Talk:May 1998 riots of Indonesia

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NPOV dispute

I am no expert on the subject, and do not feel qualified to assert whether the article is or is not biased, but i feel that it could at least use some improvement, and someone to verify the NPOV. I made one comment earlier (about one of the external links) which i felt was in fact very biased, and would be better replaced with something more neutral. I think they article would also benefit overall with some additional information and references. Any feedback or contribution would be greatly appreciated! --Keith 19:55, 10 April 2006 (UTC)

The third external link down "ColorQ World - The Indonesian Riots" seemed biased also, and i would say does not belong here. Overall article could use an unbiased expert to review.

Why do you use "Malay Muslims" instead of just "Malays"? I don't think it's a NPOV. Anyone?

Added POV flag to section False pictures circulated of the riots. The lack of reference to the bigger picture and context, use of words "hypocrisy" and "many"s, overexpansion/repeats on details on individual incidents and citations, all indicate original section author's intention to draw unbalanced attention to the specific issue in this section and to mislead. --73.10.51.249 (talk) 22:59, 18 September 2016 (UTC) -- OK I went in and made several edits in the ballpark. Further NPOV edits are likely still needed. --73.10.51.249 (talk) 23:25, 18 September 2016 (UTC) False pictures circulated of the riots should be removed along with all recent edits quoting "Charles A Koppel" (who is he ???). First of all why does this section deserve so much priority that it is placed in the original timeline of the riots ? In fact this section which talks fake rape photos precedes the section about the rapes itself. Secondly in addition to overexpansion, some of the references have been intentionally distorted. I checked the reference in relation to the account of one "Vivi" mentioned here : http://asia-pacific-solidarity.net/southeastasia/indonesia/netnews/1998/and33_v2.htm The part about Vivi in this article actually talks about the effort of Indonesian government to hide the mass rapes. There are accounts from various officials distorting and outright denying the incident. "Vivi"'s account over rapists shouting Allahu Akbar itself wasn't proven false in this article. If anything the edits here prove the continuation of some Indonesian elements to bury this incident. Notice that HRW also describes official obstruction on the rape investigation: https://www.hrw.org/news/1998/09/08/new-report-says-official-denials-indonesian-rapes-hinder-investigation I think the effort to obfuscate this incident is what should be brought up. Stepriverfifty (talk) 23:49, 25 October 2017 (UTC)

Who did it?

This wikipedia entry (per 30 sep 2005) is biased and lack further info. This wikipedia entry gives impression that the student activists are the one commiting the riot in 1998. Based on Romo Sandyawan report, the riot is committed deliberately by the indonesian military members (special task force) as way to intimidate people to suppress activism against government - and not malay muslim indonesians per se. Secondly, the wikipedia entry also gives impression that the victim of the riot is only chinese. It is not true. Non chinese are also victimised, a lot of them are burned trapped inside a burning shopping centre. Indonesians, both chinese and non chinese are victim in this riot.

responding to above statement

Where were you when the riots of May 1998 happend ???

I happend to be in Jakarta at the time of the riot, and it is a living hell for the next couple of days. The pribumi you mentioned that was also a "victim" which burned alive inside the mall are in fact the rioters who tried to loot the malls and stores.

Still they were victim. They know nothing but everyone gone to take want they want, and they trapped. Do you think they were planning to join (or make)the riot before it? Any way some of those who burned alive are not rioter.Aditthegrat 15:02, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

the students who were shot dead were in fact a chinese indonesian student, and by that incident the riots ensued between the police and the students, it is true that the sporadic riots in Jakarta is deliberatly caused by the military.

This is simply a well known fact among us Indonesians.

Elang Mulyana Lesmana (grandson of AH Nasution) and Hafidhin Royan are those students. Are they chinese-descendant? You mislead people here. Kunderemp 05:12, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

Kunderemp, the chinese there were all forced to change their names to Indonesian sounding ones in 1945. This law is considered as one of the most humiliating ones to those in the Chinese community in Indonesia since by doing so, they are forced to lose their family name. And as such, lost their proof to that they are chinese-descendant. Yet, they still are. Not misleading i think.Cleon 20:03, 14 August 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 60.54.5.19 (talk)

Is there is no Reliable Source?

