Talk:West Azerbaijan province/Archive 3

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Archive 1

Archive 2

Archive 3

Some credible sources regarding : 1)The Kurds are majority in West Azerbaijan province of Iran and; 2)The Kurds in Northen Part of the province

Latest comment: 18 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

As you see, clearly the greatest parts of the province is Kurdish inhabited:

[1], [2], [3],[4],[5],[6], [7], [8][9]

Done, There is absolutely much more credible sources regarding this matter.

Thank you D iyako Talk + 13:58, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

Proposal for mediation committee--part 1

Latest comment: 18 years ago24 comments2 people in discussion

To page mediator(s):

Diyako and anon's position: Kurds are "majority" in West Azarbaijan.
Me (and Dr Hamed and Timbits)'s position:
- Urmia (capital) is clearly Azari majority, not Kurdish, or even "Kurdish-Turkish". The Kurds are a minority there. (Azarbaijan means land of the Azari by the way)
- If not an Azari majority, the province is at least 50/50 in ethnic makeup. Diyako accepts only a "Kurdish majority". Dr Hamed and TimBits (as I understand) are for 70% Azari. As you can see, I am the conservative of the pro-Azeri bunch here.

Diyako's position is therefore unacceptable.

Here's why:

To begin with, paragraph 2 of the section in question and its following table in ordering the Kurds first and claiming majority makeup in certain and most cities is not substantiated by the links provided. The links only mention Kurds as found to be living there. Nothing more.
Diyako et al refuse to acknowledge (and keep deleting the fact that) there is no official or government or even semi-government ethnicity census for West Azarbaijan in Iran. Everything therefore being claimed here by Diyako et al are only indirect remote estimates, or guesstimates, from foreign sources, whether pro-Azeri or pro-Kurdish.
One cannot use maps (links [19] and [20] cited above e.g.) to justify a claim of majority status of Kurds in West Azarbaijan. Maps are inconclusive and cannot tell whether or not a group is in majority status vis a vis another. It only tells where a specific group can be found to reside there. If anything, in fact Maps [13] and [16] cited above show Urmia (the largest city) as Azeri. If we were to interpret maps as an indication of majority status, I could also then show maps that claim the opposite (i.e. show an Azeri majority). Examples: [10] [11] [12] and [13]
Links [15] and [18] cited above say nothing about a Kurdish "majority" in West Azarbaijan. They only report Kurds to be found to live there.
For the claim of Urmia being Kurdish majority on map [17], I can in turn cite the following opposing sources: These sources claim a majority for Azeris in Urmia:
1. H. Anzali, ISBN 964-6614-07-8 p49, (2000)
2. A. Kaviyanpur ISBN 964-91860-6-9 p421, (1999)
3. "...90% of Urmia are Azeri..."
That leaves us with only link [14] as directly stating "a Kurdish majority in West Azerbaijan". But then again, there are opposing sources as well, which Diyako et al ignore:

My vote therefore is:

In light of the lack of any official census, and in light of having both Azeri and Kurdish sources oppositely claiming majority status for the province, it would be only fair to claim 50/50 status in general, and only say that the south of the province is thought to be Kurdish dominated, while the north is Azeri, and that Urmia is for certain mainly Azeri, while Mahabad is for certain Kurdish.--Zereshk 23:04, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

1. Since an editor can contribute with several ID's so the number of editors is not important but the Sources cited.

The same can be said about you and that anon editor of yours.--Zereshk 02:50, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

That anon editor uses an IP and even once I made him blocked!!!!

2. Most of your sources are not credible and are too Pro-Turkish!

Your sources arent credible either. Youve been posting PDK sources!--

Zereshk 02:50, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN IIIIIIIIIIIIIIISSSSSSSSSSSSSS PPPPPDDDDDDDDKKKKKKKKKKKKKK? Lier pasdar lier akhund

This is Diyako adding a PDK source as reference: Dec 9, 2005. He denies it.--Zereshk 03:33, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

Now I believe that you are a mollah, this is a link which i could not find it through the origin website. but it is from UN

People are not fool! D iyako Talk + 03:35, 28 December 2005 (UTC) 3. Others are too old and are not up-to-date!

Says who? Show me.--Zereshk 02:50, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

4. All of sources cited by me (Diyako) are comming from western universities and are quite neutral and credible:

[14], [15], [16],[17],[18],[19], [20], [21][22]

Oh, you mean the maps. Well maps arent credible enough to base a majority claim on.--Zereshk 02:50, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

D iyako Talk + 23:20, 27 December 2005 (UTC

The main problem is you have not accepted large kurdish population in northern part of province.

