Talk:Law enforcement in the United States

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Law Enforcement in the First Decades of the US

I am interested in knowing what law enforcement was like at the time the US Constitution was drafted and signed. If anyone reading this has knowledge of the history of law enforcement during that period, would you be willing to add a section? Jzilliac (talk) 19:38, 11 May 2010 (UTC)jzilliac

The History section is quite small and bad. Manys (talk) 16:48, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Equipment and uniforms

I feel that the article merits an equipment section, including a discussion of uniforms and vehicles, and would eventually include the weapons section as well. Here are some sources regarding uniforms:

• Source 1
• Source 2

AniRaptor2001 (talk) 02:00, 20 July 2009 (UTC)

Good article assessment

While this article has a lot of good in it, the major lack of references, and a slightly need for wikifying, holds it back from Good Article nomination at this time.--SGGH 16:12, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

--Does anyone know the status of Police in the US when it concerns an invasion?-- --V. Joe 22:46, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Status as in what? Martial law means the military takes over all legal control. Whose invading? Where are they invading? The US has a long tradition of subordination of the military to the civilian and the military takes pride in being a protector of the Constitution. We have a vastly decentralized control of police agencies in the US for a reason.--131.238.92.62 08:03, 24 June 2006 (UTC)

I only asked (months ago) because I was reading an alternate history of WWII where Japan had invaded Hawaii, and I was curious as to what the police forces are "supposed" to do in the event of a partial or actual invasion of the United States. Cheers V. Joe 16:21, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

Training

Basic (academy) and in-service training are not addressed at all. No firearms training, defensive tactics, role-playing, precision and pursuit driving, handling of evidence, rules of criminal procedure... Huge hole in this article until someone fills it. Police work is not just guns and handcuffs.--131.238.92.62 08:03, 24 June 2006 (UTC)

I will be adding reference/citing sources, and will be editing the page to include things like de-escalading, scenario based training.~~Popo10-4 Popo10-4 (talk) 18:50, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

Styles of policing

added sections on styles of policing, and police functions, with documentation. Tychocat 09:53, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

Here's a good reference [1] for the "Policing styles" section. →James Kidd (contr/talk/email) 03:21, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

The styles of policing is heavily Whitewashed and eupahmistic. The "reform-minded" part is still missing sitation, and is a heavily POV tinged section contrasting urban policing, where there is talk about a controversy around "treating everyone the same regardless of some group crime potency" Ie minorities, this is contrasted with suburban communities, which are described as homogenous, ie white and wealthy, and as places where policing is not as needed because of their homogenity, ie homogenous white communities, rather than looking at wealth, and urban density, ie mcmansions in the middle of nowhere of course has less drug trade and bussiness crimes associated with it, as many suburbs are bedroom communities where cars are needed to go into those icky non-homogenous towns where so much more crime is happening. If you are going to use a police style section to front load political views about the dangers of non-homogenity in a section about urban criminology dressed up as polcing tatics. Then please actually give the right relevant sources. Akiosi (talk) 14:34, 17 October 2023 (UTC)

Controversy

why was there no "Controversy" heading? Not all police are helpful and friendly. Very few police (that I've encountered) took the "Service" part of their job seriously. I am a very law abiding citizen and highly educated individual but no matter what the forum I interact with a police officer in, they always end up hassling me, as if I had done something wrong. Very few people I know (most of which are college graduates and model citizens) have anything positive to say about police officers. Rodney King, anyone?

I agree. While also a law-abiding taxpayer myself, any interaction I have ever had with the police showed that they handle themselves in a highly egotistical and pushy manner. This article makes it seem that no Police officer is corrupt or that all of them are friendly peace officers running around looking for cats to rescue from trees. Let's be a little more realistic please.

If you want to write a controversy section, the police brutality that occurred in the late '60s would be a good jumping-off point. 74.75.59.121 (talk) 22:46, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

Controversy about Controversy

If you want to include a section about controversy... Please consider WRITING one... but make sure you research it and cite your sources V. Joe 21:34, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

CIA

I don't think that we should be listing the CIA as a Federal police force. While they work in conjunction with FBI and others at times they don't truly enforce laws, instead acting as an intelligence gathering and paramilitary organization. Most importantly, the CIA does not operate within the US. I have left it for now, but I would like to hear other people's opinions. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.171.0.213 (talk) 05:00, 10 September 2007 (UTC) No one has objected so far, so I removed the CIA. 76.171.0.213 18:44, 21 September 2007 (UTC)

Archaic pictures

Could someone take some more modern pictures? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.138.11.3 (talk) 01:23, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Forest Preserve Police

I put them in the county section as they police the forest preserve district in each county, and are county wide, county level.