Is there is no reliable source? I'm pretty confused hear and read about rivalry among General.Aditthegrat 15:02, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Chinese leaving Indonesia

to what country(ies) did they go? Thanks Hmains 04:18, 15 August 2006 (UTC)

My guesses would be the neighbouring countries: Singapore, Australia, and Malaysia. I also heard some moved to Northern America. A good portion also decided to migrate locally to safer regions (ie. Bali). --LittleWhisky 09:03, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

they go singapure, china, usa (one of my relatif go there, and get the green card), hongkong, taiwan, canada.Daimond (talk) 07:57, 4 May 2008 (UTC)

Witness

I am one witness of the riot. I do not participate nor being a victim, although I am a Chinese Indonesian.

This is my own experience and should not be made as reference:

I remember that day as an event close to war. Barbed wires everywhere. The streets are completely empty, only tanks and military vehicles that were in the streets. Cars and other vehicles were left burned. Buildings are marked with "Milik Pribumi" (the properties of native people). From my office window (6th stories of a bulding), I can see smokes everywhere. My office were happened to be just accross the street from the DPR (Indonesian legislative assembly) bulding, were students climed on top of the roof and make their protest. And with a monocular (owned by one of my friends), I see from nearby bulidings, the rifles of snipers are targeted to them. After that day, my office was guarded by a group of marines for nearly 1 month.

A few days after the event, I made a little tour around the city with my friends and saw many buildings was burnt down to the ground. I also heard many stories of Chinese women being raped (this stories turned out to be just an exaggeration).

This day will always be remembered by me and most of Indonesian people.

--Agus elex 2005 16:26, 4 November 2006 (UTC)

silent witnes

after ten years, the china town jakarta pancoran kota are very good as example as silent witness cause they time now flow diffrently than the past before the tragedy. in the past they open the shop open 12 hours a day ( from 9:00 to 21:00)right now they close more early than the past (9:00 to 18:00, or 10:00 to 17:00). this not cause they lazy but some thing change them permanetly. Daimond (talk) 07:54, 4 May 2008 (UTC)

Photos of the riots

!!!WARNING: Very Violent Photos!! Very Disturbing!!! I found a lot of photos about the riots at the following website: http://www.cclv.cn/Exhibit/class.asp?ClassID=72 (!!!WARNING: Very Violent Photos!! Very Disturbing!!!) --Jinhuili (talk) 20:44, 19 June 2008 (UTC)

change title?

The lead paragraph mentions other cities, so why is this article titled "Jakarta Riots" instead of "Indonesia riots"?

Sure, most foreign media have correspondents who are reluctant to leave the capital, but I think users of WP are able to recognize that Jakarta is part of Indonesia and a more inclusive title would be more accurate. I lived in Central Java during those times, and saw damage on the Yogya-Solo road. I also heard Medan had riots and atrocities. Martindo (talk) 01:15, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

Yes, it's a fair point. I was in Medan and there were riots there. I have an Indonesian language reference that details events in other cities. However the riots in Jakarta (naturally) were on a much larger scale. Any thoughts anybody on the way ahead? I think perhaps a renaming to 1998 Indonesia Riots or something like that. Davidelit (talk) 16:45, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

There were riots across Indonesia. As I recall they started in Medan but were the worst in Jakarta - although Solo was also particularly bad. Semarang and Yogya were largely unaffected. A name change to 1998 Indonesia Riots would not hurt, but let's keep the main focus on Jakarta. Also, let's also keep in mind that there were demonstration and shootings of students later that year (november?).--Merbabu (talk) 23:24, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

