Talk:Pulayar

Lets start the Unity

I invite all my people to unite for a better future and security A great fan of Ayyan Kali. 31-Jan-2006

The temple entry struggle was lead by a lot many leaders and was a momentous struggle. Refer Vaikkom struggle etc. Please do not minimalize it by saying Ayyankali won it for all lower castes.

POV and original research vs. scientific angle

There is no need in this article about prominence of individuals of this particular caste. In an encyclopedia, the article about a people group should be as close to the anthropological/ethnological/ethnographic point of view as possible.

Caste-promotion should be left aside. It is of no interest to the readers, and it reflects social/political agendas that are mostly POV. Signed: Shiva 122.162.165.45 (talk) 13:29, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Completely agree with Shiva this article lays stress upon racial features and other social features which are not only doubtful but also difficult to prove or cite. This article would need a complete overhaul. Please add to the discussion on how to improve. thanks 14:44, 18 November 2010 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by TheBigA (talk • contribs)

Title

It looks like people have been trying to retitle this article so that it refers primarily to Cheramar rather than Pulayar. Articles are titled, and their subject referred to therein, according to the guidelines laid out at WP:COMMONNAME. If you think that Cheramar is the common name per those criteria then please follow the procedure outlined at Requested Moves. - Sitush (talk) 12:19, 20 October 2017 (UTC)

Pulayars were not untouchables in Sangakaalam

From Madras District Gazetteers: South Arcot by Madras (India: State), B. S. Baliga (Rao Bahadur) (1962)

In fact, in the Sangam and post-Sangam literature, Tamilaham was described as the land inhabited by a large number of communities such as,

1) Velir, who are identified with Vellalar

2) Karalar (agriculturists)

3) Kuravar (hillmen)

4) Vedar and Vettuvar (hunters)

5) Kurumbar and Idayar (shepherds)

6) Paradavar (fisherfolk)

7) Pulayar (who executed death sentences)

8) Paraiyar (who proclaimed royal order)

9) Tunnakarar (tailors)

10) Kadambar, Eyinar, Marayar (martial community)

11) Panar(bards/poets)

12) Koottar (jugglers/wizard/magician)

13) Yavanar (merchants from Greece and Rome)

14) Naga (serpent-worshippers)

15) Vadugar (people from the North of Venkatam hills)

16) Kosar (people from the Tulu country)

There is also evidence to suggest that Raja Raja I recruited as his warriors and chiefs members from diverse communities living at the margin of the Kaveri heartland. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.96.14.28 (talk) 17:22, 12 July 2018 (UTC)

Revert

I have just reverted to the "last best version" of Sept last year. There has been a lot of activity since then but little of use. We must source stuff but the research at Shodganga is often very poor quality & past discussion at WT:IND favoured avoiding it. - Sitush (talk) 16:39, 18 June 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 9 August 2020

Please change are an untouchable caste to were a backward caste Cheriansamuel (talk) 14:25, 9 August 2020 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. ◢  Ganbaruby!  (Say hi!) 14:53, 9 August 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 27 December 2020

Lead has academic errors. Opening sentence The Pulayar were an untouchable caste in Hinduism implies they no longer exist, Pulayars are still present vastly across Kerala. You cannot change it to are an untouchable caste either as they are no longer an untouchable caste, untouchability does not exist anymore and is punishable by law, and they are not "a caste in Hinduism" (unsourced and unnecessary), its a "caste in Kerala state". Since they still lives, the lead should begin with identifying who they are (scheduled caste):

The Pulayar are a community primarily found in Kerala, India, who are classified as Scheduled caste by the government of Kerala. They were the main agrarian society in the state. In Malayalam, the word "pulaya" means a person who either "owns the land" or "works on land". 2409:4073:2E8F:D9B:DC91:3991:8371:A4CD (talk) 08:55, 27 December 2020 (UTC)