I accept "Large". I do not accept "majority" claim. I opted for a 50/50. YOU REFUSED.--Zereshk 02:50, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

I do not said Kurds in northern parts are in strong majority

Let me explain something important for you: In fact the southern Kurdish population of West Azerbvaijan province of Iran are Mukrian. But there is a large Kurdish population Kurmanc (speaking a dialect of Kurdish) in west and northern parts of the province, as here in the neutral and credible source: [ http://www.ethnologue.com/show_language.asp?code=kmr Ethnologue.com] )Iran section).

You dont need to explain anything to me. Ive been there 3 times. I was born in Iran.--Zereshk 02:50, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

Yes but hate the Kurds and ignore them. D iyako Talk + 03:24, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

D iyako Talk + 23:50, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

Zereshk..! This is paragraph 2. What is wrong with this paragraf? You should accept that all of these cities are biethnic.

"...The province is divided into 14 townships, the present number of townships was achieved over time by subdivision of many of the larger townships into smaller ones.The townships in the province are as following: Urmia, Salmas, Naghadeh, Piranshahr, Bukan, Khoy, Mahabad, Oshnaviyeh, Sardasht, Chaldoran, Miandoab, Maku, Takab and Shahindej.

6 of these 14 townships are homogeneous, which 5 of them are entirely Kurdish and the another 1 is entirely Turkish, the 5 prodominently Kurdish cities are: Oshnaviyeh, Piranshahr, Bukan, Sardasht and Mahabad and the other township which is prodominently Turkish is Miandoab.The remaining 8 townships are principally heterogeneous and their populations has long been a combination of Turkish and Kurdish peoples, these townships are as following: Urmia,Salmas, Maku, Chaldoran, Naghadeh, Khoy, Takab and Shahindej..."

Where in your links does it exactly say "5 are entirely Kurdish"? How is it that you put "entirely Kurdish" for majority Kurdish towns and instead put "Kurdish-Turkish" for Turkish majority towns (such as Naghadeh and Urmia)? I find that problematic and biased.--Zereshk 02:50, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

D iyako Talk + 23:59, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

In fact I am discussing with a racist Qashqai turk pasdar terrorist pro ahmadinejad who even do not recognize UN emblem and think it is PDK's D iyako Talk + 03:14, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

You are one of those anti-kurdish as well as anti-semitic pasdars. Might offend +18

Ignore us ignore us.. but after saddam it is your turn. D iyako Talk + 03:31, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

Even on your own Kurdistanica map it says "Urmia: a city with a Kurdish minority.--Zereshk 03:39, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

Maybe it is old but here syas Kurds are the largest ethnic group. We should remember when a city has a large minority which even can mean 49% it is a biethnical city.

No it's not old. Your map is old. And 49% is still a "minority".--Zereshk 04:19, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

So we have more Kurdish towns as Shahindej Takab and Maku ...etc than Kurdish-Turkish ones!!. You first must learn what does a biethnical city mean then say what is minority majority.

You must know that even a city with 35% minority is a biethnical city!! D iyako Talk + 04:27, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

D iyako Talk + 03:43, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

There's no use. Let's just wait for the mediation. I'm waiting to see how your attacks against me will change things.--Zereshk 03:55, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

You have attaced me in persian language before. naming me (ahmaq) (liaqate ehteram nadashtan) D iyako Talk + 03:57, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

Please provide the addition link to where I called you "ahmagh". Also, the second statement is not an attack. It just says some people dont deserve any respect. Any other lies for the mediation committee you might wanna add?--Zereshk 04:12, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

You think you are very clever. but since you are you (!) I do not care. I am waiting for other non-Turkish wikipedians to mediation. D iyako Talk + 04:14, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

Yes. Let us wait.--Zereshk 04:19, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

Proposal for mediation committee--part 2

Latest comment: 18 years ago25 comments2 people in discussion

I hereby propose the following (on behalf of myself and User:TimBits and User:Dr.Hamed). If the latter two users disagree, they may add so. I'm sure Dr. Hamed advocates a stronger pro-Azeri position than I am doing here.

The proposals are:

1. Change the disputed section to read:

The province is divided into 14 townships, the present number of townships was achieved over time by subdivision of many of the larger townships into smaller ones.The townships in the province are as following: Urmia, Salmas, Naghadeh, Piranshahr, Bukan, Khoy, Mahabad, Oshnaviyeh, Sardasht, Chaldoran, Miandoab, Maku, Takab, and Shahindej.