The Semanggi shottings in November were linked with the Special Session of the People's Consultative Assembly and were separate from the widespread destruction. As such, they would be better inlcuded in the People's Consultative Assembly or Fall of Suharto. Davidelit (talk) 09:00, 28 June 2009 (UTC)

This article, I believe, should be discussing the 3 days of riots following the Trisakti incident. (I remember this quite well, even if I was only 10 at the time.) All other riots should go in the Fall of Suharto article because it would be better put in context that way. There's actually a lot of print material on the Jakarta riots alone, more so than the other riots. Arsonal (talk) 07:11, 1 July 2009 (UTC)

I would argue for the riots in Surakarta and Medan at least to be included in this article as it seems that a faction within the Military of Indonesia was responsible for all three, with Medan and Solo being "dry runs". Davidelit (talk) 04:01, 2 July 2009 (UTC)

OK - I'm going to be bold and rename to "May 1998 riots in Indonesia". The general consensus seems to be on increasing the scope to all of Indonesia, but focussing on Jakarta and sticking to May which was the climax month of the Fall of Suharto. Feel free to suggest less clumsy wording. --Merbabu (talk) 01:51, 12 September 2009 (UTC)

A few comments

Since Crisco mentioned some eds are trying to get this up to GA and asked me to look it over, a few comments:

• This is great stuff that seems on its way not just to GA, but FA as well.
• In the background section, "government thugs", even in quotes, seems a bit POV. Can this be more clearly sourced, and more neutrally described?
• I also had trouble sorting out which party was currently in power in the first sentences of the Background section--ie, which party the "gov. thugs" were.
• The article seemed a bit overlinked; the editors might take a quick look at WP:Link and remove a few more "low-value" links. It's hard to imagine a reader clicking through from here to drama, Egypt, or Taiwan (and the MOS discourages those types of links).
• Similarly, the article should be checked for redundant links; I know the MOS has a clause for occurrences that are far apart, but I'm not sure that all of these qualify, especially big ones like Suharto.

That's all I got, except to say again, nice expansion.

Cheers, Khazar (talk) 04:12, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

Thanks Khazar. I'll try and deal with those issues. Crisco 1492 (talk) 05:01, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for the constructive comments.I believe my methodology was to link something if it hasn't appeared in 2–3 subsections. It's a minor thing that can be fixed later when this goes to GA/FA. "Government thugs" is the way it's written in the source, and I had a difficult time finding an alternative way to write it. They really belonged to no party, though some will say it's the PDI faction who supported the other leader. "Government" also does not equal Golkar because the organization itself is a political machine devised by Suharto and his cronies to keep him in power. The incident itself probably warrants its own article as the circumstances around it are complicated. I tried not to delve into it because it doesn't really belong in this article. —Arsonal (talk + contribs)— 05:20, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

Perhaps you could take a look at my current phrasing? If "government thugs" is better, perhaps it should have a footnote right next to it to make it clearer. Crisco 1492 (talk) 05:30, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

I can't say for sure at this moment whether your writing is more correct. I have to check the literature to see what what scholars are saying about the incident. —Arsonal (talk + contribs)— 05:32, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

Okay, thanks. Crisco 1492 (talk) 05:35, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

Rewritten with the help of another source. Some details in the previous version turned out incorrect anyway. —Arsonal (talk + contribs)— 06:19, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

I think it reads better. Nice. Crisco 1492 (talk) 06:26, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

I suggest to delete all content relate to China because it's too sensitive, so better don't talk about it at all.76.199.99.239 (talk) 19:14, 26 June 2011 (UTC)

Sensitivity of material has no relation to its encyclopedic value. There are many sensitive topics that are covered comprehensively on Wikipedia. If you think the article itself has POV issues, provide specific examples and reasons so that they can be dealt with. Only one paragraph of this article focuses on China, and Chinese Indonesians, although an important part of the story, are not the only victims of the riots. —Arsonal (talk + contribs)— 19:29, 26 June 2011 (UTC)

A few suggestions

Thanks for the great work of editors. Nice articles and great readability. A few adds if possible:

1) any trails after the riot? some stories, examples, direct citation from renowned source such as New York times, Times, global & mail, post etc.