I do not see the problem with talking about a county level law enforcement agency in the county section, moving the description to a page that is a list page makes no sense. The article talks about diferent states and situations, the Forest preserve district police, or sometimes ranger police, are at the county level and are full police I do not see the problem with the information. There are two almost duplicate sections on Police and Sheriffs, that I feel should be merged. --Never give up! Never surrender! (talk) 01:24, 10 April 2009 (UTC)

Corresponding Branch within the Government

If there are the three branches of the United States government, legislative, executive, and judicial, then this article needs to clearly explain under which branch, if any, law enforcement in the United States resides. A clear discussion of which branch under federal law, and then into state's law, and then under any further subdivisions. While the answer may be complicated, this article is clearly lacking as a result of the absence of this information.

If the answer is too complicated to fit neatly into any current article subsections, then an entirely new section needs to be introduced to discuss this matter and why it is complicated. We teach children about the three branches of the government, and we teach children about the police, yet we cannot reconcile their coexistence in a Wikipedia article?--74.235.10.206 (talk) 07:05, 12 June 2009 (UTC)

      My thoughts regarding which branch police are in- most federal LE is within the executive branch. Some are particularly answerable and supervised by the judicial branch such as the Supreme Court Police and the US Marshals but I think they are still out of the executive budget. But their jurisdiction is defined by Congress and their budgets come from Congress. On the state and municipal level things are not always clearly distinguished as far as branches. Sheriff is almost always its own elected office. State patrols/ state police are all supervised by the executive branch.

Even if someone does all the research necessary I'm not sure the branch of government data would be a good addition to this article. What does anyone else think? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Tjc (talk

Correction in History Paragraph Four

Correction in History Paragraph Four There seems to be a mistake in paragraph four. The oldest state-level law enforcement agency in the United States is the Texas Rangers Division commonly called the Texas Rangers. This agency was first established in 1823 and formalized i.e., constituted in 1835. Dlkirkland (talk) 16:57, 11 January 2011 (UTC)

Entry qualifications

Must '*Be in good physical and psychological condition'. This may be an entry requirement, but from personal observation is clearly not an ongoing requirement. Perhaps the article needs to mention the issue of obesity in (some) officers serving in US police forces?1812ahill (talk) 23:04, 22 February 2013 (UTC)

Section name...

A section is titled "Less lethal weapons." I know deaths have occurred (obviously) from their usage, but aren't they usually (or almost universally) classified as "Non-lethal weapon?" 98.198.85.83 (talk) 09:24, 27 April 2013 (UTC)

External links modified

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Recent shootings

This page should link pages describing recent issues.

What about linking Police brutality in the United States.Xx236 (talk) 09:57, 27 July 2016 (UTC)

Whitewash

This article is incomplete without reference to the many official investigations into police misconduct, such as the US Department of Justice's report on police misconduct in Ferguson, Missouri. This is far from an isolated incident. A few bad apples? Then say so. Put it in its context. By avoiding the topic completely you are giving credibility to the complaints about police. (Police perjury in the United States, Police brutality in the United States, Police riots in the United States.) deisenbe (talk) 15:07, 9 September 2017 (UTC)

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Make up of law enforcement

Hello! I was thinking about adding a law enforcement break down of gender and race when it comes to employment by law enforcement in the United States. Does anyone thing that would be a good idea or not? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Clymernl (talk • contribs) 14:33, 16 October 2018 (UTC)

Controversies

I am also going to make a section for the controversies regarding police. More specifically the police shootings in places such as Ferguson. Clymernl (talk) 14:20, 26 October 2018 (UTC)

Controversies

I am also adding some of the race riots in 1960s and the Rodney King related riots in the 1990s.Clymernl (talk) 23:02, 30 October 2018 (UTC)

Federal

I am adding citations to the federal law enforcement part as well as deleting some of them. There was confusion originally as to where certain agencies report.Clymernl (talk) 23:02, 30 October 2018 (UTC)

County and Sheriff

I deleted some of the county police and sheriff information because some of it appeared to be plagiarized and I also added some sources to both parts.Clymernl (talk) 23:02, 30 October 2018 (UTC)

Future

I ran out of time on this project but if someone could add more sources, add to the controversy page, and update some of the information such as salary, that would be a good thing to do.

History

The history section of this page should be examined

1. It is extremely biased
2. it is historically inaccurate, there were obviously existing police activities prior to the 1700's

--97.73.244.150 (talk) 02:49, 14 June 2020 (UTC)

I don't know if editors consider the above concerns still applicable about that section generally, but I find it odd that a claim about the Charleston Guard and Watch is cited to an article about Mennonites, which doesn't clarify the source of the word "crime" in quotes. That article in turn does not provide a citation for the text quoted here, but instead for a phrase in quotes in the next sentence. The cited source is Neil Websdale's "Policing the Poor", though unfortunately Google Books' search inside feature did not help me find the corresponding text there and thus enable me to replace the existing citation with a better one. I don't know how likely it is, but I hope that someone with access to Websdale's text does so. 208.59.185.238 (talk) 00:16, 16 October 2021 (UTC)

Number of cops

Article says there are 17,195 police agencies. I googled “How many police officers in USA?”