There are no official ethnicity census or statistics in West Azarbaijan. However it is believed that 6 of these 14 townships are reportedly Kurdish in majority, namely Oshnaviyeh, Piranshahr, Bukan, Sardasht, and Mahabad, while Miandoab, Naghadeh, and Urmia are thought to have Azaris in the majority. The remaining townships have both ethnicities in various mixed proportions.

In addition to the Turkish and Kurdish peoples that constitute the majority of the province's population, there are also four small ethnic and religious minorities who are native to the province, namely: Assyrians, Chaldeans, Armenians, and the Jews.

Religious diversity in the province also has a long tradition. The religions in the province are: Islam (both Sunni and Shia sects), Christianity (Armenian and Assyrian orthodox), Judaism, and Yarasani. Kurds follow the Sunni branch while the Azeris are Shias, except a very small miniority who follow a religion called Yarasani. Christianity is the main religion of Assyrians, Chaldeans and Armenians.

2. Either let the above text stand by itself (without any links attached directly) and instead put all references and supporting links at the bottom of the page (in the references section), OR use opposing references to support and balance the text above (without changing the text). I support the former, because it is less contentious.

3. Delete the right-most column in the table in the section. There is no conclusive evidence to support its claims in many cities, and it is constantly a source of edit wars. Especially in lieu of the text I just proposed above.--Zereshk 04:40, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

1. I could not understand number 2;

Exept 6 cities Bukan, Mahabdad, Miandoab, Oshnovieh, Sardasht and Piranshahr other cities are ethnically heterogeneous which means have a significant minority i.e have a large other language speaking population in the city. (Turkish or Kurdish).

2. Despite I still believe in what the table says but I offer a better suggestion for right-most column in the table: Putting the word township instead of the word city in the section ethnicity.

3. I made some changes in the article trying make the article more neutral. If you did not like it you can revert it.

The reason that I put the word mostly for Miandoab (Both city and towndhip) is that there are some Kurdish villages there (although not much in number). I can name the village of TOPZAWA.

D iyako Talk + 14:18, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

The 3rd column (first column from the right) must be removed. There is no documentary basis for it. How do you know there are absolutely no Turks in Mahabad, for example? In fact, the CIA map you keep talking about shows a Qarabakh Turkish tribe to be residing there.

Either use the word "heterogenous" or use the word "predominantly". Not both. Because "predominantly" already implies heterogeneity. You cant use the word "pre-dominantly Kurdish" for Kurdish cities, and then come around and use "heterogenous" for predominantly Turkish cities. The biased intention is pretty obvious there.

Since noone has commented on the proposals I made, Im making changes to reflect what I have proposed. Please see if you agree.--Zereshk 05:30, 30 December 2005 (UTC)

Because in those cities (Mukrian) Kurds make up 99% of population. in fact except of the police stations or a small minority from other cities of Iran there is no non-kurdish people. The area even is not Industrialized to absorb other non-Kurdish people.

The area which you refer in the map is not Mahabad; but the northwestern part of the township of Naghadeh; an area which is called "Serahe Naghade (an area far out of Naghade which has a road to Mahabad-Naghade-Urmia), also Mohamdiar (a very small town or a big village)" .

In fact none of five southern Kurdish townships (Mukrian) have even a non-Kurdish village. on the other hand till 5 Km of Miandoab is kurdish. this is true about all other cities of the province except Mukrian. another thing which I want mention here is that Naghadeh (where I have benn there) has not prodomiately Turkish population.

and should be corrected in the article.

D iyako Talk + 08:18, 30 December 2005 (UTC)

"99%" by definition is not the same as "homogenous".--Zereshk 17:42, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

They do not reside there forever but only for several weeks or monthes or up till 2 years. mostly have left their families in thier cities. this is not like Kurds in other non-Mukrian cities of the province who are born, live and die their with their families. (with a large population in those cities).

But If you like I do not use the word "Homogenous".

D iyako Talk + 18:08, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

Any sources for that claim? Or are you making up fiction again? The Azaris I saw there were not visitors. They lived there permanently.--Zereshk 19:57, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

Those I wrote above are not about Urmia. I was talking about Mukrian region. I will not remove things about the "city" of Urmia (+ Miandoab), But about naghadeh I do not think the Turks are predominant (I think The Kurds are). Anyway I just correct Naghadeh there.