References

 Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit semi-protected}} template. The fact that they were an untouchable community is relevant to their history, so this will need more discussion. If they still fit the category of Dalit then we should word it like Pasi (caste), i.e. Pulayar... are a Dalit (untouchable) caste.... Either way, we'll need some discussion before proceeding. Primefac (talk) 15:40, 27 December 2020 (UTC)

Problems in the lead

Lead has academic errors. Opening sentence The Pulayar were an untouchable caste in Hinduism ... implies they no longer exist, Pulayars are still present vastly across Kerala. You cannot change it to are an untouchable caste either as they are no longer an untouchable caste, untouchability does not exist anymore and is punishable by law, and they are not "a caste in Hinduism" (unsourced too), its a "caste in Kerala". Since they still lives, the lead should begin with identifying who they are (scheduled caste):

The Pulayar are a community primarily found in Kerala, India, who are classified as Scheduled caste by the government of Kerala. Traditionally, they were an agrarian society; in Malayalam, the word "pulaya" means a person who either "owns the land" or "works on land".

They were once an untouchable caste should come after this sentence or should be moved to the body. 117.230.180.109 (talk) 13:38, 11 January 2021 (UTC)

References

Semi-protected edit request on 21 May 2021

Remove untouchable word from the content 115.114.116.18 (talk) 16:41, 21 May 2021 (UTC)

 Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit semi-protected}} template. Primefac (talk) 16:45, 21 May 2021 (UTC)

Pulayar is not a cast

1. That to request about a correction about the subject 'Pulayar' (also Pulaya, Pulayas)that it is not a cast but it is a name addressed to the people who work on land (farm) in different casts mainly in southern parts of India.

2. That 'Pulam' (soil, land, mud etc.). 'Pulayar' means 'one who works on land'. That can be any person belongs to any cast.

3. That there are different kinds of 'pulayars' in different cast some of them are viz: Vettava pulaya, Ullada pulaya, Malaya pulaya, Paraya pulaya, Ezhava pulaya, Nair pulaya etc.

4. That according to the Wikipedia it is stated that "The Pulayar, IPA: [pulɐjɐr], (also Pulaya, Pulayas, Cherumar, Cheramar, and Cheraman) is a caste[1] group mostly found in the southern part of india". Which is actually wrong and error.

5.That (Cherumar, Cheramar, and Cheraman) are the people belonging to the Chera Dynasty and 'Pulayar' can be any person belonging to any cast who works on land.

5. That to make in notice that 'Pulayar' is not a cast and is erroneously considered as a cast. Dev Akhil (talk) 19:14, 7 April 2022 (UTC)

Add more history's about pulaya

Before varna system pulayas are not avarnas they are high classes Pappully krishna (talk) 10:01, 2 September 2023 (UTC)

Why it is not tamil nadu and kernataka

The Pulaya caste is primarily found in Kerala, India, due to historical and cultural factors. Here's why they are not commonly found in Tamil Nadu and Karnataka:

• Kerala's Unique History:*

1. Kerala's geographical isolation and distinct cultural heritage contributed to the development of a unique social structure, including the Pulaya caste. 2. The region's history of being a major spice trading hub, with influences from various cultures, shaped the social and economic dynamics, leading to the emergence of the Pulaya community.

• Tamil Nadu's Different Caste Dynamics:*

1. Tamil Nadu has a different caste hierarchy, with the Dalits being the largest marginalized community. 2. The region's history of being a major center of Hinduism and the presence of powerful temple complexes influenced the development of a distinct caste system, which did not include the Pulaya caste.

• Karnataka's Regional Variations:*

1. Karnataka has a diverse range of castes and communities, with regional variations in caste dynamics. 2. The state's history of being a part of various kingdoms and empires, including the Vijayanagara Empire, contributed to the development of a unique social structure, which did not include the Pulaya caste.

• Migration and Settlement Patterns:*

1. Historical migration and settlement patterns also played a role in the distribution of the Pulaya caste. 2. The Pulayas were traditionally agricultural laborers and were often bound to specific estates or regions, limiting their mobility and migration to other areas.