How do you have an article that tells you how many agencies without telling you how many cops? Rsleejr (talk) 17:01, 26 June 2020 (UTC)

This chart says there around 700,000 cops in the US, with a peak of 708,000 in 2008 and a sudden dip to 620,000 in 2013, which have since risen to 697,000 in 2019. The current population section has none of this information and it is really confusing if not misleading LutherVinci (talk) 04:13, 15 February 2021 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Introduction to Policy Analysis

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 28 March 2022 and 30 May 2022. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Katielizsp24 (article contribs).

Vice squads

Do we have a page or a section for the vice units in the US police? -- Mhhossein ^talk 12:55, 13 November 2022 (UTC)

There is very little information. Covert operation#Plainclothes law enforcement and Vice#Law enforcement are the only pieces of writing I can find about it. Armeym (talk) 09:19, 2 May 2024 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Senior Seminar

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 9 January 2023 and 28 April 2023. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Lucashodges, KorrynKarau, Popo10-4 (article contribs).

— Assignment last updated by Lucashodges (talk) 18:26, 8 February 2023 (UTC)

First U.S. constable predates the U.S. by over a hundred years...?

"and in 1634 the first U.S. constable on record was Joshua Pratt"

Am I the only one confused by this? How can someone be the first U.S. constable when the U.S. didn't yet exist, and the "constable" died before the U.S.(A). was formed? 83.226.98.151 (talk) 12:47, 21 May 2023 (UTC)

Some US Law Enforcement and legal systems were inherited by the literal United States of America

I would agree with you that a person being appointed constable "in the US in 1634" is impossible though it is possible that they were appointed constable under the given jurisdiction in whatever american colony/territory they happened to be in, likely under British law.

This could be anything from completely incorrect to mostly right with a slight inaccuracy. Definitely look into it, check the references! Good catch.

There are other oddities in US Law enforcement history. For example, the United States Postal Inspection Service was founded by the Continental Congress in 1775 which was before the Continental Congress adopted the Declaration of Independence in 1776. However at least in that example, it was the US's lawmaking body that created the agency, even if their country didn't fully exist yet Armeym (talk) 09:26, 2 May 2024 (UTC)

Removed statement regarding dissemination of arrest records

Removed statement:

"Police departments share arrest information with third-party news organizations that archive names of citizens and legal allegations in a "police blotter". However, even if the allegations are dismissed in court, a citizen may not petition the third-party for removal."

Multiple Issues: no citations, unclear, and incorrect.

The fact that news sites post information about arrests, and there are documented cases in the media where innocent people who are exonerated in court have to then reach out or sometimes take legal action against news agencies to get those articles taken down because they are usually the first thing that comes up in a google search of their name, and that's detrimental to their reputation etc. etc. etc. If that is what this sentence is referring to, then it doesn't belong here. Blotters are public information; arrests are public information; just like court records, etc.. Agencies and courts are legally compelled to post the information or provide it to the public upon request.

If a news agency takes a name from a public arrest or court record and runs a story with it then law enforcement cannot control that behavior; though yes the law enforcement may directly provide or release the information to the media (such as a press conference), it would be public information nonetheless.

As for the line "a citizen may not petition the third-party for removal." This is a active issue relating to those found innocent during the criminal justice process and it has media and legal attention; it is also far more complicated. See these links for a brief example found via quick google search. Saying you can't petition for information removal is just untrue. A more specific statement and explanation about this issue could be added with some research. https://katherineobrienlaw.com/remove-news-article-google-search-internet/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/media/old-arrest-boston-globe-fresh-start/2021/01/22/122cbd0c-5cd1-11eb-b8bd-ee36b1cd18bf_story.html

Anyone who wants to write this section up, by all means! Armeym (talk) 10:01, 2 May 2024 (UTC)

This section has been re-written. Armeym (talk) 23:38, 2 May 2024 (UTC)

Intent to Readd Reverted Section: Civil and Regulatory Law Enforcement (Non-Criminal)

This statement is being posted to abide by the request made in the revert note by the person who deleted the section. The revert note said: "These are not "law enforcement" agencies; please discuss"

The article which was added and then removed discusses elements of non-criminal law enforcement in the United States. There are multiple problems with the revert-note. See below:

1. This article is not a list of law enforcement agencies nor is it a list of criminal law enforcement agencies.
2. There are other types of enforceable laws in the United States aside from criminal law.
3. There are agencies and legal systems in place outside of the criminal legal system that are used to enforce the laws mentioned in point 2.
4. The agencies provided in the section are non-exhaustive examples of civil enforcement organizations. They are not a typical criminal enforcement agency, they may not employ officers or agents, and they may not carry firearms and handcuffs; however, the mechanisms described in the section are a form of enforcing and upholding laws the the US enacted and then put those agencies in charge of dealing with.
5. This article describes types, functions, the history of, powers of, etc. etc. enforcement of law in the US. Things outside of criminal law should be included because enforcement of law is not exclusive to criminal law and the United States has much more law on its books than just codes related to criminal law.

