Talk:Tiến Quân Ca

Chu Nom

About "Vietnamese with Chu Nom" I don't know the reason why there is such a section. "Tien Quan Ca" was completely written in Romanized Vietnamese writings (Quoc Ngu), since its author Van Cao had received a modern Western education. Moreover, the so-called "Tien Quan Ca in Vietnamese with Chu Nom" looks very awkward, with the combination of Romanized Vietnamese (Quoc Ngu) and Sinicized Vietnamese (Chu Nom). Why not a complete Chu Nom version of that anthem? Therefore, I suggest that the ugly section should be removed.

I'm a Vietnamese. In Vietnam today, only the first verse of the song is used as the anthem so i've noted it and also separated the two verses.

Title

What is the literal translation of the title, "Tiến Quân Ca"? Badagnani (talk) 08:03, 10 September 2008 (UTC)

Army Marching Song.--Amore Mio ^(talk) 08:33, 21 May 2009 (UTC)

Lyrics

I've removed the lyrics of the anthem from the article, as we can only include lyrics for national anthems if they are out of copyright – please see WP:NOFULLTEXT. Since the poet died in 1995, we must assume that his work (and any translation of it) is still protected by copyright. Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 22:40, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

This song is out of copyright now since the composer family refused their right and donated it to public. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2405:4800:108E:B818:C0E5:4071:AFD2:C829 (talk) 03:07, 11 December 2016 (UTC)

@Justlettersandnumbers: Hi, this song was released into public domain by familly owner's (Vietnamese source, can read via Google Translate: [1]). In Vietnamese Wikisource, this song also marked as "{{PD-release}}", as you can see at s:vi:Quốc ca Việt Nam. --minhhuy ^(talk) 09:23, 11 December 2016 (UTC)

Thank you for doing this research. Unfortunately "free use by the State in any form" and "donated to the people and the fatherland" is not the same thing as "in the public domain". — Diannaa 🍁 (talk) 12:58, 11 December 2016 (UTC)

@Diannaa: I see, thank you very much. I will re-discuss with Vietnamese community about this issue. --minhhuy ^(talk) 15:21, 11 December 2016 (UTC)

@Diannaa: Please wait... In full content of donate text ([2]), the family owner's was donate to "public, The Party, National Assembly and State" and "full belong to public". They actually donate this song to all people and full public domain. Maybe you'll need contact another who fluent in Vietnamese to help with image text on that site. --minhhuy ^(talk) 15:30, 11 December 2016 (UTC)

Sorry but IU can't read any part of that document, and because it's a photo rather than a machine-readable format, I am unable to translate it either. We are at an impasse. — Diannaa 🍁 (talk) 20:01, 11 December 2016 (UTC)

--@MarioRichie1912:-- Hello, after looking at the copyright situation, I found that the Vietnamese version of "Tien Quan Ca" and many others have the lyrics of the song under free use and has never been reported for copyright nor deleted. The soundtrack of the anthem also includes the lyrics in Vietnamese and other languages.

Under current international copyright law, literary works are subject to copyright whether they are tagged as such or not. No registration is required, and no copyright notice is required. So we have to assume that the lyrics are copyright. — Diannaa 🍁 (talk) 13:25, 23 May 2017 (UTC)

Understood. However, for many versions of this page, such as the Simple English and Vietnamese version, the lyrics were posted on and has since never been reported for copyright nor removed. Should they be taken out? ~ MarioRichie1912 —Preceding undated comment added 23:19, 24 May 2017 (UTC)

My opinion is yes. — Diannaa 🍁 (talk) 12:24, 25 May 2017 (UTC)

Hello, sorry for the very long response. I did some research over the summer and have concluded that the anthem is indeed under copyright protection [3] which you can read if you want since it's in English. The government of Vietnam stated that it is a "long story" but only certain situations can the anthem be sung, which even the family of the composer agrees after their offer to "gift" the anthem. I believe this impasse has been solved finally. MarioRichie1912 (talk) 17:54, 2 September 2017 (UTC)

"In early July, family members of the late composer signed a letter donating the song to the State and the Vietnamese people. The letter, signed by all the legal inheritors in the family, states clearly that the family is donating the song for free use by the State in any form without asking for copyright fees." [4]
"The letter, signed by all the legal inheritors in the family, states clearly that the family is donating the song for free use by the State in any form.""" [5]

@MarioRichie1912 your source from august 21, 2015. the copyright donated ceremony on july, 2016. case closed, can i add the lyrics to the article?2405:4803:F096:8300:30E3:3C0C:104B:E22E (talk) 09:04, 9 January 2021 (UTC)

