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Template:Did you know nominations/Home is the Sailor

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The following discussion is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by BlueMoonset (talk) 04:12, 23 May 2012 (UTC)

Home is the Sailor

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  • Reviewed: Not required per current DYK rules. --PFHLai (talk) 00:00, 30 April 2012 (UTC)

Created/expanded by Lihaas (talk). Nominated by PFHLai (talk) at 00:00, 30 April 2012 (UTC)

  • I have made some changes, such as page moving. However, the hook is already known in many pages, even if people do not know the title of this episode. Kirstie Alley's debut is already mentioned in List of Cheers episodes. Nevertheless, I wonder if this hook is still eligible, but it is nothing new. --George Ho (talk) 23:54, 5 May 2012 (UTC)
I don't understand why the hook fact would be ineligible. All hook facts are known facts, otherwise there would be no references. This fact in particular has not been used on DYK. BTW, good call on the page move and starting the disambiguation page. Thanks. --PFHLai (talk) 18:24, 6 May 2012 (UTC)
Well, I don't mean that it was used before in DYK. Whether used or not, this fact existed for a long time in List of Cheers episodes and Cheers, even without the episode's name. --George Ho (talk) 18:45, 6 May 2012 (UTC)
And now we have a brand new wikiarticle on this episode (though a short article). I do not see any eligibility issues. Even if the DYK candidate is an old wikiarticle, the hook fact should still be eligible if the old wikiarticle gets a 5X expansion. --PFHLai (talk) 19:09, 6 May 2012 (UTC)
We could come up with some alternative like "a brunette was chosen to replace the blonde lead"? Even adding th caveat "Female lead"? Should be good to go thenLihaas (talk) 23:13, 6 May 2012 (UTC)

The fact that the non-blonde lead was planned already existed for more than two weeks in the Sam and Diane and I Do, Adieu articles, even if the brunette wasn't mentioned. --George Ho (talk) 23:38, 6 May 2012 (UTC)

Neither Sam and Diane nor I Do, Adieu articles were DYK articles. And George, if you find a stub with an interesting fact that has been part of Wikipedia for a decade, you can 5X expand the article, nominate this expanded article for DYK, and use this old fact as hook materials, as long as the hook is not too similar to a recent hook on DYK. The hook has to be new to DYK, but not necessarily new to Wikipedia. --PFHLai (talk) 01:29, 7 May 2012 (UTC)
So what were the hooks that weren't "new" to Wikipedia but "new" to DYK? By the way, everybody knows that Kirstie Alley replaced Shelley Long, and the occurence (episode, date, hair) may not be necessary. --George Ho (talk) 01:47, 7 May 2012 (UTC)
I meant the hook facts for use on DYK do not need to be new to Wikipedia. And I don't think everyone knows when exactly Alley replaced Long. Now we have an article on that particular episode. --PFHLai (talk) 02:02, 7 May 2012 (UTC)
Alternatively just suggest any hook that could fit instead of this arguement stretching on ;)Lihaas (talk) 09:18, 7 May 2012 (UTC)
Well, Lihaas, it's your article. Can you make it longer? Maybe there are potential hook materials you can add to the article. Maybe some TV critic made some outrageous comments about this episode that can be used as a hook? Alternatively, I would like to hear from George why he thinks the hook is not eligible. --PFHLai (talk) 02:24, 8 May 2012 (UTC)

Okay. If the interest is not relevant to the eligibility, then I don't know how these hooks (hair or name of episode) are eligible or ineligible for DYK. The known hook already exists before this article's creation, and the known hook is known in Cheers already before this article, and having an episode name or hair color doesn't make any difference to me, unless I'm wrong. By the way, anything added must be relevant to the character's debut, actress's debut, or the episode itself; anything related to the character overall must be inserted in Rebecca Howe. --George Ho (talk) 03:15, 8 May 2012 (UTC)

So you seem to be okey with the hair hook? Although they dont have to be in Rebecca's article as that is not relevant to this particular page...the DYK page is the episode.Lihaas (talk) 13:46, 8 May 2012 (UTC)

As I said, neither hair nor episode name matters for the hook content, although I'm okay with the hook. The matter more is the eligibility of and enthusiasm toward this hook, as far as I'm concerned. --George Ho (talk) 14:10, 8 May 2012 (UTC)

i think the hair one is interesting, esp. since it played a part in the casting decision and wasnt just a by-productLihaas (talk) 09:32, 9 May 2012 (UTC)
Added two hooks above. --George Ho (talk) 14:14, 9 May 2012 (UTC)
  • This needs a first reviewer. Lihaas is listed as creator, but George Ho has done enough editing and additions to the article that it would be inappropriate for him to formally review it. BlueMoonset (talk) 04:58, 14 May 2012 (UTC)
    • I have removed some logos that I substituted. --George Ho (talk) 05:18, 14 May 2012 (UTC)
  • This wasn't meant as a criticism, George; I just didn't want potential reviewers passing over this nomination thinking that a review was in progress, when it was a discussion of potential hooks. It frequently happens that people will assume that there is already a reviewer at the helm when a review has accumulated even a few non-review comments, and thus skip a nomination that needs someone to work on it. BlueMoonset (talk) 05:28, 14 May 2012 (UTC)
  • Article new big and referenced enough. Original hook is in article, and confirmed by a reference, but thanks to there being no inline references on the lede, no reference appears on the hook in the article. I think that some one could add the reference to the hook statement to get the through, or could verify one of the other hooks. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 11:45, 22 May 2012 (UTC)
    • Why is the inline citation needed? The primary source is already implied. --George Ho (talk) 12:52, 22 May 2012 (UTC)
      • ...Just in case, I hope one inline reference cites the hook very well. --George Ho (talk) 13:10, 22 May 2012 (UTC)
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