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Talk:Same-sex adoption/Archive 2

< Talk:Same-sex adoption
Latest comment: 2 years ago by CX Zoom in topic Requested move 4 March 2022
Archive 1Archive 2

Neutrality?

Latest comment: 9 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

It seems like the section "Opponents of adoption by LGBT people usually cite the following arguments" has some pretty bad POV in it and isn't neutral at all.

Opponents of adoption by LGBT people usually cite the following arguments:

  • suggesting that homosexual couples would make children develop vaguely defined "unwanted traits,"[1] accusations that gay parents lack "parental competence"[2] or other heterosexist arguments[3][4][5]

By using the word "suggesting" the whole argument is made less valid, "vaguely defined" is really obvious POV which especially has no place in the section "Opponents usually make arguments". This implies that they don't have any valid arguments and only talk empty phrases, which really has no place in an encyclopedia. And "heterosexist arguments"? Accusing people of sexism in an encyclopedia... That is just bad

  • naming individual cases of parental abuse[6]

"naming individual cases" again implies that the opponents don't have valid arguments; argumentation technique is of no importance, especially when talking about the arguments a group of people usually makes.

  • religious reasons[7]

Could be extended to match the length of a pro point, but is fine.

  • vague accusations of violating child's rights[8]

"Vague accusations" is Pov language yet again

I haven't changed anything yet as I'm kind of a newbie on enwiki, but the whole section needs to be changed/rewritten. IntoDarkness (talk) 15:20, 27 June 2015 (UTC)

References

  1. ^ http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1300/J461v03n04_05#.VI-CG89ybtQ
  2. ^ Cite error: The named reference link.springer.com was invoked but never defined (see the help page).
  3. ^ Berebitsky, Julie. “Family ideals and the social construction of modern adoption: a historical perspective,” Adoptive Families in a Diverse Society 29-42. ed. Katarina Wegar. New Brunswick, NJ: Rutgers University Press. 2006.
  4. ^ Anderssen, Norman & Christine Amlie & Erling André Ytterøy. “Outcomes for children with lesbian or gay parents. A review of studies from 1978 to 2000,” Scandinavian Journal of Psychology 43 (4), 335–351. September 2002. Accessed online: http://www.blackwellsynergy. com/doi/full/10.1111/1467-9450.00302.
  5. ^ http://inequality.cornell.edu/people/PapersAbstracts/Rengert_paper.pdf
  6. ^ http://www.przewodnik-katolicki.pl/nr/spoleczenstwo_i_kultura/dzieci_homoseksualistow.html
  7. ^ https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/why-homosexual-adoption-is-not-a-right
  8. ^ http://wpolityce.pl/polityka/201733-prof-zoll-adopcja-przez-pare-homoseksualna-to-naruszenie-praw-dziecka

Updating LGBT adoption Page

Ok, I'm a bit of a newbie at using Wiki, but certain areas need some updating and clarification;

  • Debate:Arguments:The "Catholic Answers" seems to be supporting the Same-sex adoption case; needs clarification
  • Image for global laws of Legal Status needs to be updated, some countries have now changed laws but are not reflected in the image
  • Asia: I'm sure that there a laws that relate to same-sex adoption in OTHER ASIAN COUNTRIES, for example, China or Japan, right? I don't know specifically what their laws are, but I'm sure that they have some.
  • Summary of laws by jurisdiction: Inserting an Asian table and making an Oceania table that would combine the (current) Australasian table with the laws from other Oceanic countries. There is more to Asia than just the commonly known West Asia (Middle and Near East). There's China, Japan, North Korea and South Korea, as well as many more that all have various systems of governments and laws. Should someone find them, please put them up; either on the Talk page so others can table the results or do it yourself, that would be great so that the LGBT Adoption page is a little less White-centric and more encyclopaedic.