D iyako Talk + 20:10, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

OK. How about if we say : "some believe the Kurds to be in majority while others report the Azeris to be the majority in Naghadeh." Agreeable?--Zereshk 21:08, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

Ok, I agree. D iyako Talk + 21:14, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

Good. So now we only have the problem of the last column of the table. Either it must be somehow modified, or removed. Removal is better in my opinion. We've already stated which cities have what majority.--Zereshk 21:46, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

Yes. We have already stated the info but the table is a mean to make it more easy to understand. What is your saggestion by modifying the third colomn? (Except of removing).

My suggestion is to write "ethnic grous in their townships" instead of the single word "ethnicity. It is somehow clarification to the table keeping it neutral.

D iyako Talk + 21:55, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

(+ Also we can add the table the city telephone codes to remove extra space)

D iyako Talk + 21:57, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

"easier to understand"? OK. Then lets take out that paragraph, which repeats the same material in a hard way to understand, and instead work on the table. Good?--Zereshk 22:11, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

Actually I had not added the table. in future if someone thinks the table should stay in the article we must ask him his reason (that why he thinks so). Now that you do not agree with the third colomn we can replace the telephone codes there; (If necessary).

But many articles have a table and it is not against Wikipedia policy. I think the colomn must be there and not removed.

D iyako Talk + 22:42, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

It's not the table itself thats the trouble. It's the contents under the column titled "Ethnicity in the township" that is problematic. The same old problems are manifested there again: How on earth do you know that there are no Azeris at all in Mahabad? How can you be so certain? On what basis? Even a 1% Azeri population would invalidate your claim. The same for all other cities.--Zereshk 07:39, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

In those 5 cities There is not any Azari population or even a village. also Azaris are not indigenous there. Maybe for a short time visiting some slight numbers travell there but not for living or working.

D iyako Talk + 08:24, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

What do you mean "indigenous"? "Visiting"?!! Who told you such stupid things? That's why I put up that verify tag. Because of such idiotic claims. Maybe the Kurds ride Taxis from Turkey everyday to Mahabad! No wonder I saw a lot of buses when I went to Bitlis!--Zereshk 09:34, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

Those 5 cities are not like Urmia and are entirlely kurdish. You zereshk when it is about urmia say """""""No، 49% is still a "minority".--Zereshk 04:19, 28 December 2005 (UTC) """"""""" (I know the reason) but for southern cities say """""""Even a 1% Azeri population would invalidate your claim.""""""""" You are realllllyyy biased. You cannot hide your pro-Turkish POV.

آقای محترم شما یا واقعا حرفهای من را نمیفهمید یا اینکه‌ تجاهل میکنید من واقعا شوکه‌ شدم از این هم اصرار و لجبازی شما یک حرفهایی میزنید آدم شاخ درمیاره‌.

تنفر از کردها هم حدی داره‌. من میدانم برای شما خون ما چقدر کثیف است. احساسات و عواطف شما را درک میکنم اما دیگر دموگرافی منطقه‌ را چرا تغییر میدهید. D iyako Talk + 09:46, 2 January 2006 (UTC)..

Look Diyako, my patience is thining with you. Either youre stupid, or youre playing me. Listen (read) carefully:

For Urmia I said Azaris are a "majority". "Majority" means anything >50%. "Minority" means anything <50%. OK? I never said 100% of Urmia was Azari.
You however, are claiming Kurds are 100% of population in Mahabad (and all other Kurdish cities). I'm saying: No. Kurds are a "majority". But not 100%. Because there is no such thing as 100%. Anywhere. Haaleet shod?--Zereshk 10:09, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

Ok, I Understand but this cannot change the info of the table becuase it has the same info as the above paragraph but abbreviated. D iyako Talk + 10:14, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

در ضمن قرار هم نیست هرکی از حقیقتی خوشش نیامد بره‌ الکی برچسب بزنه‌ به‌ مقاله شما, دارید ظلم میکنید. D iyako Talk + 10:16, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

No Diyako. The Haghighat is that there is no evidence for what you say. All your sources are shitty made-up sources like Kurdistanica.com and other PKK terrorist crap.
And what the fuck does "Kurdish and Turkish" mean in the table for Urmia? EXPLAIN to me your latest lie again.--Zereshk 10:19, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

فکر کردی من میزارم تو راست راست اینجا دروغ بگی؟--Zereshk 10:23, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

Im sick and tired of you historical revisionists. Leave Iran alone!--Zereshk 10:25, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

The Township of Urmia

Latest comment: 18 years ago20 comments2 people in discussion

Which one of my sources are from PKK? this is ONE OF YOUR LIES HAZRATE ZERESHK. KURDISTANMEDICAS MAP ARE FROM AN AMERICAN UNIVERCITY NOT FROM HOWZAYE ELMIYAYE QOM OR SHIRAZ.

