Talk:Self-Portrait as a Tahitian

Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by AirshipJungleman29 talk 17:35, 16 January 2024 (UTC)

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Self-Portrait as a Tahitian (1934)

• ... that Amrita Sher-Gil's Self-Portrait as a Tahitian (pictured) has hidden features of Gauguin, Modersohn-Becker, van Gogh, and the Japanese? Source: [1][2]
  • Reviewed: Cascade Saddle Track
  • Comment: Still quite a bit to do and will add QPQ soon. Image was created by Sher-Gil in 1934 in Paris. She died in 1941. The licence needs correcting.

Created by Whispyhistory (talk) and Philafrenzy (talk). Nominated by Whispyhistory (talk) at 17:18, 23 November 2023 (UTC). Post-promotion hook changes for this nom will be logged at Template talk:Did you know nominations/Self-Portrait as a Tahitian; consider watching this nomination, if it is successful, until the hook appears on the Main Page.

Interesting article about an interesting piece of art, on fine sources. Offline sources accepted AGF, no copyvio obvious. As the article stands now, I see no "hidden" features, and believe that those to the three painters are rather obvious. "Japanese" is at present not justified. I'd mention the year. The three short sections about the influences are too short for my taste, but I'll watch them grow ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:55, 24 November 2023 (UTC)

Thank you @Gerda Arendt:... I'm working on it... is it okay with you that I take my time on this one and ping you when done? It is a very complex painting. Much appreciated. Whispyhistory (talk) 15:04, 24 November 2023 (UTC)

Yes. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 17:07, 24 November 2023 (UTC)

• @Whispyhistory: Gerda forgot to note this but a QPQ is still needed. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 11:25, 18 December 2023 (UTC)

@Whispyhistory: Please provide a QPQ or else the nomination may be closed as unsuccessful. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 14:32, 21 December 2023 (UTC)

Added QPQ Whispyhistory (talk) 15:09, 21 December 2023 (UTC)

Thank you. The review can continue. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 15:16, 21 December 2023 (UTC)

Whispyhistory, did you expand as you planned? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:32, 21 December 2023 (UTC)

In process please. I'll ping you in next day or so if okay. Whispyhistory (talk) 16:17, 21 December 2023 (UTC)

ALT1... that Amrita Sher-Gil's Tahitian nude self-portrait (pictured) was purposely exhibited alongside Boris with Apples? Whispyhistory (talk) 20:37, 22 December 2023 (UTC)

Thank you, and I like the idea. I just saw an exhibition of works by Modersohn-Becker, saying that she was the first woman at all to paint herself nude. I think we want a year to understand that it was early in a movement. I also suggest to not pipe the bolded title, because I don't believe that the average reader will know from her name that she is not Tahitian. I'd also like to se indicate that she also painted the other one, and that it was her purpose to connect them, not someone else's. - In the article, you have a link to Modersohnn and to her work, - I don't know about nvisual arts, but in music we drop the link to the composer if their work has an article. In your image caption, it's the opposite ;) - Good luck! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:53, 22 December 2023 (UTC)

ALT1a... that Hungarian-born Indian artist Amrita Sher-Gil purposely exhibited both her Self-Portrait as a Tahitian (pictured) and Boris with Apples together?

Thank you @Gerda Arendt:... adjusted, but happy for any ideas or rewording. Whispyhistory (talk) 11:22, 24 December 2023 (UTC)

I like that! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:18, 24 December 2023 (UTC)

ALT1a is no good. I propose ALT2... that Self-Portrait as a Tahitian pictured Indian artist Amrita Sher-Gil standing in the shadow of Paul Gauguin? This would seem to be the obvious hook and the question begged by the painting but not answered by the article. Who was the man? If there are sources saying it was Gauguin then they should be added. If it is only "thought to be" then the hook can be changed to say that. If we don't know at all then just say "standing in the shadow of a man". Philafrenzy (talk) 14:36, 24 December 2023 (UTC)

I don't know for sure who the shadow is, other than everyone seems to agree it is a male. The artist doesn't mention it in any letter that I have seen, though interpreters have given some opinions. Whispyhistory (talk) 17:37, 24 December 2023 (UTC)

It seems to me to be by far the most interesting point about the painting. She has painted herself literally standing in someone's shadow. Can you research it further? Philafrenzy (talk) 17:52, 24 December 2023 (UTC)

I did think of it and will of course look further. Whispyhistory (talk) 17:54, 24 December 2023 (UTC)

New reviewer needed for ALT2 as ALT1a has been deemed "no good". ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 17:11, 10 January 2024 (UTC)

The sourcing for ALT2 does not name the figure; Smarthistory says "The shadow behind Sher-Gil in the self-portrait—possibly a male onlooker with cropped hair and broad shoulders—might symbolize the looming influence of male modernists in the art world, like Gauguin and van Gogh." and that Sher-Gil never met Gauguin, and I'm not seeing where in the JSTOR source confirms that the shadow's Gauguin either. What else do you have in mind?--Launchballer 14:21, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

Thanks... I don't think anyone knows for sure who the shadow is. Amrita does not appear to reveal it in any of her published letters. IMO it may have been whoever got her pregnant, though scholars think it could be Gauguin, Van Gogh, a sexual predator or her other self.... as far as I can make out. For sure... she wanted this painting exhibited next to Boris with apples. Whispyhistory (talk) 15:52, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

ALT2a... that Self-Portrait as a Tahitian pictures Indian artist Amrita Sher-Gil standing in the shadow of an unknown man? Philafrenzy (talk) 15:56, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

Perfect Whispyhistory (talk) 16:01, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

I like that also. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:38, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

Not another DYK about Amrita Sher-Gil!

How many DYK about the same not-particularly-famous painter can Wikipedia have in the space of a couple of months? No, we didn't know it and we had no reason to want to know it either. 62.73.69.121 (talk) 20:41, 25 January 2024 (UTC)