Talk:Impulse (TV series)

"Based on" vs "loosely inspired by"

Debresser As stated, please discuss your changes to the article here first. This source, currently in the article, clearly states "based on", and thus, that is the term used in the article. Please provide a reliable source that supports your statement of "loosely inspired by". Thank you. -- /Alex/₂₁ 07:53, 8 December 2019 (UTC)

First of all, please notice that the original edit was not mine.[1] And I think that the stated reason of that edit is very correct "if literally the only thing they adapted was "what if a teenage girl can teleport", it's an inspiration, not an adaptation."

I don't see how that can be disputed, nor how it is a bold edit, and frankly think that you have to explain why you oppose this edit so much and think it is worth edit warring about. Debresser (talk) 23:37, 8 December 2019 (UTC)

It doesn't matter if it wasn't your edit first; it was disputed and reverted, and this needed to be discussed. And when we have a reliable source that satisfies core policies WP:V and WP:RS with explicit wording, then the only way to change that wording is further reliable sources that satisify V and RS, instead of personal opinions which constitudes WP:OR. The IP editor had a very clever reasoning, certainly, I agree. They just had nothing to back it up but their own thoughts. That is why the edit was opposed. Now, can you back up the edit that you supported and restored, with any reliable sources, or does it continue to just be a personal opinion? -- /Alex/₂₁ 23:41, 8 December 2019 (UTC)

Why do you say that the previous version had a reliable source? It is my understanding that the previous version was unsourced, just like the change. Otherwise I would not have repeated that edit. Debresser (talk) 22:37, 9 December 2019 (UTC)

I already linked the source used in the article; yes, in my very first comment here. That source is from the article. That source says "based on". Hence, the content remains sourced. Now, can you back up the edit that you supported and restored, with any reliable sources, or does it continue to just be a personal opinion? -- /Alex/₂₁ 06:55, 10 December 2019 (UTC)

I am afraid that the source was not careful enough in its choice of words, and the [proposed change https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Impulse_(TV_series)&diff=prev&oldid=929482483] is probably more exact. Nevertheless, since it is sourced, I retract my opposition. Debresser (talk) 17:10, 10 December 2019 (UTC)

That's not up to us to decide. Good talk. -- /Alex/₂₁ 23:34, 10 December 2019 (UTC)

The consensus here is clearly against changing it to "loosely" so i dont know where you are getting that it was decided like that.. there is no source that says that and the credits do not say it.. so it is your pov. Spanneraol (talk) 21:42, 25 May 2020 (UTC)

The consensus was against "loosely inspired by", but "loosely based on" was the version that came out, since it combined my "loosely" with "Alex's "based on" and stood for 5 months. So if you want to change that, please show consensus. Debresser (talk) 06:57, 26 May 2020 (UTC)

again.. "loosely" is not in any of the sourcing and is basically meaningless and POV... sources simply say "based on". I see no where in the above conversation where User:Alex 21 agreed to that. Spanneraol (talk) 13:47, 26 May 2020 (UTC)

Again as well. "loosely" doesn't need to be in any sources. We are supposed to uses sources to write an article, not to restrict ourselves to quoting them. It is not meaningless, it means that the series does not closely follow the novel. As a matter of fact, it does not even loosely follow the novel. It just took one idea from it: the premise of a teleporting girl. For that reason we can't say it is "based on" the novel, since it only took one idea from it. Which is why the word "loosely" was added. Not by me, by the way. As far as I understand it, Alex 21 agrees with this, which is why the present version has been stable for over 5 months. I pinged him, to ask for his response. Debresser (talk) 13:57, 26 May 2020 (UTC)

No, it's been stable without "loosely" for five months until this edit started the problem back up again. I can assure you Alex 21 left it as without during your initial attempts to change it in December 2019, as he did again on March 11, 2020. As Alex said throughout, "loosely" should not be used. You are completely misrepresenting what happened. —Joeyconnick (talk) 15:31, 26 May 2020 (UTC)

I see. Then I propose the following. The series is not "based on" the book, as I explained above. It is rather the premise of a girl who can teleport that inspired the series. So let's say "inspired" and then we don't need the "loosely" any more. Debresser (talk) 20:12, 26 May 2020 (UTC)

You are still using your own original research to determine how closely the story follows the book. We are not supposed to do that, we are supposed to stick to the official sources..all of which use the term "based on" without qualifiers. Spanneraol (talk) 22:00, 26 May 2020 (UTC)

Both sources are in fact one and the same, as can be seen from the completely identical language. You may call this original research, but it is actually more correct to say that it is a critical understanding of the source. You can read our Impulse (Steven Gould novel) article, and see for yourself, that the plot has nothing in common with this series apart from the premise of a teleporting girl. To explain further, this s not a matter of interpretation, where you could say that the source claiming the series is "based on" the novel has interpreted facts differently. This is a case where clearly the source was careless about the facts. In such cases, we need not, even must not, perpetuate their mistake. Debresser (talk) 23:24, 26 May 2020 (UTC)

It's still based on that book... to determine how closely based on it is requires original research... like you just did by reading a plot summary and making an inference.. We don't do that at wikipedia, we simply say what the sources do. Spanneraol (talk) 01:26, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

We base ourselves on sources, but we don't simply copy whatever they say and however they say it. See for example Wikipedia:Editing policy "You should read the source, understand it, and then express what it says in your own words." We have an obligation to critically use our sources. In this case, I am pretty sure that the source itself didn't put much though in the words "based on", and its intention was indeed "inspired by the premise of". I think it falls without our editorial mandate - and even our editorial obligation, to fix this inaccuracy. Debresser (talk) 12:27, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

I have posted this issue and the subsequent removal of the "Disputed statement" tag I added, at Wikipedia:Dispute_resolution_noticeboard#Impulse_(TV_series). Debresser (talk) 22:59, 9 June 2020 (UTC)

Streaming

Regarding the discussion at WP:TV mentioned in the edit summary.[2] There have been two more, actually. ([3] and [4]). The consensus seems to be, and I stress "seems to be", that "streaming television series" is not a genre, and mentioning a streaming service in the lead should be enough. Debresser (talk) 13:56, 23 October 2022 (UTC)