2) more reactions from global society, not only gov. but also common people in Indo-, China, Taiwan, HK, Singapore etc...

3) more pics reflecting lootings, rapes, killings, shopping malls etc.

Personal opinion: pretty mad at the reaction of China, if the same incident happens in USA, the president will declare a war since 1000+ people died for no reason. What a tradegy! All criminals should be bringed into justice... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 142.245.193.11 (talk) 16:50, 27 July 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for the comments. While we are always on the lookout for more sources and material for the article, we are also obliged to follow Wikipedia's policy on reliable sources, which would include the sources you mentioned in point 1. Unfortunately, because the topic has aged quite a bit, there are few available web sources due to Indonesia's limited accessibility in 1998. Furthermore, we are restricted to free content, so we can only make do with supporting material that we have until e acquire more of them. If you have additional suggestions, we will gladly take them. —Arsonal (talk + contribs)— 18:54, 27 July 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for replying. The article is well-balanced and sound in its reference. However it may not be able to outline the severity and cruelty since it is much too modest. Here is a link for some brutal pics reflecting the looting, burning, murdering, raping etc. Pics should be ok to redistribute and it is a public source. If you could choose a few and that will definitely add more color to the article. Thanks.

http://tuku.culture.china.com/culture/html/2011-08-12/180976_1871486.htm#pic — Preceding unsigned comment added by 142.245.59.11 (talk) 15:30, 15 August 2011 (UTC)

While I appreciate your enthusiasm, we unfortunately cannot use those pictures without knowing their original photographers. Unless there is a statement explicitly indicating a free license, the assumption is that these images are copyrighted. Indonesian copyright law states: "The Copyright on [...] photographic works [...] shall be valid for 50 (fifty) years as of the first publication." We will see what we can do about strengthening the indication of severity, but keep in mind that articles must be written in an encyclopedic tone because Wikipedia is not a memorial. —Arsonal (talk + contribs)— 17:27, 15 August 2011 (UTC)

Most of the pictures spread around the Chinese websites and forums labelled as May 1998 Chinese riot victims, are neither of Chinese nor from May 1998. They are from Maluku sectarian conflict, Banyuwangi witch hunt, Sanggauledo riots, Sambas riots and Sampit conflict, 2000 Walisongo school massacre. For example this wordpress blog shows graphic images of Madurese victims in the Sampit conflict, witches hunted down in Banyuwangi and East Timorese rape victims. The beheaded corpses are of Madurese or people from Banyuwangi and Sulawesi. I have actual links to the original images at Talk:Sambas_riots, Talk:Banyuwangi Regency, Talk:Sampit conflict which show the date and place they were taken. None of the people in the images are Chinese. There is not a single image of an actual Chinese victim being killed from the May 1998 riots on the internet. The only actual images of May 1998 are of the burning buildings and the Indonesians burning a portrait of a Chinese tycoon. So don't upload images from random blogs and internet forums.Rajmaan (talk) 03:52, 26 July 2015 (UTC)

I'm a witness

I was there in Jakarta on business during the riots. I still have the Jakarta newspaper accounts and photos. I left the city for Bali on May 15, 1998, and then left the country on May 16 for Hong Kong. I am not a Chinese Indonesian; I'm from the U.S.A. and I'm white. Mdoc7 (talk) 17:13, 22 August 2012 (UTC)

You can upload your photos to Wikimedia Commons and add them to this articles. Wo.luren (talk) 02:12, 12 October 2012 (UTC)

http://press.anu.edu.au/apps/bookworm/view/Anomie+and+Violence/5311/ch04.xhtml

Most people who died during the looting of Chinese supermarkets were the looters themselves, not Chinese

A fire started and burnt most of the Indonesian looters to death when they tried targeting Chinese owned businesses.

