Talk:Muffin

Muffin as a euphemism

"Bluffin' with my muffin", anyone? 174.95.227.232 (talk) 07:49, 13 November 2011 (UTC) muffins are a yummy thing to eat you can eat them — Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.82.100.10 (talk) 22:21, 29 August 2012 (UTC)

• That's not a common usage though; it's more evidence that anything can be a euphemism in the right context. If I told a girl to come check out my beef on weck... well, I don't know what would happen, but my meaning would likely be clear. Unless I were actually referring to a sandwich. But I don't think Lady Gaga was singing about using baked goods to bluff. --BDD (talk) 18:27, 15 October 2013 (UTC)

Table of nutrients

The table of nutrients only has the nutrients for a blueberry muffin ,Shouldn't it also have the nutrients for other forms of muffins? ACEOREVIVED (talk) 16:46, 22 March 2012 (UTC)

Derpy Hooves

Derpy Hooves is an inspirational character in the hit TV series "breaking bad", She has taken the hearts of many people around the world, Brony or not, she has not had fandom made on Youtube, Facebook ect. 99.178.171.244 (talk) 18:34, 3 May 2012 (UTC)SilverStar

In the episode "Applebuck Season"(S:01-E:04) Pinkie Pie comes out of the kitchen with a tray of cupcakes, ponies crowding in the bakery praise the muffins when Derpy Hooves exclaims "MMM...Muffins!". Fandom now has made fandom of her liking muffins.65.60.157.98 (talk) 10:54, 6 May 2012 (UTC)

"American English"

Article starts with "A muffin is an American English name for a cupcaker." While the word, or that particular meaning of it, may well have begun in the US, it is no longer exclusively American, and I don't think it is right to identify it as such in the first sentence. In Australia, people eat muffins regularly (quite similar to the American ones) - and even though they may be ultimately of American origin, I don't think that occurs to most people. ZackMartin (talk) 12:37, 19 August 2012 (UTC)

I'd guess that the purpose is to stop the complaints from a small proportion of people in the UK who can't believe that the article called (plain) "muffin" isn't about the yeast bread version (called English muffins in much of the world). WhatamIdoing (talk) 03:27, 20 August 2012 (UTC)

We in the UK do not call "English Muffins" muffins. We recognise the "American" Muffin as a muffin, in fact in shops we use the same terminology as the rest of the world and "English" muffins aren't even popular due to Crumpets existing. 92.236.101.139 (talk) 15:13, 7 September 2021 (UTC)

Somewhat belittling and unfounded comment. The proportion may be large, and maybe made of people beyond the UK who on all issues want to ensure that Wikipedia is just an American bias. for shame on them! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.43.152.9 (talk) 21:05, 16 January 2013 (UTC)

I can't agree with 'shame on them'. Wikipedia's blatantly US-centric articles and generally, sometimes laughably, poor editing provides good entertainment for the better educated parts of the world.

Of course, for good-ol'-USofA-ians the reset of the world doesn't really exist, except in Hollywood versions.

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the proposal was not moved. As noted in the following RM, there shouldn't be concurrent RMs on the same page, and it seems clear already that this proposal won't succeed. Since Betrandrussell and Betrand russell 0 are presumably the same user, we'll defer to his more recent request. --BDD (talk) 18:19, 15 October 2013 (UTC)

Muffin → Muffin (American-style) – The word "muffin" (used on its own, i.e. without the phrase "American-style" or "English" preceding it) means different things to English speakers around the world. In the U.K. it will be interpreted to mean an English muffin, and in the U.S. it will be interpreted to mean an American-style muffin. Therefore the logical thing to do is move this page to "Muffin (American-style)" and have a disambiguation page for the page "Muffin" pointing to the various types of bun available. (An analogous case is the page "Football" which doesn't point to either American football, Soccer, or any other style of football, but talks about the various kinds of football in general.) Betrandrussell (talk) 14:37, 13 October 2013 (UTC)

• Oppose words can have different meanings. Hot Stop talk-contribs 14:54, 13 October 2013 (UTC)

? What on earth does this mean? See sourceIn ictu oculi (talk) 23:59, 13 October 2013 (UTC)

if reading comprehension is an issue for you, maybe you shouldn't be chiming in here Hot Stop talk-contribs 03:05, 14 October 2013 (UTC)

