Talk:Screwball comedy

'film noir'

Extremely far-fetched and absurd comparison. Probably put forward by Cahiers du Cinema or some other pompous French 'cinema critic' with zero understanding of American cinema. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.10.154.17 (talk) 20:23, 22 December 2023 (UTC)

"It has secondary characteristics similar to film noir, distinguished by a female character who dominates the relationship with the male central character, whose masculinity is challenged" - whoever wrote this cannot possibly have seen The Big Sleep, The Blue Dahlia, Farewell My Lovely or any of the other classic noirs. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.10.154.17 (talk) 13:41, 23 December 2023 (UTC)

This point is relevant to Double Indemnity, often noted as the definitive film noir and some of its riffs. However, it does not pertain to many other notable examples from the classic period, especially detective noirs à la Humphrey Bogart. That being said, both genres subverted the code in similar ways, and many screwball comedies deal with crime (The Thin Man, Ball of Fire, and Some Like It Hot). Immacritic101 (talk) 20:12, 26 February 2024 (UTC)

2005

In addition to the Coen brothers' comedy, _The Hudsucker Proxy_, I'd add their film, _Intolerable Cruelty_, to the list of recent screwball comedies. I think this easily satisfies the criteria as set forth in the accompanying page.

• I went ahead and tried to clean up the article, adding more examples, especially to the list of modern screwball comedies, correcting a few typos, and addressing the comments as to the "elusive" nature of the genre.

Because at least half of the examples of the screwball comedy listed below -- including such definitive examples as His Girl Friday and The Lady Eve -- are from the early 1940s, I'm extending the "end" date for the major period of Screwball Comedy from 1939 to 1942. The 1939 "end" date doesn't really make sense, coming about three years too soon. 68.1.175.241 28 June 2005 05:10 (UTC)

This page is terrible. Screwball comedies are not one of the most elusive of film genres; they are as easily identifiable as film noir or such. Needs serious rewrite. Mandel 15:23, 30 September 2005 (UTC)

Just because you disagree with it does not make the whole page terrible. While some would say there is a very clear definiton of a screwball, there are many different and conflicting opinions of what that definition, or definitions, are. --Ryuukuro 00:07, 1 October 2005 (UTC)

It is terrible. It has been in the same sorry state for more than a year. The structure is haphazard, the examples runs similarly so. It's too short for an important film genre. I reckon most people give up doing anything for it after seeing how difficult it is to do a rewrite. And you contradict yourself. If there aren't a list of defined criteria (most clearly battle of sexes and romance), then why are so many still listed here? There is in fact no argument about what the screwball is. What are the your so-called "conflicts" in definitions? Mandel 16:07, 1 October 2005 (UTC)

Obvious question not addressed in the article

Why are they called "screwball comedies" anyway? I assume it's something to do with the baseball term, but that's very little known outside baseball-playing nations. Loganberry (Talk) 03:53, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

Any answers? I'll probably take it to the RefDesk if not. Loganberry (Talk) 02:45, 27 August 2006 (UTC)

I think it's related to the old slang term "screwball", meaning crazy or twisted. 惑乱 分からん 23:10, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

Screwball (n.) meant an "eccentric person," 1933, U.S. slang, earlier as a type of erratic baseball pitch (1928), from a still earlier name for a type of bowl in cricket (1866), from screw (n.) + ball. Screwball comedy is attested from 1938. Pronghorn (talk) 03:39, 12 June 2008 (UTC)

Well, that should be mentioned in the article. Maybe it was obvious to older generations, but the rest is at a total loss. --Trickstar (talk) 09:17, 6 February 2020 (UTC)

Sigh ... it's explained in detail in the article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.10.154.17 (talk) 20:21, 22 December 2023 (UTC)

Writers

If someone has information regarding the script writers, I think that would be an important addition to this page. I had heard that the studios hired many playwrites from New York which accounted for the tight, witty dialogue of many of these movies. Discussion of this would add to this page.

And in some cases the screenplay writers may be infinitely more important to the making of the films than their directors

'playwrites' ... LOL. "writers may be infinitely more important to the making of the films than their directors" ... laughable. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.10.154.17 (talk) 20:25, 22 December 2023 (UTC)

Spaceballs?