https://web.archive.org/web/20000920073842/http://www.serve.com/inside/digest/dig86.htm

http://www.library.ohiou.edu/indopubs/1998/05/31/0029.html

http://www.asia-pacific-solidarity.net/southeastasia/indonesia/netnews/1998/and20_v2.htm

Over 1,000 killed in Indonesia riots: rights body Reuters - June 3, 1998 Jim Della-Giacoma, Jakarta

The May riots DIGEST No.61 - May 29, 1998

http://books.google.com/books?id=bCsgAwAAQBAJ&pg=PA34#v=onepage&q&f=false

Mall fire

http://thejakartapost.com/news/2014/05/12/288-burned-alive-a-jakarta-mall-16-years-ago.html

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=2519&dat=19980516&id=4DpdAAAAIBAJ&sjid=KlsNAAAAIBAJ&pg=1394,2629247

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1893&dat=19980516&id=-_4wAAAAIBAJ&sjid=VN0FAAAAIBAJ&pg=1671,2789983

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=2245&dat=19980516&id=zdc_AAAAIBAJ&sjid=ISEGAAAAIBAJ&pg=7083,2328595

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1914&dat=19980516&id=D8k0AAAAIBAJ&sjid=LmsFAAAAIBAJ&pg=2771,2819357

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=2457&dat=19980515&id=w6FJAAAAIBAJ&sjid=NA0NAAAAIBAJ&pg=4456,4746006

Rajmaan (talk) 02:57, 9 July 2014 (UTC)

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I was in Jakarta during the riots, this is my details that was published in the local newspaper when I returned to the USA

43 hours of Hell

I arrived in Jakarta at 9:30 PM on the 13th of May.

The Cathay Pacific plane from Hong Kong stopped in Singapore prior to going to Jakarta. In the waiting lounge at the Singapore airport the Television was showing some of the demonstrations that were going on after the police or army had shot and killed 6 student demonstrators the day before. There was some violence but it was minor. When I returned to the airplane we were told that there would be a delay since some passengers had changed their minds and didn’t want to go on to Jakarta. The delay was to get their bags off the plane, maybe I should taken that as a hint as to what was to come.

After arrival at the airport and the normal hassles of going through Indonesia customs and immigration I was out in the arrival area looking for my friend who was suppose to pick me up.

After looking around for 15 or 20 minutes and also since the plane was late I assumed he had not made it, or something had keep him from the airport. I went to the hired car desk and for 80,000 Rupiah (approx. $8.00) I had hired a private car to drive me to the Millennium Hotel in Jakarta. This hotel which I had never stayed in before was where we were scheduled to put on some seminars on Saturday the 16th. It was located in the south central area of the city near the financial district.

Driving from the airport was quick, we did pass an area where there was some fires but traffic was light and with no problems or signs of problems.

The hotel was nice, the staff was friendly and I settled in to my room on the 6th floor, with a window view to the outside street and a view looking to the northwest. A few minutes after settling in the room the telephone rang. It was my friend who said the road to the airport was closed for most of the day and that his neighborhood had been blocked off due to demonstrations, and that he was not able to get to the airport. He had sent me an e-mail to tell me to stay at the airport hotel but I was not able to retrieve it prior to arriving.

He told me he would pick me up in the morning but would call first, probably around 9:00 AM.

Arrival +10 hours

A good breakfast in the coffee shop and the answering of a few arriving faxes seemed to indicate that everything was OK.

A+11 hours

Looking out the window from the room there was some smoke in a few locations around the city. Also outside on the intersection there seemed to be some individuals trying to set up a roadblock to stop cars from going down one of the streets. I couldn’t see what might be the reason for this but took a curious interest in glancing out to see what this was all about.

A+12 hours

A phone call told me that my associate would try be at the hotel around 11:00 AM since there were some new demonstrations and violence close to his home and he couldn’t go out.