Don't be a jerk, Hot Stop. Seriously. 172.56.21.111 (talk) 04:01, 15 October 2013 (UTC)

Whose sock puppet are you? Hot Stop talk-contribs 17:32, 15 October 2013 (UTC)

• Weak oppose: No evidence was given by the proposer to show that this is not the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC for "Muffin" – just that other meanings exist, and unnecessary changes of MOS:ENGVAR are discouraged (MOS:RETAIN). "Muffin" seems different than "football" to me. Outside of the US, "football" has one very dominant meaning that is sufficient to prevent the US meaning from having primary status. But it is not clear that "muffin" (especially when used by itself rather than being coupled with other words, as in "English muffin") has a very dominant meaning outside of the US that differs from the US meaning (except perhaps in the UK). —BarrelProof (talk) 22:04, 13 October 2013 (UTC)
• Comment: The example of the football articles is irrelevant (see also the essay Wikipedia:Other stuff exists). The football page is a separate "dab concept article", which gives a broad, general overview and common history of all sports named "football". There is currently no separate "dab concept article" for "muffin", giving a broad overview of both kinds of muffins. Zzyzx11 (talk) 22:38, 13 October 2013 (UTC)
• Support - In India "muffin" means the same thing as England, a muffin, not a cupcake. The title "English muffin" is also a Americacentric title. Muffin (English) and Muffin (American) would be more inline with WP:AT and WP:WORLDVIEW. The term "American muffin" gets 251 Google Books results many in American books, illustrating that "muffin" on its own is ambiguous. WP:PRIMARYTOPIC does not mean WP:AMERICANTOPIC and the example of "Football" is not just essay Wikipedia:Other stuff exists (which deserves to be nuked as the most stupid essay on Wikipedia) but straight to the point. It is evident that The Great Little Australian Muffin Cookbook in Australia muffins now means American muffins, but in New Zealand muffin may still mean the same as India and Britain]. But the main point here is why should an American muffin not be described as an American muffin when it is American, and distinct from the other muffin? Whom exactly does not indicating American in the title benefit? In ictu oculi (talk) 23:59, 13 October 2013 (UTC)
• Mild oppose without evidence of primary topic, though I strongly support the idea of a football-style semi-disambiguation page if we find there is no primary topic. As a brief aside, there is a world of difference between an American muffin and a cupcake. They're not even remotely similar except for shape as far as baked goods go (which, granted, they are pretty much the same shape, but by size and composition and even coloration they are very easy to distinguish from cupcakes). "English muffin" is a perfect natural disambiguator for the other article. I understand the move proposal here but I wonder to what extent unsweetened British-style muffins can be considered to be as notable as American muffins. The highly ad hoc comparison I just did seems to show that American English speakers refer to muffins a great deal more, relatively speaking, than their British English speaking counterparts. [1] [2] 172.56.21.69 (talk) 02:21, 14 October 2013 (UTC)
• Oppose our article seems to state it is only called "American-style muffin" in the UK, so we would not be enlightening people outside the UK, but confusing them instead. Instead Muffin (cupcake) might be better, if this type of muffin isn't the primary topic of "Muffin". From comments above, it seems this style of muffin is the primary topic... -- 76.65.131.217 (talk) 04:03, 14 October 2013 (UTC)
• Comment what do our Indian and Australian editors think is a muffin and what do they call these two types? -- 76.65.131.217 (talk) 04:04, 14 October 2013 (UTC)
• Oppose. No idea where "American-style muffin" came from. As an Englishman, trust me that nobody in the UK calls it an "American-style muffin". We call it a "muffin" and we all know what we're talking about. What the Americans call an "English muffin" we (ironically) usually only see at McDonald's these days! -- Necrothesp (talk) 09:03, 14 October 2013 (UTC)

Yes, most people would just say "muffin", that's true. But no-one in Britain calls (English) muffins "English muffins" either. Betrand russell 0 (talk) 12:55, 15 October 2013 (UTC)