THE KURKISH AND TURKISH IN THE TABLE ARE FOR THE TOWNSHIP (SHAHRESTAN IN PERSIAN) WHICH IS A LARGE AREA TWICE POPULOUS THAN THE CITY. (= THE POPULATION OF THE CITY AND THE TOWNSHIP) SO THIS IS WHAT THE TABLE MEAN. IN FACT MANY PEOPLE DOES NOT KNOW THE MEANING OF SHAHR AND SHAHRESTAN BUT THEY ARE DIFFERENT; SHARESTAN IS ABOUT OR MORE THAN 2 TIMES BIGGER.

D iyako Talk + 10:31, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

دوست عزیز شهر با شهرستان فرق دارد. در مورد ارومیه‌ گفته‌ شده Township که‌ به‌ معنی کل شهرستان وسیع اورمیه هست.

D iyako Talk + 10:35, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

The goddamn school you keep getting your maps from, is my University. OK? The University of Texas did not make those maps. They are only scanned and collected there.
You still havent explained: WHAT EXACTLY DOES "Kurdish and Turkish" mean? Why not "Turkish-Kurdish"?--Zereshk 10:37, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

This Turkish and Kurdish means that this township which may include 200-300 villages or more plus one, two or three towns or cities, major ethnic groups residing there are Kurdish + Turkish. D iyako Talk + 10:42, 2 January 2006 (UTC) D iyako Talk + 10:42, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

مثلا در کل شهرستان وسیع اورمیه این اقوام عمده‌ هستند.

که‌ شامل ارمنی ها که‌ 1.5% شهر (و فقط شهر) اورمیه هستند نمیشود. D iyako Talk + 10:44, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

Oh really, So you wouldnt mind if I changed it to "Turkish and Kurdish"? areh?--Zereshk 10:51, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

I do not mind. اینکه‌ اورمیه‌ را تغییر دادم ؟ نه‌ برای من مهم نیست اما به‌ تجربه‌ در خیلی مقالات دیگر برایم ثابت شده‌ که‌ بعضی روی آن دقت دارند. D iyako Talk + 10:56, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

No Diyako, you and I know very well what you meant by ordering those words. Stop playing koocheh ali-chap.

I easily smell the hypocricy of people like you. If you did not have the destruction of Iran in mind, I wouldnt see your posts everywhere trying to divide up Iran along ethnic lines for autonomy and secession. Everywhere I see, it's just you and your Kurdish PKK buddies trying to disect Iran. Not even a word is mentioned about Kurds on pages like Diyarbakır Province and Bitlis Province, which is full of Kurds. Why dont I ever see you there?

از هر چی آدم خاءن وطن فروش که به فکر فروپاشی ایران هست متنفرم. چه ترک چه کرد چه عرب.--Zereshk 11:06, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

No, I do not know what does it mean and if you think I have done a bad thing I revert it.

About Diyarbakir, I have been bussy and will write about it in close future.

من هم از هرچی دیکتاتور و فاشیست که‌ در حقیقت در طی صد سال اخیر ایران را به‌ وضعیت فروپاشی امروز رساندند متنفرم. اینان خود از همه‌ ضد ایرانی تر بودند. ملتها را نمیتوان برای همیشه‌ سرکوب و استثمار کرد. D iyako Talk + 11:12, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

Akhond ha yek goh, secessionist ha ham yek goh. Both are one and the same.--Zereshk 11:17, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

Tamamiat-talabhaye zaheri ham mesle akhonda pokhan!! dar haqiqat meyar raayat hoquqe shahrvandan ast. 3 tashoon agar raayat nakonan ye chizan. D iyako Talk + 11:22, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

khob hala ina che rabti dare be maqale. befarmaid moshkele maqale chie. What is wrong with the article? D iyako Talk + 11:29, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

غلط بیجا کرده هر خاءنی که تمامیت ارضی ایران را زیر سوال ببره

به هر عنوان

The relevance is that some people here are trying to divide up Iran by running everywhere on WP's Iranian pages claiming that Kurds live here, Kurds live there, Kurds live everywhere.