Looking out the window I see more smoke and fires around the city in all directions in fact not far from the hotel there appears to be a major one starting up. A bus that was turning at the intersection was stopping and trying to back up and I assume go a different way, but I couldn‘t see why! A quick check of the TV indicates on the foreign news that there are new major demonstrations and violence breaking out in the city.

A+13 hours (10:30 AM)

Plugging in my computer to try to check my e-mail I here some noise outside. Outside there are no cars on the otherwise busy street. There are no taxis in the hotel driveway or parking area, which was not normal. At the intersection coming down the street was mass of 300 to 500 mostly young people. They were not carrying any signs just sticks, knives, machetes and rocks! As they turned the corner to the Hotel Street they went straight for a Christian Church directly across the street from the hotel. Hundreds of rocks rained down on the church, breaking all the windows, a van parked outside on the street was pushed into the parking area in front of the church and gasoline thrown on the van and set a blaze. The burning truck threatened to start the church on fire. A grand piano was dragged out of the church on to the street and smashed and set on fire. These were not demonstrators but looters and criminals! They then turned their attention to our hotel! Hundreds throwing rocks at the glass exterior and lobby. They streamed into the lobby smashing, and breaking everything in their path. The hotel staff ran out the back of the building into the back offices and barricaded themselves in. Luckily that morning the hotel had held a meeting to discuss action in case of riots, an hour later they were putting the plan into effect.

I locked the room and started to get the important items in my pocket, passport, ticket, and money. I also packed everything and tried to figure out what do to next. Looking out the window I can see a lot of the rioters running out of the hotel with computers, food, beer, anything they can get there hands on. I went out of the room and went down to the 2nd floor, which would allow me to see into the lobby from a balcony. Thinking back it was probably not a good idea since the looters could be coming up the elevators!

When I got to the 2nd floor most of the looters had gone out of the hotel. Two young women were also standing on the 2nd floor balcony frantically trying to call on a mobile phone with no luck. I asked if they were staying in the hotel, no they were driving by saw the violence and drove into the hotel underground garage. The looters had gone into the garage and smashed a lot of the cars and broke windows. They escaped up the elevator. I asked if they wanted to hide in my room but they couldn’t stop shaking and just wanted to get out of the area. Last I saw they were running into the Restaurant kitchen on the 2nd floor.

I returned to my room and immediately called Cathay Pacific Airline, I made a reservation for a flight the next day and requested to pickup the ticket at the airport. Getting a confirmation number made me feel I at least had a way out!

A+14

The rioters had started a fire outside of the hotel with items from the hotel, chairs, tables, etc., they then moved down the street and started fires at some other buildings. I don’t know if the same group was responsible for the large Sogo Department Store, which was totally burnt out, just up the road.

Things seemed to very quiet, the street was empty. In the hallway I ran into the hotel manager, he was staying in a room near mine and told me many hotel workers were told to go up to a room and lock themselves in. When the rioters were in the hotel the power was shut off to keep the elevators from going up and to keep the looters from the guestrooms. The fire doors didn’t open from the outside so he felt that would keep the looters from the upper floors. What he was afraid of was fire, and the destruction of the building and safety of the guests. He told me if we have to evacuate, to go down the fire stairs and go down the street to the elementary school. The hotel had made arrangements to house people there in an emergency.

Just then we can see out of the hallway window the looters all running back down the street headed for the hotel, and it seems like there is twice as many as before! I quickly got to my room before shutting off the electricity would not let me open the electric card key door. Once again the rioters stormed the hotel smashing anything else they may a missed, they tried to get into the elevators, were able to open some of the doors, broke mirrors in the elevators but with no electricity they couldn’t get above the lobby. They destroyed all the restaurants throwing all the food from the buffet all over the walls. Even from the 6th floor the noise down below of the destruction was extremely loud. Looking for any sign of smoke I was again getting ready to run. A truck full of police came but parked up the street, and formed a line across the street. They then started to fire up in the air from their guns and the rioters started to leave the hotel, and slowly retreated up the street they came out of.