• Oppose. The parenthetical should be a category or context, not a modifier, especially not a modifier no one uses in the real world. 115.85.18.169 (talk) 12:35, 14 October 2013 (UTC)
• Oppose - Per WP:Engvar & WP:Retain. We don't need to create a dab page, this article explains both items. And from personal experience of vacationing in the UK and Ireland, the supermarkets sold these as "muffins". --Jeremy (blah blah • I did it!) 17:13, 14 October 2013 (UTC)

: Yes, but the supermarkets also sell (English) muffins as just "muffins" Betrand russell 0 (talk) 12:55, 15 October 2013 (UTC)

• Oppose. The American-style muffin is known as a muffin in both the U.S. and UK, the English-style muffin is known as English muffin in the U.S. and both muffin AND English muffin in the UK. It is not confusing to British readers to describe the American-style as simply a muffin, therefore keep as is. The hatnote is sufficient to avoid any confusion. Zarcadia (talk) 13:01, 15 October 2013 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Requested move 2

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Speedy close due to multiple accounts - either new User User:Betrand russell 0 is an impersonation account, or a multiple account of new User User:Betrandrussell. Either way that is not permitted. Plus the response to the 2nd RM is as evident as the first. (non-admin closure) In ictu oculi (talk) 23:27, 15 October 2013 (UTC)

---

Muffin → Muffin (cupcake) – The word "muffin" means different things to English speakers around the world. In the U.K. it will normally be interpreted to mean an English muffin, and in the U.S. it will be normally interpreted to mean an American-style muffin. Therefore the logical thing to do is move this page to "Muffin (cupcake)" and have a disambiguation page for the page "Muffin" pointing to the various types of bun available. This proposal is in response to some of the comments above, so I am putting this proposal forward as well. Note that I have also suggested that "English muffin" be moved to "Muffin (bread)". I would also like to point out, in response to comments that American-style muffins are now more common than English muffins, that (speaking as someone from the UK) American-style muffins are most often seen in American coffee-shops such as Starbucks, so I would hardly call this as indicative of English culture, even if the presence of so many American coffee companies in the UK obviously has an effect on our culture in the long term. Obviously, context is also important, so in a coffee-shop (in the UK) such as Starbucks, when a British person says the word "muffin" there isn't a need to explain which kind of muffin is being talked about, but again, this isn't really representative of English culture in general, considering Starbucks is an American company. Betrand russell 0 (talk) 13:13, 15 October 2013 (UTC)

• Strong oppose. This is borderline trolling considering how little support the above proposal is getting. You don't get to keep throwing shit at the wall to see what sticks. Hot Stop talk-contribs 15:28, 15 October 2013 (UTC)

Two people above mentioned that the parenthetical part "American-style" was not suitable, and one person suggested "cupcake" instead. I wanted to put forward an alternative proposal and get a vote for that as well (considering the voting eventually just boils down to "Yes" or "No"). This seems logical, and reasonable. Your own contributions, on the other hand, have so far been to point out that "words can have different meanings", and then to tell someone to get lost ("if reading comprehension is an issue for you, maybe you shouldn't be chiming in here"), and then to name call (i.e. calling me a "troll" and so on).Betrand russell 0 (talk) 15:43, 15 October 2013 (UTC)

• Close one of these RMs (or both): It's silly to have two RMs open at the same time for the same article – especially with the same proposer (strikethrough since I noticed that it's not the same proposer – rather, it's a proposer with a similar name and similar perspective). —BarrelProof (talk) 16:25, 15 October 2013 (UTC)
• Oppose While WP:NATURAL disambiguation is probably more called for here, the proposed disambiguator doesn't make sense. First of all, muffins and cupcakes aren't the same thing, and even if they were, that's not how disambiguation should be done. Tip (gratuity) will soon be moved to Gratuity, and Football (soccer) was moved to Association football ages ago, because the disambiguating term shouldn't be a synonym. See WP:D on how to pick a proper one. In this case, it's going to be very difficult to come up with a good term to distinguish these muffins from English muffins, hence my hunch that we're better off with the status quo. --BDD (talk) 18:25, 15 October 2013 (UTC)
• Oppose for the reasons given above. In the UK it will not "normally be interpreted to mean an English muffin" and neither are they "most often seen in American coffee-shops such as Starbucks". It will in fact normally be interpreted to mean what is described in this article and they are found everywhere, including all supermarkets, in which they are sold simply as "muffins". What Americans call "English muffins" are in fact rarely seen in the UK these days. I'm starting to think that Betrand russell 0 is not actually from the UK, as I struggle to reconcile my experience of the modern UK with his. And who on earth would describe a muffin as a cupcake? They're entirely different things. -- Necrothesp (talk) 22:01, 15 October 2013 (UTC)