Thanks, Dr Crazy 102 02:31, 29 June 2015 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Drcrazy102 (talk • contribs)

Mexico

Latest comment: 9 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

[1] — kwami (talk) 20:10, 17 August 2015 (UTC)

Response

Latest comment: 9 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

My argument essay states that a child raised by a homosexual couple will not have any repercussions to their childhood. This article on Wikipedia, LGBT adoption offers a debate content in which I’ll be focusing on. The first of this series is the opposing arguments on this topic. Noting that homosexuals have a higher tendency of depression which can suffer the child, along with not having both sexes as parents can hinder their experience. Both of these are often heard, along with mentioned in the article a lot of. The American Psychological Association informed that though the fear that homosexual parents will abuse children, this is not supported by any research that has been conducted. Many religious adoption agencies had ended due to the refusal of adopting to a same sex couple in response to what they believed in. With a list of reasons why it doesn’t make up for a disaster, opponents state for religious reasoning, lack of parental competence, and having the child develop unwanted traits is what will hold a couple from raising a child. With public opinion, by a 2007 CNN poll, 57% of respondents felt gays should have the right to adopt 40% did not. This information was conducted awhile ago, since this past months of 2015 legalization of gay marriage is across the United States. Just from our improvements, since July 2015, national debates on LGBT parenthood are held in Australia, Chile, Poland, Germany, Portugal, and Slovakia. Some improvement, unfortunately, doesn’t happen world wide as we’d like. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.62.206.226 (talk) 21:34, 2 October 2015 (UTC)

Latest comment: 9 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

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Using tables for chronology sorting and making existing tables "sortable"

Latest comment: 8 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Is there any reason that the Legal status section does not use a sortable table to show the dates with a "states" and possible "Notes" column for further information/clarification?

Also, is there any reason that the existing tables from Summary of laws by jurisdiction section do not use the "sortable" function so as to allow for easier access to information such as "I want to know what countries do and don't allow 'joint petitions'?" Please note that the (notes) inside these cells can still be kept where they are but would be sortable?

So my proposed revision of the tables would be:

Full joint adoption by same-sex couples is currently legal in the following countries, states and territories
Country States and/or Territories affected Year that full, joint adoption rights came into effect
Andorra 2014 [1]
Argentina 2010 [2]
Austria 2016 [3][4]
Belgium 2006 [5]
Brazil 2010 [6]
Canada 1995 [7][8]
Colombia 2015 [9]
Australia Australian Capital Territory 2004 [10]
New South Wales 2010 [11]
Tasmania 2013 [citation needed]
Victoria 2016 [citation needed]
Western Australia 2002 [10]
Denmark 2010 [12]
Greenland 2015 [13]
Finland 2017
France 2013 [14]
Iceland 2006 [15]
Ireland 2015 [16]
Israel 2008 [citation needed]
Luxembourg 2015 [17][18]
Malta 2014 [19]
Netherlands 2001 [20]
New Zealand 2013 [20]
Mexico Coahuila 2014 [21]
Mexico City 2010 [22]
Norway 2009 [23]
Portugal 2015 [24]
South Africa 2002 [25]
Spain 2005 [26]
Sweden 2003 [27]
United Kingdom, Crown Dependencies and British Overseas Territories England 2005 [28]
Wales 2005 [29]
Scotland 2009 [30]
Northern Ireland 2013 [31][32]
Gibraltar 2014 [33]
Isle of Man 2011 [34]
Jersey 2012 [35]
Pitcairn Islands 2015 [36]
United States Nationwide 2015, except for Mississippi [37][38][39][40]
Partial coverage 1993, some states and territories allowed adoption [citation needed]
Uruguay 2009 [41][42]

The following countries permit step-child adoption in which the partner in a relationship can adopt the natural, and in case of Germany, the adopted child of his or her partner:

I would not be opposed to possibly splitting the countries with partial rights in states, territories, etc. into a separate table, but I'll let the responses decide that; I am aware that using the sortable function can "split" the rowspanning cells into individual 1x1 cells, but only if the function is used.

