true musical artist, not a technician. While some people nowadays denigrate Paderewski's playing, he won the praise of some of the greatest pianists of his day, including the musical genius, Artur Schnabel (who said that 'Paderewski ONLY played professionally'). And no pianist could surely ask for much greater recognition and acclaim than to be praised by the great Artur Schnabel, arguably one of the most profound pianists in recorded history! Best wishes. Anoot7 (talk) 07:31, 30 July 2010 (UTC)

Seriously? His reputation in-concert was tremendous. I rather think not. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.111.42.37 (talk) 06:10, 31 July 2017 (UTC)

Whoever wrote this claim is probably a German Nazi trying to show Poles as lazy or something. If it was true, they would not let him play after his first concert. Total BS. 2A00:23C7:5882:8201:8874:2C24:D7AB:87A8 (talk) 14:44, 1 January 2023 (UTC)

Birthplace

The Shepetivka article says he was born in Shepetivka. Here it says that he was born in Kurilovka and moved to Sudilkov near Shepetivka. Which is correct? Ratzd'mishukribo (talk) 13:56, 4 April 2011 (UTC)

Articles in Britannica and Polish PWN Encyclopedia (by Polish Scientific Publishers PWN) confirm Kurilovka. Michał Sobkowski (talk) 12:56, 15 June 2011 (UTC)

The reference works to which I have access give the following:

• Grove's Dictionary of Music and Musicians (online):
  • b. Kursk, Podolia … His earliest years were spent with his father and sister in a small manor house near Zhitomir in Podolia
• Oxford Dictionary of Music:
  • b. Kurylówka,
• Oxford Companion to Music:
  • b. Kursk, Podolia
• Baker's Biographical Dictionary of Musicians, vol. 4:
  • b. Kurylowka, Podolia (Russian Poland)

HTH Tim riley (talk) 08:57, 5 August 2011 (UTC)

B-class revew

Failed for WP:POLAND due to insufficient inline citations. Also, doesn't look very comprehensive. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 03:23, 6 May 2013 (UTC)

Assessment comment

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Ignacy Jan Paderewski/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

Comment(s)

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==Composers Project Assessment of Ignacy Jan Paderewski: 2009-01-13== This is an assessment of article Ignacy Jan Paderewski by a member of the Composers project, according to its assessment criteria. This review was done by Magicpiano. If an article is well-cited, the reviewer is assuming that the article reflects reasonably current scholarship, and deficiencies in the historical record that are documented in a particular area will be appropriately scored. If insufficient inline citations are present, the reviewer will assume that deficiencies in that area may be cured, and that area may be scored down. Adherence to overall Wikipedia standards (WP:MOS, WP:WIAGA, WP:WIAFA) are the reviewer's opinion, and are not a substitute for the Wikipedia's processes for awarding Good Article or Featured Article status. ===Origins/family background/studies=== Does the article reflect what is known about the composer's background and childhood? If s/he received musical training as a child, who from, is the experience and nature of the early teachers' influences described? ok ===Early career=== Does the article indicate when s/he started composing, discuss early style, success/failure? Are other pedagogic and personal influences from this time on his/her music discussed? short on composing ===Mature career=== Does the article discuss his/her adult life and composition history? Are other pedagogic and personal influences from this time on his/her music discussed? short on composing ===List(s) of works=== Are lists of the composer's works in WP, linked from this article? If there are special catalogs (e.g. Köchel for Mozart, Hoboken for Haydn), are they used? If the composer has written more than 20-30 works, any exhaustive listing should be placed in a separate article. No works list. ===Critical appreciation=== Does the article discuss his/her style, reception by critics and the public (both during his/her life, and over time)? Performance appreciation is given; limited space given to compositions, critical reception, etc. ===Illustrations and sound clips=== Does the article contain images of its subject, birthplace, gravesite or other memorials, important residences, manuscript pages, museums, etc? Does it contain samples of the composer's work (as composer and/or performer, if appropriate)? (Note that since many 20th-century works are copyrighted, it may not be possible to acquire more than brief fair use samples of those works, but efforts should be made to do so.) If an article is of high enough quality, do its images and media comply with image use policy and non-free content policy? (Adherence to these is needed for Good Article or Featured Article consideration, and is apparently a common reason for nominations being quick-failed.) Images; no sound. Discography includes composition and performances by him. ===References, sources and bibliography=== Does the article contain a suitable number of references? Does it contain sufficient inline citations? (For an article to pass Good Article nomination, every paragraph possibly excepting those in the lead, and every direct quotation, should have at least one footnote.) If appropriate, does it include Further Reading or Bibliography beyond the cited references? Article has references; few inline citations. ===Structure and compliance with WP:MOS=== Does the article comply with Wikipedia style and layout guidelines, especially WP:MOS, WP:LEAD, WP:LAYOUT, and possibly WP:SIZE? (Article length is not generally significant, although Featured Articles Candidates may be questioned for excessive length.) ok ===Things that may be necessary to pass a Good Article review=== Article text formatting needs work (inconsistent citation styles) Article requires more inline citations (WP:CITE) Article lead needs work (WP:LEAD) ===Summary=== This is a fairly interesting article. While it gives clear weight to his notable achievements as a performer and politician, there is very little space devoted to his composing activities -- roughly one paragraph. More would be good, especially a listing of his works and some critical and popular commentary (on his compositions, not his piano playing) but that is my bias. The article would benefit from copyediting, mainly to add subheaders to the bio, and to correct things like inconsistent citation usage. If much of the article text is still from EB1911, providing inline citations will be a difficult task. Article is B-class; it's missing some potential content. Magic♪piano 14:51, 13 January 2009 (UTC)

Last edited at 14:51, 13 January 2009 (UTC). Substituted at 18:45, 29 April 2016 (UTC)

More work needed

Last month I put up a new article about Helena Paderewska, which contains some Polish history which would be useful in this article. I'm writing here because that article still doesn't have a talk page. Also, I suggest citing to the Sierkierski version of her memoirs there cited, rather than the Ilias Chrissochoidis version herein cited. I had edited her article while reading a hard copy of the Hoover Institution published book, and really appreciated the footnotes, although apparently I used an incorrect format in citing the ISBN printed on the title page. I looked up the reviews of the Chissochoidis version and it may not have footnotes. I don't know if the author was one of the grad students assisting Sierkierski in compiling the official Hoover Institution publication. I severely cut back my wikipedia editing because of digital harassment apparently relating to HomeVestors of America (whose article I haven't touched and an affiliate of which years ago vowed to force me to "shut up online"). When editing her article on 12/11 my untouched cellphone kept blipping with blocked spam calls; today 571-639-4004 called minutes after I logged onto wikipedia. Like cellphone-wielding compatriots chosing to violate the National Do Not Call Registry and other laws, it refused to identify itself nor leave a message.Jweaver28 (talk) 14:44, 24 December 2019 (UTC)