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Template:Did you know nominations/Archie, Marry Me

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The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Yoninah (talk) 19:34, 16 May 2020 (UTC)

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Archie, Marry Me

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Created by Saginaw-hitchhiker (talk). Nominated by JeBonSer (talk) at 22:55, 20 March 2020 (UTC).

  • This is a comment rather than a review (I may review this if I have time, but for now I'm not sure if I can do it). I think a different hook has to be proposed here. The hook as written isn't really a hook, it's a statement of a fact, and it's something that's not going to catch attention among general readers. Having taken a quick look at the lede, I would suggest taking inspiration from the article sections on its production and critical reception; perhaps the fact that the song is inspired by the romance of the artist might work? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 10:49, 21 March 2020 (UTC)
  • How about this hook?:
  • ALT1:... that the name "Archie" from the song title "Archie, Marry Me" is a fictitious character? Source: "It is a fictitious character, but the situation was a bit of an autobiographical one," said singer Molly Rankin of Toronto’s Alvvays. Rolling Stone. JeBonSer (talk | sign) 06:15, 22 March 2020 (UTC)
I don't think that would work either, song being based on fictional characters is very common. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 07:00, 22 March 2020 (UTC)
That's a bit vague. Maybe there could be some focus on how the song was produced and written? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 05:15, 23 March 2020 (UTC)
  • ALT2 (reworded):... that the song "Archie, Marry Me" was rated as one of the best tracks on several lists of best songs in 2014? JeBonSer (talk | sign) 10:47, 25 March 2020 (UTC)
I think I was thinking more about how the song was influenced by how the song's performers saw that their friends were getting married. The part in the lede that goes Rankin and O'Hanley were romantically linked, and had been collaborating for some time creatively. Then in their mid-twenties, they observed friends quickly being wed with derision. An editor I asked on Discord also suggested that perhaps a hook on how the song begins with bird chirps might also work. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 09:08, 28 March 2020 (UTC)
I think it's more interesting if we stick to ALT2. What do you think? JeBonSer (talk | sign) 02:02, 29 March 2020 (UTC)
It really doesn't say much about the song itself, and a similar-enough hook could be made for any other popular song for 2014. I just don't think that direction is going to work out. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 03:03, 29 March 2020 (UTC)
  • ALT3... that Archie, Marry Me begins with birds chirping? Source:The song begins with the faint noise of birds chirping,[1]©Geni (talk) 09:11, 28 March 2020 (UTC)
  • Full review needed. BlueMoonset (talk) 15:12, 16 April 2020 (UTC)
  • New review. Article was new and long enough when nominated. It appears generally well-cited, though ref [27] is missing a link when it needs one. Of all the hooks proposed above, Alt3 is the only one that I think meets requirements, but it is quite short and a bit bland. I think that the best place to get interesting hooks from would be the music video section. Kingsif (talk) 17:37, 16 April 2020 (UTC)
  • @JeBonSer: Are you still planning to continue this? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 07:31, 26 April 2020 (UTC)
  • ALT4:... that in the making of the music video of "Archie, Marry Me", the battery of the camera that was used in filming was damaged but Alvvays fixed it by using vinegar to neutralize the battery fluid? Source: "So we made another super-8 video, one where we take 'take the plunge' to the logical extreme. The camera exploded at sea so we neutralized the black battery goo with vinegar and kept shooting. My hasty retreat via doggy-paddle was left on the cutting room floor. Go figure." Vice. JeBonSer (talk | sign) 04:01, 28 April 2020 (UTC)
    • A hook, not a story, please. Kingsif (talk) 05:16, 28 April 2020 (UTC)
  • ALT5:... that the sailboat which can be seen from the music video of "Archie, Marry Me" was borrowed from Alvvays friend's parents? Source: Molly Rankin: Our friend’s parents live on an amazing sailboat, and we thought it’d be fun to film us sailing around Toronto Island. www.northerntransmissions.com/interview-with-molly-rankin-from-alvvays/ JeBonSer (talk | sign) 07:43, 28 April 2020 (UTC)