Spaceballs is not screwball comedy. That's a joke. I do think Arthur with Dudley Moore is screwball comedy. It's unique in that the guy must chose between rich and poor women, when usually it's the woman who choses in these films. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kevin324la (talk • contribs) 17:31, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Script writers adapted some screwball comedies from "screwball" theater, opera or "screwball" novels, short stories, even magazine articles in addition to writing original screenplays. Samson Raphaelson and Billy Wilder wrote for Lubitsch, for example. Raphaelson and Wilder, like Lubitsch, wrote out of the Jewish ethos - and their humor reflected that. Wilder and Lubitsch were both Central Europeans, while Raphaelson came from New York. Their dour sense of humor developed from their and their families' dour experience of the human condition.

A note: Screwball comedies go back beyond even ancient Greek theater, continue through the Middle Ages in Italy, France, England and so on in the West. They were not uncommon in Asia. Pierre Beaumarchais's "screwball" comedy, "Le Barbier de Séville" was adapted by Lorenzo da Ponte to provide the libretto for the opera of the same name, for instance. Da Ponte wrote the libretto to another "screwball comedy" opera called "Cosi fan Tutti." Lubitsch was a member of the Max Reinhardt school in Berlin before he started in movies. He was acting in "screwball comedy" there long before he took up film. In practive screwball was merely the ancient genre of the aristocractic or ruling class farce updated and transposed into motion pictures. Redicule of the powerful has always proven entertaining, especially in periods of transition from a failing elite to a new emerging one that will replace them. Pronghorn (talk) 04:20, 12 June 2008 (UTC)

"Screwball comedies go back beyond even ancient Greek theater" - LOL. Where Do people get these absurd ideas from?

Etymology

Need etymology of the term, and its application to the genre. Badagnani (talk) 07:04, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

Sigh ... it's all there in the article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.10.154.17 (talk) 20:27, 22 December 2023 (UTC)

Bombshell

1933's Bombshell surely qualifies as screwball comedy and was perhaps the first of the genre, despite claims Twentieth Century is the first. It has all of the ingredients of a screwball comedy.--Susan Nunes 26 September 2008 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.228.62.97 (talk) 15:42, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

The Bachelor and the Bobby-Soxer

I notice--a bit late!--that JGG59 reverted my entry of The Bachelor and the Bobby-Soxer, 1947, from this article back in 2007. However, the film has its own wiki entry of long standing, with plenty of editorial activity, which has stated that it is a screwball comedy, and there has been no objection. I'm therefore restoring this film to its rightful place in this article, at the end of the classic era.Ajschorschiii (talk) 20:53, 21 March 2009 (UTC)

LOL!!!!!

In the intro: "farcical", "repartee", "farce"? comon people... This is wikipedia. It's not a doctoral dissertation... Boonshofter 00:08, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

'comon' - in what language is that supposed to be? But then, common words like 'farce' and 'repartee' seem to be beyond your ken.

What's your point? Are those words too big for you? —Tamfang (talk) 06:05, 5 October 2012 (UTC)

What's Up, Doc?

The 1974 film "What's Up, Doc?" was a remake of the classic screwball comedy film "Bringing Up Baby." I think it should be included somewhere on this page. --Ringwraith10 (talk) 13:46, 8 October 2010 (UTC)

Screwball definition

I really find this an odd definition: "it distinguishes itself for being characterized by a female that dominates the relationship with the male central character" (bolding mine). How does this even come close to being true in His Girl Friday, Arsenic and Old Lace, The More the Merrier or Some Like It Hot? I think this characterization is more apt: "It was applied to films where everything was a juxtaposition: educated and uneducated, rich and poor, intelligent and stupid, honest and dishonest, and most of all male and female. When two people fell in love, they did not simply surrender to their feelings, they battled it out." Clarityfiend (talk) 03:02, 11 July 2013 (UTC)

However, it is true of the earlier Richard Savage comic novel, My Official Wife, which was adapted for screen, though not as a comedy. Why nothing of the roots of screwball in literature?67.82.7.116 (talk) 00:51, 30 September 2013 (UTC)

Well, I agree I found the intro a little strong in describing the plots as being about the central male characters' "masculinity being challenged," as there is only the one reference for that opinion. So I added the sourced line: The two engage in a humorous battle of the sexes, which was a new theme for Hollywood and audiences at the time. which helps a little. 5Q5 (talk) 14:34, 30 September 2013 (UTC)

I know it's a wiki and not a reliable source at all, but TV Tropes has a completely different definition. In a nutshell: "a parody of a Romantic Comedy". I think this makes a lot of sense.