In summary:

The fact that the agencies used as examples of "Civil and Non-criminal law enforcement" are in fact not criminal law enforcement, nor their employees peace officers, does not discount the fact that there are functions within United States to enforce non-criminal law, and there are agencies that participate in investigate and enforcing those laws.

As an example, the fact that the SEC cannot arrest people does not discount the fact that it is an organization that is used to enforce laws. Second sentence of U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission: "The primary purpose of the SEC is to enforce the law against market manipulation." See also: Occupational Safety and Health Administration#Enforcement. If I could give a an alternative example of something else I was planning to add, I would mention parking enforcement; just because a parking enforcement officer is not a peace officer and doesn't have power of arrest does not mean they are not performing law enforcement by issuing a non-criminal citation for an offence prescribed by the law in the vehicle code.

My intent is to readd the reverted section. please discuss Armeym (talk) 23:27, 2 May 2024 (UTC)

The agencies you added back are not law enforcement agencies. Please seek a consensus. Magnolia677 (talk) 18:17, 7 June 2024 (UTC)

I provided a thorough explanation of my thoughts above.

As explained above, part of their function above is to enforce laws.

The definition of law enforcement is too narrow here. There are laws aside from criminal law that are enforced by agencies other than the ones that carry around guns and handcuffs.

This is not a list of criminal law enforcement agencies. It is an explanation of law enforcement in the united states and therefore, it should explain or at least have an example of how non-criminal laws are enforced.

-----

I opened this thread in good faith and received no response or interest from anyone.

When an edit is removed, a discussion is requested (which then receives no response for 1 month), and then the content is re-added only to be removed immediately again...it's not reasonable for ask to gain a consensus.

Wikipedia:Dispute resolution#Discuss with the other party

-----

I am politely requesting that you not remove content that was open to discussion for 1 month prior to its re-addition and which clearly had commented notes in the article indicating to engage in this very thread PRIOR to deletion.

Wikipedia:Edit warring

I am disagreeing with your decision to remove the content again and ask that you seek a consensus before removing the content further; and that you refrain from removing it until a discussion occurs. Solicit outside opinions or arbitration.

Wikipedia:Consensus Armeym (talk) 22:52, 7 June 2024 (UTC)

Disagreeing and reverting a change with a one sentence response and the statement "seek a consensus" twice in a row is not a engaging in a discussion regarding that content.

I would appreciate an actual discussion regarding this topic. Armeym (talk) 22:54, 7 June 2024 (UTC)

This article is about "law enforcement" in the United States. A list of "law enforcement officers" can be viewed here, and it does not include the agencies added in your edit. You seem to have confused "law enforcement agencies" with--as you stated in your edit--"regulatory agencies". I reverted because your edit was WP:UNDUE. --Magnolia677 (talk) 10:12, 8 June 2024 (UTC)

These regulatory agencies are responsible for enforcing non-criminal laws. Sometimes the same agency that regulates is also responsible for enforcement components. Also Law enforcement officer#United States is an incomplete list which is scoped to criminal law enforcement; unrelated to my edit.

My edit simply aimed to provide a brief explanation of some examples of how some of the many non-criminal laws are enforced, and by whom.

The distinction here is criminal vs. non-criminal law. There are many non-criminal laws in the United States and there are a litany of mechanisms in place to enforce them; I feel that an article titled "Law enforcement in the United States" should at least briefly explain that. Armeym (talk) 04:54, 12 June 2024 (UTC)

Citation for 1,280,000 police officers in the US

I started looking for the number of police officers in the US. I found the article and it says more than 1,280,000 officers but there is not citation. So I started looking for citations. This is what I have found:

• 720,652 in 2023 - https://www.statista.com/statistics/191694/number-of-law-enforcement-officers-in-the-us/
• >800,000 - https://nleomf.org/memorial/facts-figures/law-enforcement-facts/
• 646,310 May 2023 - https://www.bls.gov/oes/2023/may/oes333051.htm
• 1,003,270 2019 - https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2019/crime-in-the-u.s.-2019/tables/table-74

The FBI data is the closest (within approximately 25%), I didn't find anything close to the 1,280,000 number. ~ GB fan 20:46, 14 November 2024 (UTC)