• Cultural and Linguistic Factors:*

1. Language and culture also played a significant role in shaping the distribution of the Pulaya caste. 2. The Pulayas have a distinct cultural identity, closely tied to the Malayalam language and Kerala's cultural heritage, which may have limited their migration and settlement in other regions.

These factors combined to make Kerala the primary region where the Pulaya caste is found. However, it's essential to note that there may be small communities of Pulayas in Tamil Nadu and Karnataka, particularly in areas with historical trade and cultural exchange with Kerala.

Where is historical, cultural and present day existance?

The Pulaya caste has a rich historical, cultural, and present-day existence in Kerala, India. Here's an overview:

• Historical Existence:*

- Ancient Kerala (300 BCE - 500 CE): The Pulayas were mentioned in ancient Kerala texts, such as the Mahabharata and the Puranas, as a distinct community. - Medieval Kerala (500 - 1500 CE): The Pulayas were agricultural laborers and were bound to specific estates or regions. - Colonial Era (1500 - 1947 CE): The Pulayas were subjected to colonial exploitation and were forced to adopt Western customs, leading to a loss of their traditional way of life.

• Cultural Existence:*

- Traditional Crafts: The Pulayas are skilled in traditional crafts like weaving, pottery, and woodcarving. - Folk Music and Dance: The Pulayas have a unique tradition of folk music and dance, such as the "Pulaya Kambalam" and "Thullal". - Cuisine: The Pulayas have a distinct cuisine, with dishes like "Pulaya Sadya" and "Thoran". - Festivals: The Pulayas celebrate traditional festivals like "Pulaya Thirunal" and "Onam".

• Present-Day Existence:*

- Kerala, India: The Pulayas are primarily found in Kerala, particularly in the districts of Alappuzha, Kottayam, and Pathanamthitta. - Population: The estimated population of Pulayas in Kerala is around 1.5 million. - Social Status: The Pulayas are still considered a marginalized community, with limited access to education, healthcare, and economic opportunities. - Economic Activities: Many Pulayas are still agricultural laborers, while others have moved to urban areas for better opportunities. - Cultural Revival: Efforts are being made to revive and promote Pulaya culture, including their traditional music, dance, and crafts.

• Notable Pulaya Communities:*

- Alappuzha District: The Pulayas in Alappuzha are known for their traditional crafts and folk music. - Kottayam District: The Pulayas in Kottayam are known for their expertise in agriculture and aquaculture. - Pathanamthitta District: The Pulayas in Pathanamthitta are known for their traditional dance and music.

• Challenges and Opportunities:*

- Social and Economic Marginalization: The Pulayas continue to face significant social and economic challenges. - Cultural Revival: Efforts to revive and promote Pulaya culture offer opportunities for cultural exchange and empowerment. - Education and Healthcare: Initiatives to improve access to education and healthcare can help address the community's needs. - Economic Development: Opportunities for economic development, such as entrepreneurship and skill training, can help improve the community's socio-economic status. Historically related to which state?

   Here's a historical overview of the Pulaya caste:

• Ancient Period (300 BCE - 500 CE)*

- The Pulayas were mentioned in ancient Kerala texts, such as the Mahabharata and the Puranas, as a distinct community. - They were likely agricultural laborers and were bound to specific estates or regions.

• Medieval Period (500 - 1500 CE)*

- The Pulayas were subject to the feudal system, with limited rights and freedoms. - They were forced to adopt Hinduism and were incorporated into the lower rungs of the caste system.

• Portuguese Colonization (1500 - 1663 CE)*

- The Pulayas were exploited by Portuguese colonizers, who forced them to work in plantations and mines. - Many Pulayas converted to Christianity during this period.

• Dutch Colonization (1663 - 1799 CE)*

- The Pulayas continued to face exploitation and oppression under Dutch rule. - They were forced to work in plantations and were subjected to harsh labor conditions.

• British Colonization (1799 - 1947 CE)*

- The Pulayas were subject to British colonial rule, which further marginalized and oppressed them. - They were forced to adopt Western customs and were subjected to forced labor.