  • ALT5 looks good. Might need some simplifying ("the sailboat used in the music video", perhaps) but satis. Kingsif (talk) 14:26, 28 April 2020 (UTC)
  • Hi, I came by to promote ALT5 (which doesn't seem so hooky to me), and the URL for the hook fact is missing. Also, it's strange to call it Alvvays friend's parents since Alvvays is missing a possessive apostrophe-s. Yoninah (talk) 22:08, 28 April 2020 (UTC)
  • If that's the URL I mentioned above, I thought it had been fixed when I was checking alt4 out. Alvvays seems to be a band, so I would leave it up to prep builders to fix that possessive. It's probably more interesting if the hook establishes Alvvays as the song's artist. I'm sure JeBonSer will be able to provide more hooks, though. Kingsif (talk) 23:29, 28 April 2020 (UTC)
ALT5a:... that a sailboat used by the band Alvvays for the music video of their song "Archie, Marry Me" was borrowed from the parents of their friend?
ALT5b:... that a sailboat used in the music video for the song "Archie, Marry Me" by Alvvays was borrowed from the parents of the band's friend?
@Kingsif, JeBonSer, and Yoninah: How about these wordings? Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 02:18, 29 April 2020 (UTC)
  • I honestly think this hook angle is flat. Yoninah (talk) 02:36, 29 April 2020 (UTC)
I prefer ALT5b. JeBonSer (talk | sign) 05:15, 29 April 2020 (UTC)
@JeBonSer and Yoninah: If I proposed some hooks, would Yoninah review them? Kingsif (talk) 03:59, 29 April 2020 (UTC)
@Kingsif: Considering Yoninah hasn't responded I'd be willing to check any additional hooks. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 11:30, 30 April 2020 (UTC)
  • Really, the article is GA-quality; there is lot of information here to develop into a hook. Perhaps:
  • ALT6: ... that midway through filming the music video for its 2013 debut song "Archie, Marry Me", Canadian indie pop band Alvvays sent its digital crew home and did the final clip with a Super 8 camera?
  • Please note that footnote 27 is missing a URL. Yoninah (talk) 11:54, 30 April 2020 (UTC)
  • Alt6 is much better. @JeBonSer:, I mentioned ref 27 two weeks ago, are you going to fix it? Kingsif (talk) 14:58, 30 April 2020 (UTC)
  • Plain url rather than link, but that only makes it a bit more difficult for mobile users. Approving alt6. Kingsif (talk) 15:21, 1 May 2020 (UTC)
  • Kingsif, I saw the plain URL and went to fix it, but it turns out that northerntransmissions.com is on Wikipedia's blacklist for some reason, so live links to it are not allowed. So I've left the reference as is without investigating further; an interview would seem to be okay even if the site has other issues, but I can't say that for sure. Pinging Yoninah for her take. BlueMoonset (talk) 17:01, 1 May 2020 (UTC)
  • Forget it, we are not using a blacklisted source. I've removed it from the page and left a "citation needed" tag for one sentence. Before I suggest another alt, Kingsif, I wonder if all the other refs are in order? There are some notable sources, but also some no-name ones. Yoninah (talk) 18:37, 2 May 2020 (UTC)
  • Do we know why it's on the blacklist? At least quite a few are there because IPs wouldn't stop dropping the link in plaintext or using the source inappropriately, even if it's fine in itself. I'll check the other refs, though. Kingsif (talk) 19:29, 2 May 2020 (UTC)
Other sources look fine. Kingsif (talk) 19:57, 2 May 2020 (UTC)
  • All the hooks have been struck due to sourcing issues, and no new hooks have been proposed in the past ten days. Unless an interesting hook that is supported by a valid source is proposed soon, I think we'll have to close the nomination. BlueMoonset (talk) 16:09, 12 May 2020 (UTC)
Will need a review for alt7 (since I did the full review and sources, another reviewer might also want to do that again). Note that the quoted "breakout" is not in the article, which paraphrases with 'breakthrough' instead (an easy tweak if accepted). Kingsif (talk) 18:32, 12 May 2020 (UTC)
I think ALT7's suitability would depend on a number of factors, such as if "breakthrough hits" not charting is a common occurrence or not, or how well known Alvvays is. Personally I'd never heard of them before this nomination, but perhaps someone who's more familiar with Canadian music and the genre they work in might be able to provide some more input. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 14:10, 13 May 2020 (UTC)
  • Having read the article, and looked at the sources, I think Alt7 will work. --evrik (talk) 14:19, 15 May 2020 (UTC)
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