A+15 (12:30 PM)

The hotel was a complete mess; everything in the first floor was destroyed. Anything that could be carried out was taken. Slowly the employees came from where they were hiding back to the lobby. Everyone was in a state of shock! The employees know that finding a job today is very difficult in Indonesia and if the hotel closes it will be major blow for them. While everyone I spoke to was sympathetic towards the students that have been demonstrating, this action in their mine was criminal. "Burning the church, stealing, nobody was carrying any signs of protest, nothing to do with anger with the government and Suharto!"

A+16

I called my associate and told him what was going on. He said that he could not leave fires, rioters were everywhere, and it was not safe to go out for anyone.

I called the US Embassy to register and ask for some help on getting out. After being cut off I called again and spoke to someone in the counselor section. They said they would fax over a form for me to fill out. I asked if they could help, or give me any advice on how to get to the airport, since it appeared that all normal transportation was starting to collapse, they said "no, but good luck!" So much for the US government being helpful when you need them. They did send over the fax and form to fill out, along with a warning bulletin to be careful when traveling to Indonesia. Since I was already there it didn’t take a rocket science to figure out that this information was a little useless. We must be paying these people a lot of money to think these things up.

A+17

The police departed the area. We didn’t get any protection before so I guess it didn’t matter if they were or weren’t there. I called Hong Kong and had someone arrange a hotel room for me. One way or another I was getting out the next day.

A+19 (4:30PM)

The hotel tried to make us comfortable as best they could. They showed us where the school was in case of more trouble; they feed us in the hotel canteen in the basement, and all charges after the riot was stopped.

In a short time we became close friends with them as they shared their frustrations with the government, country and what is going on. Another American at the hotel, John and I became friendly. John lived in Hong Kong and it wasn’t clear what he was doing to make money, but I didn’t ask, since it sounded suspicious. But John was big and tall like me, and had a threatening look about him, perfect traveling partner. He was on some kind holiday that went bad, even before the riots. It wasn’t hard to convince him that it was best to leave as soon as possible. Now I had to find transportation. I decided the best time to go would be around 3 to 4 AM, most people would be asleep, and the chances would be better. We were able to get a taxi company to agree to come at 3:30 AM.

A+22

The hotel was gearing up for more possible trouble. All the lights on the first floor were off; employees carried hatchets, swords, Knives, or clubs. A few had the big police blackjacks. They had taken out the fire hoses and had them ready for rioters and or fire. They had gotten a threat from someone on the street that the rioters would come back and burn down the building. A police official came to the hotel and according to the translation by one of the employees he (the policeman) explained how to try to talk to the looters and convince them not to do any damage. Something about look into their eyes and try to tell them we are all part of the same family, and we shouldn’t hurt each other. No body gave much weight to what the police had to say; in fact they laughed about it after they departed.

A+23 to A+29 (8:30 PM to 2:30 AM)

Unusually quiet on the streets. No signs of people, or vehicles. Hotel employees sitting in the dark all over the hotel waiting and watching. At 3:00 AM I’m down in the lobby and calling the Taxi Company to see when they are coming. A few hours earlier sitting in the canteen with John and an Australian man, his Thai wife and 2 year old daughter, we are talking about our plan going to the airport. We take some knives from the kitchen in case we run into trouble. I will sit behind the driver, and will have a piece of heavy wire. If we seem to be heading some place we don’t want to go, or the driver is leading us into a trap. I will choke him from behind, John will jump to the front from the other side and push him out the door, and take over the car. We also carry everything important on our body in case we have to leave all the bags and suitcases.

A+30 (3:30AM)

The Taxi Company says they cannot send out a car, "too dangerous on the streets".

Now what do we do!! We get a hotel employee to go down the street to see if any taxi or car is traveling in the area. Nothing moving or coming.