• Indian Independence (1947 CE - present)*

- The Pulayas gained freedom from colonial rule, but continued to face social and economic marginalization. - Efforts have been made to address their grievances and promote their rights, but much work remains to be done.

• Notable Events and Movements*

- The 19th-century social reform movement led by E.V. Ramasamy (Periyar) aimed to empower the Pulayas and other marginalized communities. - The 20th-century Kerala Land Reforms Act aimed to redistribute land to landless laborers, including the Pulayas. - Ongoing efforts to promote Pulaya culture, language, and rights continue to this day.

• Historical Figures*

- E.V. Ramasamy (Periyar): A social reformer who worked to empower the Pulayas and other marginalized communities. - K.V. Thomas: A Pulaya leader who played a key role in the Kerala State Congress Party and advocated for the rights of marginalized communities. - Many Pulaya artists, writers, and intellectuals have made significant contributions to Kerala's cultural landscape. Historically were from where did they originate and where they present??

The Pulaya caste has a rich and complex history, with roots dating back to ancient times. Here's an overview of their origins and historical presence:

• Origins:*

- The Pulayas are believed to have originated from the indigenous tribes of Kerala, specifically the Adi Dravida communities. - They were likely one of the earliest inhabitants of Kerala, with a history dating back to the Neolithic period (3000 BCE - 1500 BCE). - The Pulayas were skilled in agriculture, fishing, and crafts, and were closely tied to the land and natural resources.

• Historical Presence:*

- Ancient Kerala (300 BCE - 500 CE): The Pulayas were mentioned in ancient Kerala texts, such as the Mahabharata and the Puranas, as a distinct community. - Medieval Kerala (500 - 1500 CE): The Pulayas were present in various regions of Kerala, including the kingdoms of Chera, Chola, and Pandya. - Portuguese Colonization (1500 - 1663 CE): The Pulayas were present in the coastal regions of Kerala, particularly in the areas around Kochi and Calicut. - Dutch Colonization (1663 - 1799 CE): The Pulayas were present in the regions of Kerala under Dutch control, including the areas around Trivandrum and Kollam. - British Colonization (1799 - 1947 CE): The Pulayas were present throughout Kerala, with significant populations in the districts of Alappuzha, Kottayam, and Pathanamthitta.

• Regional Presence:*

- Alappuzha District: The Pulayas have a long history in Alappuzha, with many communities present in the region. - Kottayam District: The Pulayas have a significant presence in Kottayam, with many communities located in the areas around Kottayam city. - Pathanamthitta District: The Pulayas have a strong presence in Pathanamthitta, with many communities located in the areas around Pathanamthitta city. - Other Districts: The Pulayas are also present in smaller numbers in other districts of Kerala, including Thrissur, Palakkad, and Malappuram.

• Migration and Settlement:*

- The Pulayas have migrated and settled in various regions of Kerala throughout history, often in response to changes in land ownership, economic opportunities, and social conditions. - Many Pulayas have also migrated to urban areas, such as Kochi and Trivandrum, in search of better economic opportunities.

Please note that the historical presence and migration patterns of the Pulayas are complex and multifaceted, and this overview provides a general outline of their history and geography.

Why Not in tamilnadu, then how did they came in old tamil scriptures?

The Pulaya caste is mentioned in ancient Tamil scriptures, despite being primarily associated with Kerala. There are several theories about how they came to be mentioned in Tamil scriptures:

_Geographical Overlap:_

- The ancient Tamil kingdoms, such as the Chera, Chola, and Pandya, extended into present-day Kerala, encompassing areas where the Pulayas resided. - This geographical overlap would have led to cultural, economic, and social interactions between the Tamil-speaking regions and the Pulaya communities.

_Trade and Cultural Exchange:_

- The ancient Tamil kingdoms were major trading centers, with extensive trade networks extending to Kerala and other regions. - This trade and cultural exchange would have led to the exchange of ideas, customs, and people, including the Pulayas.