The Summary of laws by jurisdiction would simply need class="wikitable sortable" placed into its respective tables.

Cheers, Doctor Crazy in Room 102 of The Mental Asylum 02:26, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

References

References

  1. ^ (in Catalan) Llei 34/2014, del 27 de novembre, qualificada de les unions civils i de modificació de la Llei qualificada del matrimoni, de 30 de juny de 1995
  2. ^ "Argentina Passes Gay Marriage Law". Towardfreedom.com. 15 July 2010. Retrieved 13 September 2010.
  3. ^ "Austrian court rules to allow same-sex adoptions". The Privateer. Retrieved 26 July 2015.
  4. ^ Sputnik (14 January 2015). "Austrian Constitutional Court Lifts Ban on Adoptions by Same-Sex Couples". Retrieved 26 July 2015.
  5. ^ David Morton Rayside. Queer inclusions, continental divisions: public recognition of sexual diversity in Canada and the United States. University of Toronto Press, 2008. p. 388 (p. 20). ISBN 0-8020-8629-2.
  6. ^ "Homosexual couples can adopt children, decides to Supreme Court of Justice". Athosgls.com.br. 27 April 2010. Retrieved 16 March 2013.
  7. ^ ACC (31 May 2007). "FAQ's". ACC. Retrieved 6 November 2015.
  8. ^ CBC News (12 Jan 2012). "Timeline: Same Sex Rights in Canada". CBC News. Retrieved 6 November 2015.
  9. ^ http://www.eltiempo.com/politica/justicia/fallo-de-la-corte-constitucional-sobre-la-adopcion/16421486
  10. ^ a b Shelly Dahl (4 August 2007). "Stop the proposed same-sex adoption ban". Green Left. Retrieved 21 January 2010.
  11. ^ "Adoption Amendment (Same Sex Couples) Bill 2010 (No 2) – NSW Parliament". Parliament.nsw.gov.au. Retrieved 13 September 2010.
  12. ^ Gays given equal adoption rights Archived 8 May 2010 at the Wayback Machine
  13. ^ "Parliament in Greenland unanimously approves same-sex marriage". PinkNews. Retrieved 26 July 2015.
  14. ^ "François Hollande signs same-sex marriage into law - FRANCE". FRANCE 24. 18 May 2013. Retrieved 2 November 2013.
  15. ^ David Morton Rayside. Queer inclusions, continental divisions: public recognition of sexual diversity in Canada and the United States. University of Toronto Press, 2008. p. 388 (p. 21). ISBN 0-8020-8629-2.
  16. ^ "Irish senators approve same-sex adoption bill". PinkNews. Retrieved 26 July 2015.
  17. ^ "Le mariage pour tous dès le 1er janvier 2015" (in French). L'essentiel. 17 July 2014. Retrieved 18 July 204. {{cite news}}: Check date values in: |accessdate= (help)
  18. ^ Mémorial (Official Journal of the Grand-Duchy of Luxembourg). "Réforme du mariage" (PDF) (in French). Retrieved 18 July 2014.
  19. ^ Wong, Curtis M. (14 April 2014). "Malta Legalizes Gay Partnerships, Adoption Rights". Huffington Post.
  20. ^ a b "Gay Marriage Goes Dutch". CBS News. Associated Press. 1 April 2001. Retrieved 21 January 2010.
  21. ^ Jesús Castro (12 February 2014). "Ya pueden parejas gay adoptar en Coahuila; PAN vota en contra" (in Spanish). Vanguardia. Retrieved 12 February 2014.
  22. ^ americas/#storyContinued "Mexico City's gay marriage law takes effect". MSNBC. Associated Press. 4 March 2010. Retrieved 6 March 2010. {{cite news}}: Check |url= value (help)
  23. ^ "Norway passes law approving gay marriage". MSNBC. Associated Press. 17 June 2008. Retrieved 21 January 2010.
  24. ^ "Portugal Allows Same-Sex Adoption, Artificial Insemination". ABC News. Associated Press. 20 November 2015. Retrieved 20 November 2015.