--Zereshk 11:36, 2 January 2006 (UTC)انگار اقلیتهای دیگه آدم نیستن

KASI KE AZMASH RA BARAY AZADAIYE MEYHANE KHODESH KARDE BASHE BA IN HARFA KAKESHAM NEMIGAZE!!

WIKIPEDIA IS NOT A FORUM OR PALTAK ROOM FOR POLITICAL DIALOGUES OR RTC...
WE ARE HERE TO WRITE NEUTRAL ARTICLES.

YES KURDS ARE IN ALL OF THE WEST AZARBAIJAN PROVINCE OF IRAN THIS IS NOT KOFR A TRUTH THAT WE CANNOT IGNORE. KASI HAM NAGOFTE KE AQALIYATHAYE DIGE ADAM NISTAN FAQAT SHOMA YE KHOORDE BITARAF BASHIN. D iyako Talk + 11:44, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

BUT YOU DID NOT SAY WHAT IS WRONG WITH THE ARTICLE? D iyako Talk + 11:49, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

No Diyako. Azarbaijan will always be Azari land. Instead of taking the land of other minorities, go and work on the provinces of Turkey. Oh, but you dont even know their names, do you? It shows your true intentions. past-fetrat e kha'en.

The claims on ethnic population figures are unsourced. That's whats wrong.--Zereshk 12:04, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

From my viewpoint I am not a "past fetrate khaen". I am just a man who nemitwanam zolmi ra ke bar milyonha irani mire qabul konam. ama man bazam az harfe shoma delgir nemisham chon shayad shoma in harfha ra jeddi migin wa waqean fekr mikonin ke man past fetrate haneam. baraye man hich chiz moqaddas nist. na shah, na Iran na khoda, na peyghambar. faqat mazlumtarine mardoman ba har nejad wa tirei ke bashand.

About southwestern and eastern provinces of Turkey I am not forced to write about them today but soon we will write. Yes I do know their names. I have lived in Turkey for several years. (+ some other countries).

There no fugures claimd on the article but basically we have just mentioned the major ethnic groups there.

D iyako Talk + 13:05, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

yeh you are past-fetrat Kha'en. midoni chera? Because we Turks arent allowed to use Azari in any official matters. We cant teach our language. They keep sending Persian governors in West & East Azarbaijan. Tabriz is the poorest large city of Iran. We cant do shit. BUT WE DONT GO AROUND TALKING OF SECESSION FROM IRAN AS A SOLUTION. That's called KHIYAANAT. It's what the MKO did for years.

Instead, we're trying to help Iran improve, both democratically and economically and socially.--Zereshk 13:15, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

This is a deep-rooted political issue which I can't explain it here. but actually this is a strongpoint for you turks which with your large population in Iran can be hopeful for your future in Iran. but actually as you know Iranian kurds NEVER were secessionist. The only thing they wanted was some culturall, economical, political... reforms which where denied and instead were attacked, were attaced and they defended themselves. As you know what central government call its enemies in the media: ... Secessionist, (!) killer, (!) spy (!) khaen (!) ...... which really the government were by itself. They "tishe be rishaye in mamlakat zadand". ta hamin 5-10 sal pish khaste mardome kurde iran faqat reform bud. wali hamin rejim dige waziato haadtar kard.

Ama yek chiz nagofte namanad. man aslan nationalist nistm. bizar ham hastam azesh. alan ham ke in moddat khodamo ba in maqale mashqul kardam chand dalil dasht: 1) ba anche ke bar khalafe moshahedate khodam bud mokhalefat mikradam. 2) baqie iraniha ke ya az qziye bikhabar budand ya howsaleye in bahse tulani ra nadashtand. 3) agar ham kasani peyda mishodand towzih nemidand hamintowri ba IP miumadand o edite khodeshoono mikardand o miraftand. vagar na man koja o nationalism koja.

Payande bashid. D iyako Talk + 13:42, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

Just remember, in Iran "tork haa kharand". Nobody calls Kurds "khar". We are the ones that are humiliated. And yet we have faith in Iran-zameen. If Cyrus was able to govern a multi-ethnic empire with justice, so it can happen again.--Zereshk 14:06, 2 January 2006 (UTC)

زرشک عزیز اولا در ایران فقط یک سری تهرانی لات و لوت می گن ترکا خرن که البته خدشون از همه خرترند اشاره به شعری از استاد شهریار که با این مصرع شروع می شود که ای تهرانی انصاف ده خر تویی یا من در ضمن کی گفته تبریز فقیر ترین شهر ایران است طبق آخرین اطلاعات تبریز پنجمین شهر ثروت مند ایران است.