Talk:Vivian Hsu

Tone for 少

I've made the pinyin transliterations of '少' consistent in tone number. When I first wrote the article, they were all in the third tone (shǎo). At one point, some editor corrected the first occurrence to be in the fourth tone (shào). Now, I've converted the other two instances to be fourth tone. I know that both of these are legal tones for the hanzi, but I'd like to adopt the more widely-used one.

I'm also going to edit Choensang Misonyeo to reflect this change.

Does anyone who actually – unlike me – knows anything about Mandarin know for certain which tone is more widely used for 少?

Coach Z Ale 09:23, 19 October 2005 (UTC)

The third tone is more widely used, but the fourth tone is the correct tone in the context of this article. -ryan-d 11:58, 24 November 2005 (UTC)

reference for her Taiwanese aborigine ancestry?

is there a reference for her Taiwanese aborigine ancestry? Abstrakt

At best I recall seeing her in a picture in aborigine garb, but that's hardly a useful reference to anything. -Jeff

Disrespectful Remarks?

WikiVivian, please explain how the remarks in revision 146546510 regarding the mistranslation of Vivian's photobook's name and the sociosexual impact of her work on Taiwanese society are at all diesrespectful to her as a person.

I think it important to clarify to English-speaking people unfamiliar with her work that she never produced a photobook called simply "Angel", and I thought that Josephine Ho's examination of Vivian's work marks her as an important model in Taiwan's history.

I plan on undoing your deletion of these parts unless you can explain how they are derogatory.

Coach Z Ale 21:57, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

Thanks Coach Z Ale for your inquiry regarding my edits in the Vivian Hsu article. I just discovered your message here but I'm in a hurry right now and will respond as soon as possible - hopefully to your contentment -- WikiVivian 13:13, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

Ok, here I'm back. First of all, I really appreciate that my edits on the Vivian Hsu article should be discussed at this place and that Coach Z Ale was so kind giving me some time instead of rescinding my changes in one coup. I went through all edits of this article which began as a stub already August 31st 2004 and for almost a whole year all revisions began with a remark about her nude photobooks Angel Heart and Venus which might suggest that this was allegedly the uppermost decisive milestone in her pursuit of a more serious recognition as a singer and an actress. People who have carefully followed Vivian's career from the beginning on know that this is actually not true. So I firmly believe that a good Wikipedia article about Vivian Hsu should be neutral in this concern and should not repeatedly stress her early and soon abandoned nude work. I think there is nothing to suppress in a complete biography of Vivian Hsu. The photobooks as well as the Category III films Hunting List, Naked Angel and Devil Angel are given facts and should of course be listed but in my opinion there is absoloutely no need to apostrophize them as essentially "nude" productions - eventually leading to erroneous or even malicious assessments, i.e. Vivian Hsu were a porn star. It's a shame that still today certain Internet forums/blogs and news sercives are full of such unfounded prejudices.

As for the lecture of Prof. Josephine Ho (Center for the Study of Sexualities, National Central University Chungli, Taiwan) it has to be pointed out that the main subject of the underlying scientific studies was the so called Enjo kōsai phenomenon which (after Ho's investigations) appeared in Taiwan around the same time when Vivian's photobook Angel Heart was first released (From Spice Girls to Enjo-Kosai ...). So the impression might come up that Prof. Ho, taking Angel Heart (among other similar publications) as an example, made those photobooks jointly responsible for an alarming development in her country, namley Enjo kōsai, literally supported dating, commonly said for prostitution of minors. This is actually the reason why I used the word "disrespectful" in the comment of my edit - maybe somewhat over the top. Anyway I think it's better to leave Prof. Ho's article out at all since it doesn't substantially deal with the person of Vivian Hsu. By the way, this issue has been discussed on the Cheerytea/Collecting Vivian forum already ten months before it appeared in the Vivian Hsu article (Angel/VenusBody Image discussion).

It is correct that the title of Vivian's first photobook ist mostly written as 天使心 in Chinese websites (Angel Heart in English). The same is true for the movie 赤裸天使 = Naked Angel. I agree that I have to revert my correspondent changes. However, the photobook seems to be internationally known merely as Angel - probabely because the latter title appears on the cover of the Japanese edition. I can't find the characters 天使心 anywhere in the book I have. Maybe it's in the Taiwanese version which was released a few months before the Japanese edition - that's due to further examination. With the movie it's similar: next to 赤裸天使 the words Angel Heart are printed on the VCD/DVD case (Hong Kong version). Hopefully we can find a simple way how to describe these discrepancies in the article.

The Music section in the article is quite good, also the comprehensive discography. The Acting section however badly needs a backup. The former remarks about the films Chiluo Tianshi and Mogui Tianshi were misplaced in the Modelling section, so I removed them. I think a filmography similar to the discography would be useful too unless the link to IMDb would provide information of sufficiant actuality.

Here I would like to tell that it is my long lasting and devoted fanship why I'm feeling bound to become active in the improvement of this Wikipedia article. Nevertheless I'm aware that such a personal attraction towards Vivian may never become obvious in my contributions. That's certainly not easy but I will try my best. -- WikiVivian 18:18, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

Thanks a lot for the explanation.

It appears that you've given this quite a lot of thought regarding what should be stressed and how in this biographical article. I was wrong to call the title discrepancies 'mistranslations': I checked out my copy of 赤裸天使, and it does indeed say "Angel Heart" on the front and spine of the DVD case. My copy of 天使心 has no translation and indeed no Roman characters on it anywhere, so perhaps I can be forgiven in that instance. I do think that the discrepancies should be noted succinctly in the article (perhaps instead of portraying the international titles as translations, they could be marked as 'international').

You're right about Professor Ho's article as well. Encyclopaedically speaking, the article is not about Vivian specifically enough that should be addressed here. Perhaps at Josephine Ho.

There is one thing I still do disagree about though. Although Vivian has certainly gone on to become more successful as a musical artist and as an actress than she ever was as a model, and was not a model for very long, I think it's important that we acknowledge fully that she was indeed a professional model at one time. I think that her measurements when she was a model should be placed back on the page somewhere for encyclopaedic completeness. I'd prefer not to use Template:Female adult bio—since, as you mention, she was never a porn star—but it does have a 'blood type' field, whereas Template:Infobox Model does not. Since we already have an infobox, it might be better just to place her measurements under the Modelling section. Perhaps this choice is something we could discuss here.

From one fan to another, thanks for your help with the article. I hope in particular you can continue to improve the Acting section, as I don't know much about Vivian's acting career. Coach Z Ale 01:36, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

Thank you Coach Z Ale for your kind response and your cooperativeness. That's quite motivating for going on in order to make Vivian's biography better than a B-class article! -- WikiVivian 00:37, 28 July 2007 (UTC)

Colin Chiu

First it was 'marriage in Canada' in 2005 (despite being nowhere near there at the time), with a daughter, and now it's just engaged? A famous Australian nobody's heard of, no less. 216.154.23.191 23:13, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Angel/Angel's Heart

I have a copy of the 1995 photobook on my lap right now, it's Angel, not Angel Heart.

Angel Heart's photobook should have been released after the movie of the same name, and is different from the photobook (ISBN4-08-780190-x) published Jan 23, 1995 - as far as I know. --216.154.17.162 (talk) 19:43, 1 January 2009 (UTC)