_Migration and Settlement:_

- Some Pulaya communities may have migrated to Tamil Nadu from Kerala, settling in areas with similar cultural and economic conditions. - This migration would have led to the presence of Pulayas in Tamil Nadu, who were then mentioned in ancient Tamil scriptures.

_Influence of Kerala Kingdoms:_

- The ancient Kerala kingdoms, such as the Chera, had significant influence over the Tamil kingdoms, particularly the Chola. - This influence would have led to the presence of Kerala communities, including the Pulayas, in Tamil scriptures.

_Examples of Pulaya Mentions in Tamil Scriptures:_

- The ancient Tamil text, the Purananuru (300 BCE - 300 CE), mentions the Pulayas as a distinct community. - The Silappatikaram (2nd century CE), a Tamil epic, mentions the Pulayas as agricultural laborers. - The Manimekalai (2nd century CE), a Tamil epic, mentions the Pulayas as a community living in the coastal regions of Tamil Nadu.

These theories suggest that the Pulayas were mentioned in ancient Tamil scriptures due to geographical overlap, trade and cultural exchange, migration and settlement, and the influence of Kerala kingdoms on Tamil Nadu.

How they present in karnataka?
      The Pulaya caste is not traditionally associated with Karnataka, but there are a few possible explanations for their presence in the region:

• Historical Influence*

- The Kingdom of Mysore, which once covered parts of present-day Karnataka and Kerala, may have had influence over Pulaya communities. - This influence could have led to the presence of Pulayas in Karnataka, particularly during the 18th and 19th centuries.

• Migration and Settlement*

- Some Pulaya communities may have migrated to Karnataka from Kerala in search of better economic opportunities or due to other factors. - They may have settled in areas with similar cultural and economic conditions, such as rural or semi-urban areas.

• Modern-Day Migration*

- In recent times, some Pulayas may have migrated to Karnataka for education, employment, or other purposes. - They may be living in urban areas, such as Bangalore, Mysore, or Hubli, and engaged in various occupations.

• Pulaya Communities in Karnataka*

- There are reportedly small Pulaya communities in Karnataka, particularly in districts like:

   - Bangalore Rural
   - Mysore
   - Hubli-Dharwad
   - Belgaum

- These communities may be engaged in various occupations, such as agriculture, labor, or service sectors.

• Numbers and Percentage*

- According to the 2011 Census, the population of Pulayas in Karnataka is relatively small, with estimates ranging from 10,000 to 50,000 individuals. - This represents a tiny fraction of Karnataka's total population, approximately 0.01-0.05%.

• Regions with Pulaya Presence*

- Bangalore Rural - Mysore - Hubli-Dharwad - Belgaum - Other districts with smaller Pulaya populations

Please note that the presence of Pulayas in Karnataka is relatively limited compared to Kerala, and more research is needed to understand their history, culture, and experiences in the region.

So Karnataka & Tamil is not ethinity?

The Pulaya caste is not a traditional ethnicity associated with Karnataka or Tamil Nadu. They are primarily found in Kerala, India.

_Karnataka:_

- The Pulayas are not a native community in Karnataka. - Any Pulaya presence in Karnataka is likely due to migration from Kerala or other factors.

_Tamil Nadu:_

- The Pulayas are not a traditional community in Tamil Nadu. - Although they are mentioned in ancient Tamil scriptures, their presence in Tamil Nadu is not significant.

_Ethnicity and Identity:_

- The Pulayas have a distinct ethnicity and identity rooted in Kerala's culture and history. - Their traditions, language, and customs are closely tied to Kerala's unique cultural heritage.

_Regional Ethnicities:_

- Karnataka has its own distinct ethnic groups, such as the Kannadiga, Kodava, and Toda. - Tamil Nadu has its own ethnic groups, such as the Tamil, Tamilselvan, and Yerava.

_Pulaya Ethnicity:_

- The Pulayas are a distinct ethnic group with their own language, customs, and traditions. - Their ethnicity is closely tied to Kerala's culture and history.