Talk:Param Bir Singh

BLP violations

User:Tayi Arajakate, you reverted some edits and added the comment "Rv BLP violations; addition of sources such as WPP:TOI". Can you elaborate on the violations, and what does WPP:TOI stand for? Jay (talk) 16:16, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Jay, WPP:TOI was a typo. It should be WP:TOI. BLPs especially when this underdeveloped should not dedicate entire sections to allegations or ongoing controversies while providing minimal background information on the subject themselves. Tayi Arajakate _Talk 18:03, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Can you point me to this BLP policy? Is it Wikipedia:Biographies_of_living_persons#Subjects_notable_only_for_one_event? Jay (talk) 10:57, 28 March 2021 (UTC)

Jay, The principle of WP:BLP in general that articles on biographies should adhere more strongly to a neutral point of view and verifiability would apply here. WP:BLPBALANCE and WP:BLPSTYLE are probably the most relevant in this specific case. I don't believe the subject here is a WP:BLP1E which is usually a notability concern. Tayi Arajakate _Talk 11:26, 28 March 2021 (UTC)

I went through the policies as well as WP:COAT. WP:BLPBALANCE is a sub-section of WP:BLPSTYLE. The other two sub-sections of WP:BLPSTYLE are Tone and Attack pages. Since the text you removed was not attacking the subject, I believe you had concern with the tone. And by that, the concern was with having a separate section, and the section heading, not the content itself. If this was not the case, let me know how do these two sentences that you removed, violate BLP?

"In March 2021, Param Bir Singh moved to Supreme Court of India appealing a CBI probe against Maharashtra's Home Minister Anil Deshmukh regarding the minister's role in an alleged systemic money extortion network active in Maharashtra all of which he detailed in a letter. Hearing the case Supreme Court observed that allegations made by Param Bir were "Serious" but refused to entertain the plea and asked him to move to Bombay High Court." Jay (talk) 10:52, 29 March 2021 (UTC)

Jay, I had concerns about due weight, balance and the reliability of the sources used. I gave my reasoning for removing it as "BLP violation" because the policy recommends that one should adhere more strongly to these issues in biographies. The particular text wasn't attacking him because it omits the counter-allegations and the ongoing investigation against him which would need to be mentioned for balance, but doing so gives disproportionate attention to recent events which shouldn't be present in detail in the article before it is developed enough to give an overview of the rest of his career.

While WP:BLPBALANCE primarily talks about criticism or praise, it also states the following which I think would apply here as well.

The idea expressed in meta:Eventualism—that every Wikipedia article is a work in progress, and that it is therefore okay for an article to be temporarily unbalanced because it will eventually be brought into shape—does not apply to biographies. Given their potential impact on biography subjects' lives, biographies must be fair to their subjects at all times.

Tayi Arajakate _Talk 11:35, 29 March 2021 (UTC)

Reliability of sources: What was the concern with these two references other than WP:TOI that was removed?

Weight and balance: How many sentences does it take to create imbalance? You say that the removed 2 sentences had enough detail to tilt the balance. Does the guideline suggest that for a BLP, even if it is one sentence being added, we need another sentence to counter it? Jay (talk) 20:34, 31 March 2021 (UTC)

What was the concern with these two references other than WP:TOI that was removed?

WP:TOI was the concern with regards to reliability, Hindustan Times has a tendency towards self censorship but that's fairly minor.

You say that the removed 2 sentences had enough detail to tilt the balance.

That isn't what I said but 2 out of 7 sentences being about his accusations towards someone else would create an imbalance, yes. Not to mention that 2 other sentences which are still present in the article, are tangentially related to the events, i.e the one about his removal and succession.

Does the guideline suggest that for a BLP, even if it is one sentence being added, we need another sentence to counter it?

No, it's not about countering anything. Balance requires that all aspects of a situation are fairly and proportionally represented as documented in reliable sources. Omitting certain aspects creates an imbalance.

I don't know what more I can say. I am not against the inclusion in of itself, only so in the current state of the article so I can't see the point of continuing this arguement. Give me a couple of days, I'll expand the article myself and add it back. Tayi Arajakate _Talk 21:47, 31 March 2021 (UTC)

There is no argument yet. I was only asking questions to understand what you meant by violations. From what I observe, any content that shows the subject in a particular light in the entirety of the article will be removed. And since "quantity of text" in WP:WEIGHT is subjective, it can mean even 1 sentence, depending on who the editor is. I look forward to you expanding and improving the article. Jay (talk) 17:59, 3 April 2021 (UTC)

References

POV tag

GreaterPonce665, I cleaned up some of the recent edits. Can you check if the POV tag can be removed? Jay (talk) 05:47, 7 November 2021 (UTC)