Anyway, I think making the definition overly detailed is dangerous, as it creates the risk that very few (if any) films listed actually meet the definition. A hyperspecific definition is patently unhelpful if only two or three films meet it at all. Has anyone examined or at least sampled the films currently listed under this aspect? --Florian Blaschke (talk) 13:38, 14 April 2014 (UTC)

LOL too

One, Two, Three a screwball comedy? Oh yeah, it has an actor in it who started out in the 1930s, so it must be… — Preceding unsigned comment added by 46.115.39.88 (talk) 04:15, 14 December 2013 (UTC)

Yes, indeed - the whole article is absurd from start to finish.

Desparately Seeking Susan

A possible addition to the modern list. Strong women characters, effeminate male ( Gary,) wacky situations, even class vs class are all present. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:1:C200:CC0:61A9:1526:6054:7771 (talk) 05:13, 13 October 2014 (UTC)

Not remotely screwball. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.10.154.17 (talk) 20:29, 22 December 2023 (UTC)

Upper/lower class

...and the financially struggling moviegoing public's desire to see the rich upper class taught a lesson in humanity? I have no clue what the argument is here... — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kay.V.Patino (talk • contribs) 05:27, 19 October 2018 (UTC)

Requested move 29 August 2019

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: moved. The WP:CONCISE argument raised in support wins out. (closed by non-admin page mover) Calidum 14:05, 7 September 2019 (UTC)

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Screwball comedy film → Screwball comedy – It seems there are many works in this genre that are not films, such as the TV shows Moonlighting, Married... with Children, NewsRadio, Gilmore Girls, The O.C., Standoff, and Gossip Girl. The comic book The Castafiore Emerald is partly set in this genre. Kailash29792 (talk) 06:02, 29 August 2019 (UTC)

[Edit: Oppose per below] Lukewarm and fading Support. Good point, so per nom until someone comes along and changes my mind (is "Screwball comedy" actually just a film term? I can see that, and if accurate will change my vlote), and there is a section named "Screwball comedy elements in other genres" which covers television. For films The Lady Eve is one of the little-seen (nowadays) gems. I wouldn't say some of the shows listed are screwball comedies, but if even one is then the "film" descriptor is inaccurate per expansion. Randy Kryn (talk) 14:54, 29 August 2019 (UTC)

• Oppose because this topic is predominantly a sub-genre of the comedy film, and it seems more appropriate to maintain this consistency with the "film" suffix. I performed a search engine test for "screwball comedy" in relation to television and did not find much to warrant discussing this as a genre across multiple mediums. This move would make it seem like screwball comedy is directly derived from comedy, rather than comedy film. It seems best to keep this article's scope to be about a film sub-genre, with an appendix-style section briefly discussing this label used with non-film works. Erik (talk | contrib) ^{(ping me)} 18:23, 29 August 2019 (UTC)
• Oppose. I've never heard of any TV show, not even I Love Lucy, the quintessential example in that medium, called a screwball comedy. (The word "screwball" doesn't even appear in that lengthy article.) Clarityfiend (talk) 19:06, 29 August 2019 (UTC)
  • Support, but not for the nominator's reason. ZXCVBNM has a valid point. "Film" is implied. Clarityfiend (talk) 08:38, 31 August 2019 (UTC)
• Support Per WP:CONCISE. The "film" descriptor is simply not needed at all._{ZXCVBNM (TALK)} 00:39, 31 August 2019 (UTC)
• Support Most common term per WP:CONCISE; this ngram finds no instances of "screwball comedy film" at all. Ewulp (talk) 00:18, 1 September 2019 (UTC)
• Support Per WP:CONCISE. I agree that the word "film" is unnecessary. Colin M (talk) 21:21, 5 September 2019 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

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