Talk:Knićanin
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I removed two categories: since the article is not about concentration camp, but about village (which is not a concentration camp itself), it does not belong there. If somebody write separate article about concentration camp, then that article would belong there. I also removed the Danube Swabians category, because we do not have practice here to put the villages with Serb ethnic majority into category "Serbs", or the villages with Hungarian ethnic majority into category "Hungarians", etc. PANONIAN (talk) 18:28, 8 January 2006 (UTC)
Sounds good. If people wanna find out everything that involves Danube Swabians, they can go to Danube Swabians and click "What links here". If I have time I might do a separate article on the camp and then take out everything (the picture, etc) but a sentence with a link, but if I did any camp articles I'd probably do Gakowa (sh Gakovo/a?) or Mitrovica (Sremska). If and when I do that, I'd probably want to do just one article on all the camps, since else there's not enough material. At that point, there'd have to be a decision about whether to make Danube Swabian focused article on their role in WW2 and the internment/expulsion, or if it would be an article about some other topic, "labor camps in Yugoslavia after the second world war", or preferably a better title than that. The problem is, I don't know (and I'm assuming you do) how other groups were effected, I just know that they were. I don't even know if there were other groups inside the camps, or if other groups were interned long term, or if they had separate camps. The books I have (not with me now but at my parents) do contain detailed numerical information, etc, actually too much, but are of course very focused on German plight rather than giving a general overview. So let me know if you can think of an article with the correct SCOPE, or if you think I should just do one on the Danube Swabians ca 1940-1955 (role in WW2 and the internment/expulsion) and what other events of that time should be in the see also. Thanks - Adammathias
Here is just my suggestion, but you could write an article named "Places where Danube Swabians lived", listing all places in all countries where they were majority. That would be interesting. As for your question "do I know how other groups were effected", what you mean exactly? Other ethnic groups or other groups of Danube Swabians? And in which place or region? What I know is that the Germans were only nation in Vojvodina from which the communist authorities deducted Yugoslav citizenship. Thus, I think that only Germans were held in those camps. I only know some general things about those events, not much details to help you with article. As for your question what Elemira is, it is one of the villages in Zrenjanin municipality (the basic name form is Elemir). Elemira is just a case of this word used in Serbian. See this:
PANONIAN (talk) 03:50, 9 January 2006 (UTC)
Yes, I definitely need to do a complete list of Danube Swabian villages - my only trouble (if I use the print sources I have) might be connecting them to their better known names. (But if we were afraid of complex naming histories, then we probably wouldn't concern ourselves with this area of the world ;) ). I'll put that on my to do list. I would probably list it 2 ways, by percentage and by absolute number (since (making up numbers) 45% in Apatin trumps %100 in Lovcenac?). What I meant by other ethnic groups effected was, you have repeatedly pointed out that many Serbs (etc etc etc etc) died not only during the horrific Nazi invasion but also in the aftermath. I'm pretty shaky on the big picture and thus on how the DS fit into that big picture - I understand that there was factionalism between Ustase, Cetniks, and Partisans, but not too much more. I guess there's so much going on at the time, it's easier just to keep the scope narrow, ie limited to DS. About citizenship, you may be interested to know, there were at least a couple freak incidents were citizenship was not revoked, which meant that some men had the bad fortune to be released and then subsequently drafted into the Yugoslav army after their families/villages had mostly left the country. Thanks much for all your help here on cleaning up some of the other articles. -Adammathias
The killings and persecutions commited by the communist authorities after the war were mainly politicaly motivated, but as I said, the main difference between Germans and other ethnic groups here was that Germans were the only nation which was labeled collective guilty, while only those Serbs, Hungarians, Croats and others who collaborated with Axis authorities or who were labeled as "the enemies of the people" (politically incompetent) were killed or persecuted. There were also prison camps for political enemies, such is the one on Goli Otok in Croatia. PANONIAN (talk) 16:35, 9 January 2006 (UTC)
Church
editOn the picture caption is said that the church existed until 1948. It is said Here stood until 1948 the destroyed German church. This is somewhat ambigous, since it doesn not specify if the church was destroyed in 1948, or it might be destroyed earlier, and "removed" in 1948. I ask this question because I've found data on this site that says that the church was destroyed by Germans in 1944: The fall of the village is symbolized by the detonation of the church tower by German troops. [1] -- Obradović Goran (talk 22:13, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
- No question, the church got deeply demaged in October 1944. It might be removed a little bit later, maybe even in 1948. Due to the concentration camp there was no settlement until 1948.--Speidelj (talk) 19:26, 21 October 2008 (UTC)
External links modified
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