"Donating the song for free use by the State" is not the same thing as releasing the lyrics into the public domain. So no.— Diannaa (talk) 13:32, 9 January 2021 (UTC)

wtf, donating the song to the State and "the Vietnamese people". what's wrong with you??2405:4803:F096:8300:30E3:3C0C:104B:E22E (talk) 17:05, 9 January 2021 (UTC)

“Tôi là Nghiêm Thúy Băng, 80 tuổi, vợ cố nhạc sĩ Văn Cao- tác giả quốc ca Việt Nam (đã mất từ 7/1995), đại diện cho gia đình đang thừa kế các tác phẩm âm nhạc của ông, xin trân trọng ngỏ lời hiến tặng công chúng, Đảng, Quốc hội và Nhà nước tác phẩm Tiến quân ca đang là Quốc ca Việt Nam từ năm 1946 đến nay là 64 năm.”. first part of the letter the musician's wife sent to the Minister of Culture, Sports and Tourism of Vietnam. should i translate what "công chúng" mean [6],[7] — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2405:4803:F096:8300:30E3:3C0C:104B:E22E (talk) 17:08, 9 January 2021 (UTC)

vi-wiki for "công chúng"2405:4803:F096:8300:30E3:3C0C:104B:E22E (talk) 17:24, 9 January 2021 (UTC)

"Donating the song for free use by the State" is not the same thing as releasing the lyrics into the public domain. The song still enjoys copyright protection. Please stop re-adding the lyrics.— Diannaa (talk) 14:39, 13 January 2021 (UTC)

@Diannaa: did you read the first part of the letter i sent? they are not only donating the song for free use by the State but also for "công chúng"=vietnamese for public. We gave you sources, we even wrote a topic about the copyright. What's wrong with your mind?STOP REMOVE THE LYRICS without any reasonable reason.2405:4803:F096:8300:C888:9AE7:B869:AA5 (talk) 15:13, 13 January 2021 (UTC)

That's not the same thing as placing the song in the public domain.— Diannaa (talk) 20:01, 13 January 2021 (UTC)

hiến tặng công chúng (donating to the public) is not the same as placing the song in the public domain??? goodjob mrs Diannaa.2405:4803:F096:8300:8D6B:41B1:D095:4B7D (talk) 09:36, 14 January 2021 (UTC)

Should we add in the Vietnamese and English lyrics of the anthem now since it has been announced by the Vietnamese government recently that no one is allowed to stop the anthem from being popularized. Jackle1003 (talk) 03:12, 8 December 2021 (UTC)

The Vietnamese government is not the copyright holder, and such an announcement is not the same thing as the copyright holder releasing the lyrics into the public domain. — Diannaa (talk) 20:49, 8 December 2021 (UTC)

Has anyone realized something odd from the words of User:Illegitimate Barrister? This song was created in 1944, before the modern Vietnamese state existed. I recommend all of you to check the French copyright laws because France controlled Vietnam de jure at the time. —142.112.224.170 (talk) 15:51, 15 March 2022 (UTC)

I refer you to the Commons:Copyright rules by territory/Vietnam. Only works by authors who died before 23 December 1948 are in the public domain in the United States.— Diannaa (talk) 17:56, 15 March 2022 (UTC)

Err ok…… How is that a thing? French copyright laws applied to Vietnam before the country was independent and divided in 1954. Check the Commons:Copyright rules by territory/France as it was applied before 1954. -142.112.236.29 (talk) 02:28, 20 April 2022 (UTC)

US copyright law also applies, because Wikipedia's servers are located in the United States.— Diannaa (talk) 12:11, 20 April 2022 (UTC)

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A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion

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• Tiến Quân Ca.gif

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. Community Tech bot (talk) 11:36, 21 June 2018 (UTC)

Key signature.

@RainbowSilver2ndBackup:. I have been removing the category because it is not substantiated by referenced text. Not because I disagree with what the key signature is. If you really want me to stop (and other editors) removing the cat, then add the relevant text with references. FWIW, I made my reasons quite clear in my edits and you should have noticed rather than assume, wrongly as it turns out, who is and who is not being disruptive. --Richhoncho (talk) 18:46, 10 May 2019 (UTC)

How do know it is not referenced in any of the texts especially those written by Vietnamese government documents? We can at least let the category stay here until we get confirmation from the Vietnamese government but we to find someone who is fluent in Vietnamese. RainbowSilver2ndBackup (talk) 19:59, 10 May 2019 (UTC)

If you can find independent verification, which can be referenced then please re-add the category. Until then I am removing because it is not referred to in the WP article, as confirmed by yourself. --Richhoncho (talk) 17:59, 11 May 2019 (UTC)

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