Talk:Mongol invasion of Bulgaria and Serbia
Latest comment: 5 years ago by Srnec in topic Asanyd dunasty's (House of Asen) origin
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Unsourced
editTotally unsourced stub, that (i suspect) is a fork. I suspect an AFD maybe in order soon.Slatersteven (talk) 10:34, 15 August 2017 (UTC)
Gona give it a till the weekend.Slatersteven (talk) 08:03, 29 August 2017 (UTC)
Invasion
editWas this an invasion or a raid?Slatersteven (talk) 15:00, 15 September 2017 (UTC)
- Jackson, p. 65: "An indigenous source confirms that the Mongols invaded the Bulgarian kingdom..." He is referring to Roger of Torre Maggiore and Thomas of Spalato. —Srnec (talk) 04:23, 16 September 2017 (UTC)
- It was probably an aggressive reconnaissance - the Mongols were basically passing through to reconnect with the main body of their forces before making other sorties - however, the death of the Great Khan interrupted Batu and Subedei's plans.50.111.59.83 (talk) 00:19, 10 October 2017 (UTC)
Asanyd dunasty's (House of Asen) origin
editThere is a continuous speculation about the origins of the Asen family. Whether Wallachia only was a region and the inhabitants called Wallachians, or there was a separate ethnic group called Wallachians is a separate subject of discussion. The crux of the matter is that Wallachia was an inseparable part of the First Bulgarian empire. Hence, the support of the local nobles for the uprising of the Asen brothers. If you look at the names of Wallachian rulers later on, when they became autonomous, they're all Bulgarian. So the dynastic, cultural and historic link is obvious, natural and continuous from the First Bulgarian empire on.
- RS please?Slatersteven (talk) 13:58, 3 August 2018 (UTC)
- Per Vásáry, p. 41: Taking into consideration everything that has been said so far, the most plausible supposition seems to be that Asen and his family were of Cuman origin. They stood at the head of the liberation movement in Bulgaria, and their chief supporters were their people, the Vlakhs. They must have spoken the language of their Vlakh subjects but preserved the knowledge of their Cuman predecessors' nomadic skills. Moreover, they must have been in close contact with their near relatives in Cumania. That is why they turned to their kinsfolk to help them in their fight against the Byzantine Empire. Rasovskij called the Asenids half-Cumans, and he was right. But the other half was Vlakh, so they may rightly be called Cumano-Vlakhs. In sum, the Asenids were a Cuman dynasty whose members became Vlakhs in the twelfth century and Bulgarians in the thirteenth. Jingiby (talk) 05:39, 3 September 2019 (UTC)
- I have removed the theories added by Emil1975. This is a page about the Mongol invasion in 1242. On the basis of the above quote, I have gone with "Cumans who became Romanized in the 12th century and Slavicized in the 13th". If you object to this, I'd suggest removing all mention of origins. The only reason I added it in the first place was to partially explain why the primary sources call it Vlachia in relation to the Mongol invasion. Srnec (talk) 14:34, 3 September 2019 (UTC)