A+30 ½ (4:00AM)

A small 4-wheel drive vehicle with the words "Mandala Airlines" on the side is coming down the road. We stop it. I’m sure the driver was surprised to see two Americans waving him down. We had the hotel interpret that we wanted a ride to the airport and that we would pay what ever he wanted! He agreed and asked for 150,000 Rupiah (about $15.00). We loaded up the van, I jumped into the seat behind him, (our contingency plan) and off we went.

We went up some small roads and dead ahead in the street was a group of about 20 or 30 young guys playing soccer in the road. The driver started to slow up; I started to reach for the knives and the wire. The driver said "no problem" we were concerned, as we got closer the game stopped and they started to stand blocking the street. The driver rolled down the window with a hand full of 500 Rupiah notes (5 ¢ each)

He handed them to the men and they waved and smiled at us, and we quickly moved away. We passed many more people on the street and he slowed and tried to appear like we weren’t trying to run. Mandala Airlines is a local airline and the windows in the back were dark and maybe most people didn’t see us.

We finally got to the ramp of the expressway and we would be high above the street. The ramp had a barrier closing the tollgate, with nobody working they closed the road. We got out one was chained shut. The other with a little help we twisted it out of the way and went up the ramp. As we traveled on the expressway a group of police motioned us to stop up ahead. This time the driver speeded up and zoomed right by the police, they didn’t seem to react and we continued. Then something happened that I was praying for happened, it started to rain, and rain hard. We had to go around burned out cars and trucks but by 4:30 AM we were at the airport. Now our driver in our mind was our hero. We gave more than he asked. He was grateful and drove off.

A+31 to A+43 (4:30 AM to 4:30 PM)

The 12 hours at the airport was unbelievable chaos, but I felt safe and was not going back to the city. People sleeping everywhere, fighting for tickets, reservations, and a way out of the country. Most of the people in the airport were ethnic Chinese and foreigners.

A+43 (4:30PM) Cathay Pacific CX-776 lifted off the runway and everyone sighed a sigh of relief. In a few minutes I was sound asleep.

Robert W. Coshland rocosh@aol.com Ventura, CA 16 May, 1998 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2605:E000:6A07:C200:19CA:19C:DAA1:F13 (talk) 19:42, 29 May 2018 (UTC)

Total Deaths

The article says 10,000- this is widely inaccurate and cannot be verified. The supporting source says hundreds died- 10,000 refers not to the number killed in the 1998 riots, but instead to all Indonesian conflicts during this era combined, — Preceding unsigned comment added by 206.87.177.0 (talk) 18:55, 28 June 2019 (UTC)

Picking on one specific translation

I am a Chinese Indonesian, but I will be merely talking about the language of one translation of 'Cina Babi', at least to me, the two words would not translate into 'Chinese Pigs', that would be "Babi Cina", as Indonesians put the adjective after the noun, for example "orang tinggi", translates to 'tall people' or 'tall person', but 'orang' means people/person and 'tinggi' means tall, so no, I do not believe translating this into 'Chinese Pigs' is accurate, it seems to be something along the lines of either 'Piglike Chinese' or an abbreviation of 'Cina itu Babi', which could be interpreted as either the 'Chinese are Pigs', or that 'China is Pig', the second may sound somewhat nonsensical but it is a metaphorical insult based on the muslim dislike of pigs, the chinese community on the other hand enjoy them quite finely, including myself. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 125.165.107.216 (talk) 05:37, 7 July 2022 (UTC)

Background?

why background for sparking q riot at first was the tension between chinese and the native? Why there is no background regarding the long time discontent of new order that led to the fall of suharto? 2404:8000:1027:85F6:DA3:6B14:D79A:9C8B (talk) 14:42, 21 May 2023 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Public Writing Fall 2021 F1

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 4 September 2021 and 10 December 2021. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Sarahadr (article contribs). Peer reviewers: Cornelius mastermind, Jilltaylor2.

— Assignment last updated by Marimilan (talk) 18:47, 1 October 2023 (UTC)