  25. ^ Windy City Media Group (1 October 2002). "South Africa OKs Gay Adoption". Retrieved 21 January 2010.
  26. ^ McLean, Renwick (1 July 2005). "Spain gives approval to gay unions". The New York Times.
  27. ^ "Sweden legalises gay adoption". BBC News Online. 6 June 2002. Retrieved 21 January 2010.
  28. ^ UK Gay News (30 December 2005). "New Adoption Law Gives Gay Couples Joint Rights". Retrieved 21 January 2010.
  29. ^ UK Gay News (30 December 2005). "New Adoption Law Gives Gay Couples Joint Rights". Retrieved 21 January 2010.
  30. ^ Ellen Thomas (20 September 2009). "New legislation sees gay Scottish couples win right to adopt children". Herald Scotland. Retrieved 21 January 2010.
  31. ^ BBC News (11 December 2013). [http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk- northern-ireland-25332917 "Gay adoption: Northern Ireland ban lifted"]. Retrieved 11 December 2013. {{cite news}}: Check |url= value (help); line feed character in |url= at position 31 (help)
  32. ^ Northern Ireland Department of Health, Social Services and Public Safety. "Adoption - Frequently Asked Questions". Retrieved 5 February 2014.
  33. ^ "Gibraltar approves civil partnerships bill ·". Pinknews.co.uk. 2014-03-21. Retrieved 2014-06-29.
  34. ^ "New laws raise hopes for more adoptions in Isle of Man". Bbc.co.uk. 2011-04-15. Retrieved 2014-06-29.
  35. ^ "Jersey's civil partnership law comes into force". Bbc.co.uk. 2012-04-02. Retrieved 2014-06-29.
  36. ^ "GayLawNet®™ - Laws - Pitcairn - PN". Retrieved 26 July 2015. {{cite web}}: C1 control character in |title= at position 11 (help)
  37. ^ Human Rights Campaign (2008). "Adoption Laws: State by State". Retrieved 21 January 2010.
  38. ^ "How To Adopt". Mnadopt.org. 1 August 2012. Retrieved 5 December 2013.
  39. ^ "Greenwood and Fink (Providence, RI) – all legal services for same-sex adopting couples and more". Lesbiangayadoption.com. Retrieved 5 December 2013.
  40. ^ http://www.lifelongadoptions.com/lgbt-adoption-resources/lgbt-adoption- laws/wyoming
  41. ^ Yanina Olivera (9 September 2009). "Uruguay approves Latin America's first gay adoption law". AFP. Retrieved 21 January 2010.
  42. ^ AQ Online. "Uruguay Bill Permitting Same-sex Couples to Adopt Becomes Law". Americasquarterly.org. Retrieved 16 March 2013.
  43. ^ "Joe. My. God.: Croatia Approves Civil Unions". Retrieved 26 July 2015.
  44. ^ Τέθηκε σε ισχύ η πολιτική συμβίωση στην Κύπρο
  45. ^ "Kooseluseadus" (in Estonian). Riigikogu. Retrieved 9 October 2014.
  46. ^ Daniel Ottosson (November 2006). europe.org/content/download/6444/39689/version/1/file/World+legal+wrap+up+survey++November2006.pdf "LGBT world legal wrap up survey" (PDF). International Lesbian and Gay Association (ILGA). Retrieved 21 January 2010. {{cite web}}: Check |url= value (help)
  47. ^ "German Court Strengthens Gay and Lesbian Adoption Rights - SPIEGEL ONLINE". Spiegel.de. Retrieved 16 March 2013.
  48. ^ "Confronting Homophobia in Europe" (PDF). Retrieved 10 October 2013.
Latest comment: 8 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

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Portugal

Latest comment: 8 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Portugal legalized LGBT adoption yesterday. The maps need to be updated. Xuxo (talk) 23:55, 11 February 2016 (UTC)

Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

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Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

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Latest comment: 6 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

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Paint Northern Territory Purple on Map

Latest comment: 6 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Same-Sex adoption is now legal in the Northern Territory in Australia. Please paint it purple on the map. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A00:23C6:1680:BF00:B4F0:1EDD:890:B34C (talk) 22:06, 5 April 2018 (UTC)

Mexico

Latest comment: 3 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Since the SC ruling in Mexico, does marriage automatically entail adoption? I'm hesitant to add the recent SSM states to the map. — kwami (talk) 21:21, 24 September 2021 (UTC)

Requested move 4 March 2022

Latest comment: 2 years ago19 comments7 people in discussion
The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Moved to Same-sex adoption. Wide consensus exists to rename the article to fit more closely with the scope of this article. The idea of moving it to Same-sex adoption rather than the originally proposed title was raised later on concision & common terminology grounds, and has also gained considerable consensus. (This article is move-protected and will require administrator intervention for moving it, a technical request has been filed and the page will be moved shortly.) (closed by non-admin page mover) ---CX Zoom(he/him) (let's talk|contribs) 21:06, 23 March 2022 (UTC)

LGBT adoption → Adoption by same-sex couples – The article talks about people of the same sex adopting; it isn't about trans people adopting. It should follow the same logic behind the Same-sex marriage article and be named Adoption by same-sex couples. Both topics are about same-sex couples, not about transgender rights. It is not objective nor accurate to use the LGBT acronym in this article Heikocvijic (talk) 05:05, 4 March 2022 (UTC)

Would make sense, since it's in a similar situation where the article is almost exclusive about same-sex parenting and it makes more sense to treat it as its own distinct topic, but that would raise the question of what to do with the small section on transgender parenting tacked on at the end. Perhaps a Transgender parenting article is in order? LittleLazyLass (Talk | Contributions) 19:50, 11 March 2022 (UTC)
I agree Heikocvijic (talk) 04:13, 12 March 2022 (UTC)
I prefer the proposal: "same-sex adoption" sounds like you're adopting someone of the same sex. — kwami (talk) 06:40, 13 March 2022 (UTC)
It's the most common terminology for this topic, though. LittleLazyLass (Talk | Contributions) 19:11, 13 March 2022 (UTC)
BTW, I've added notes to the SSM template that not all SSM jurisdictions allow SS couples to adopt, so SSM is not "equal marriage" in those states. Reverted as "not relevant", but it seems to me that having gender tests for whether you count as a married couple is very relevant to whether a state truly has SSM. (SS couples can get married, and married couples can jointly adopt, but SS married couples cannot jointly adopt, so they have a 2nd-class marriage.) — kwami (talk) 06:54, 13 March 2022 (UTC)
@Heikocvijic: just FYI, you don't need to start a whole new RM for the new proposed name. In a situation like this where an RM is opened proposing that an article at title A be moved to title B, then during the discussion someone else suggests title C, which attracts consensus, it's completely normal for the closer to move the page to title C, even though it wasn't the originally proposed title. Also, if this page is moved, the corresponding category can also be speedily moved, without requiring any further discussion, per WP:C2D. Though you may still want to open a new RM to discuss LGBT parenting. Colin M (talk) 15:38, 14 March 2022 (UTC)
Yes, I support the proposal. Make the move. Iamreallygoodatcheckers (talk) 16:41, 21 March 2022 (UTC)
@Iamreallygoodatcheckers: wait, I'm confused. You said you supported the proposal because it's "more concise". I would think that meant you supported Same-sex adoption rather than Adoption by same-sex couples? Colin M (talk) 17:52, 21 March 2022 (UTC)
Yes I support “same-sex adoption” over “Adoption by same-sex couples”. I misread CX Zoom’s comment. I apologize. Iamreallygoodatcheckers (talk) 17:58, 21 March 2022 (UTC)
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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