I wouldn't say that the bready sort of muffins are rarely seen in the UK. Down my local supermarket I find the Chocolate muffins and blueberry muffins on a shelf next to the buns and other cakes, if I turn 180 degrees I see (next to the crumpets) the bread muffins - value muffins, all butter muffins, cheese & onion muffins, and cinnamon & sultana muffins.GraemeLeggett (talk) 22:48, 15 October 2013 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

• Oppose: This idea is worse than the last one – e.g., for reasons mentioned by BDD. —BarrelProof (talk) 23:44, 15 October 2013 (UTC)

  (edit conflict) Oops – I guess the discussion closed before I added that remark. I wouldn't have added the remark if I had known the discussion had closed (but now that it has happened, I guess I'll leave it there.) —BarrelProof (talk) 23:51, 15 October 2013 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 20 December 2013

I have new information regaurding muffin history, I request permission to make changes to this artical. Derpy Hooves214 (talk) 15:59, 20 December 2013 (UTC)

We can't give access to individual new users. You may post your suggested changes here, and if someone more experienced supports your suggestion, then that person will make the change for you. Please note that all requests to add trivia about the My Little Pony franchise are declined. WhatamIdoing (talk) 16:32, 20 December 2013 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 12 March 2015

58.166.174.59 (talk) 07:09, 12 March 2015 (UTC) muffins can be sweet ior savarory with eater bana and cherrys or bacon and eggs its up to you\ It was irriginated in Canada and is sered with jam on the sweet or a dressing for the savory thanks

Fascinating words. Do you have an English translation? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.142.227.60 (talk) 11:36, 26 September 2022 (UTC)

Not done: as you have not requested a specific change.
If you want to suggest a change, please request this in the form "Please replace XXX with YYY" or "Please add ZZZ between PPP and QQQ".
Please also cite reliable sources to back up your request, without which no information should be added to, or changed in, any article. - Arjayay (talk) 08:50, 12 March 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 29 April 2017

PrincessMini (talk) 23:03, 29 April 2017 (UTC)

@PrincessMini: You didn't tell us what you wanted changed, so we're unable to make any changes. —C.Fred (talk) 23:04, 29 April 2017 (UTC)

Re-write?

In view of this page being semi-protected, I'm suggesting a re-write rather than just doing the BOLD thing. I feel the current distinction here between “muffins” and “English muffins” may work in the US, but not elsewhere; so I suggest re-organizing the page with a more neutral division between flatbread and quickbread varieties. If there are no objections I will do that in a couple of days. Moonraker12 (talk) 10:34, 6 June 2017 (UTC)

OK, done (finally!) Moonraker12 (talk) 17:32, 4 September 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 10 August 2019

Quote: The word "muffin" is thought to derive from the German mouffin.

This comes from me being a native German: "mouffin" is not a german word. Written that way I'd not even know how to pronounce it. Looks french to me. Please add "citation needed" or remove that sentence.

Check these German dictionary resources:

https://de.wiktionary.org/w/index.php?search=mouffin&title=Spezial%3ASuche&go=Seite&ns0=1 quote "Zu deiner Suchanfrage wurden keine Ergebnisse gefunden." meaning "There have been no results to your search query."

https://www.duden.de/suchen/dudenonline/muffin?ls=mouffin quote "mouffin liefert keine Ergebnisse." meaning "mouffin doesn't yield any results." "Der Duden" being the most official reference in Germany. Vertex rikers (talk) 00:09, 11 August 2019 (UTC)

For edit requests, you generally need to make a precise request. In this case, though, I simply removed this statement as dubious – there's already a better etymology given earlier in the article with which it conflicted anyway. –Deacon Vorbis (carbon • videos) 02:46, 11 August 2019 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 13 December 2019

I would like to edit because there is a song about muffins, and I believe it is called "muffin time" and it is also a meme from my favorite Youtuber. I have edited before, and I was just kinda joking around and put a tittle as "the un-official". I guess I got blocked. But let me edit please UwU and OwO (talk) 12:46, 13 December 2019 (UTC)

 Not done: this is not the right page to request additional user rights. You may reopen this request with the specific changes to be made and someone will add them for you, or if you have an account, you can wait until you are autoconfirmed and edit the page yourself. ‑‑ElHef (Meep?) 13:36, 13 December 2019 (UTC)

Official State Muffin

While part of me finds it difficult to imagine such a thing as an official state muffin, it surely exists as a category. Which leads me to ask, are there more than just those three official state muffins (Massachusetts, Minnesota and New York) for which links to Wikipedia articles are provided? And if so, would some enterprising Wikipedian be sufficiently motivated to start a page called Official State Muffin?

Nuttyskin (talk) 15:55, 21 February 2020 (UTC)

Split English muffin content out of this article?

It's obvious to me from looking at the previous discussions, as well as even the first revision of this page created all the way back in 2003, that this article is intended to be about the American-style muffins. The problem is that this article has become a sort of "catch all" page now that talks about both the US and UK variety of muffins, even while there is already a dedicated English muffin article for that specific variety. There's now an ongoing discussion about merging the poppyseed muffin article into this one, so while that's going on, I was thinking about using this opportunity to be WP:BOLD and move all of the UK variety content from this article into the existing English muffin article but then I figured I'd start a discussion here before doing so in case anyone wants to object first. --TheSameGuy (talk) 05:36, 26 June 2020 (UTC)

I support the proposed split. It's a similar problem as what faces Biscuit and Biscuit (bread). There probably needs to be a move discussion about the final titles for each page but the split can be implemented in the meantime. Ibadibam (talk) 05:32, 29 June 2020 (UTC)

Support, makes sense. --Lord Belbury (talk) 13:58, 31 January 2021 (UTC)

No, I disagree. It is obvious to me, looking at the same discussions (here and in the archive, and at the other talk page) and over the (looong!) edit histories of both these pages, that the issue of what to call these things is pretty divisive. I think the current arrangement, which gives information on both products in a way that avoids labelling them English or American, or (as with the present proposal) simply appropriating the term for one particular style, presents the subject in what is, I hope, a neutral and non-judgemental manner. If it is anomalous that we have a separate page on the English Muffin, then the better thing to do would be to merge it to here, and redirect that title to the flatbread section of this article. Any thoughts on that? Moonraker12 (talk) 17:54, 10 February 2021 (UTC)

I agree with Moonraker12; I am not at all in favour of the balkanization of articles, which practice is like a plague here, sometimes with ludicrous result. English as a language has an affinity for using single words to describe multiple (usually two), at times diverse things but with a thread of a connection, and there's no reason why we shouldn't have articles that cover the different senses of these words, like biscuit or muffin. The individual senses can have their own subarticles too, with more detail in their main articles. There seem to be a common misguided notion that not a sentence of content may be duplicated on this encyclopaedia, and that just isn't so. Overlapped content between articles is good. It is entire articles' content showing up in multiple places that should be kept at minimum. 2600:1702:4960:1DE0:10BA:9558:7F4:32F (talk) 13:08, 7 January 2022 (UTC)

Also, there shouldn't be any pushing of the idea, implicit or otherwise, that the word "muffin" has different meaning in England and America. Both kinds are called muffins in both countries; the one kind may be called "English" muffins in America, but every other type of muffin also requires some descriptor - there's no such thing as a "plain muffin" (unless it's a plain English muffin). 2600:1702:4960:1DE0:10BA:9558:7F4:32F (talk) 13:25, 7 January 2022 (UTC)

Grammar

Can somebody please edit the first paragraph to read “a quickbread” instead of “an quickbread”? The sentence should read correctly absent the parenthetical. It’s actually preferable to remove the parentheses, they’re really not necessary. 2601:183:C180:9F0:8C38:C5AF:43E5:D8C6 (talk) 12:47, 2 April 2022 (UTC)