Template:Did you know nominations/Joseph (art model)

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Bruxton (talk) 13:59, 5 May 2023 (UTC)

Joseph (art model)

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Portrait of Joseph

... that Théodore Géricault's paintings of Haitian-born model Joseph are unusual in portraying him as 'an actual, distinct person'? Source: Brathwaite, Peter (2023). Rediscovering Black Portraiture. Cheryl Finley, Temi Odumosu, Mark Sealy (contributors). Los Angeles: Getty Publications. p. 119. ISBN 978-1-60606-816-8.
- ALT1: ... that Joseph may have been shipwrecked three times on The Raft of the Medusa? Source: The Raft of the Medusa (1818–1819) section
- ALT2: ... that Joseph became one of École des Beaux-Arts's only three male models? Source: https://www.radiofrance.fr/franceculture/joseph-ou-le-renouveau-du-modele-noir-au-xixe-5846944
- Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/Battle of Malacca (1641)
- Comment: The first two hooks were Tamzin's suggestions.

Improved to Good Article status by Ppt91 (talk). Nominated by Onegreatjoke (talk) at 17:45, 30 March 2023 (UTC). Post-promotion hook changes for this nom will be logged at Template talk:Did you know nominations/Joseph (art model); consider watching this nomination, if it is successful, until the hook appears on the Main Page.

This qualifies for DYK as a recently-reviewed Good Article. As would be expected, it is well-written and carefully referenced. It is easily long enough and is original text with any quotations attributed properly. The image is in the public domain (painter died in 1924) and looks good at thumbnail scale. QPQ done. I find the article as a whole very interesting but feel that the offered hooks don't quite capture this. Checking the source for the first hook, it uses the phrase "an actual, distinct person" but it doesn't convey that this was "unusual". Arguably it is not unusual that a facial portrait by a skilled artist would convey the impression that the subject is an actual person. ALT1 is cleverly phrased, but the "may" is so weak that it pretty much stops it being an impressive hook (I notice the language of the article itself is stronger). ALT2 has the opposite issue: it is an unambiguous statement backed up with an inline citation, but is it surprising that an art school at one point employed only three male models? In the "Late years (1840s–1860s)" section of the article, we learn that Joseph was said to be known to every painter and sculptor in France, and said to be the most beautiful model in Paris. Can the wording of ALT1 be made more categorical, or a new hook made from one of these surprising superlatives? The author has done great work for Wikipedia's coverage of visual art by documenting this person; there now just needs to be a DYK hook worthy of the article. MartinPoulter (talk) 13:56, 31 March 2023 (UTC)

@Onegreatjoke: Do you have time to take another look at this article? MartinPoulter (talk) 08:44, 11 April 2023 (UTC)

MartinPoulter Is it okay for me to suggest an alternative, given I was the author? Despite being active in GA, I've never actually participated in DYK before and am not sure whether the protocol allows this. Thanks! Ppt91 ^talk 17:45, 15 April 2023 (UTC)

User:Ppt91. You're very welcome to! MartinPoulter (talk) 17:34, 16 April 2023 (UTC)

@Ppt91: Status report? BorgQueen (talk) 06:06, 22 April 2023 (UTC)

@BorgQueen: sorry for my delay and thanks for checking in. I tried to find a way to rephrase some of the original suggestions. I think that simply saying "... Joseph, a 19th-century Haitian acrobat, served as a principal model for Theodore Gericault's Raft of the Medusa (1818-1819)?" There are multiple sources for this, but first wanted to know if it'd work. I appreciate your taking the time to help with this! Ppt91 ^talk 18:42, 23 April 2023 (UTC)

@Cielquiparle and Theleekycauldron: could you help them by suggesting a few more interesting hooks? BorgQueen (talk) 18:48, 23 April 2023 (UTC)

I must say, I think ALT1 is pretty good – how do you get shipwrecked three times on the same ship? theleekycauldron (talk • contribs) (she/her) 21:18, 23 April 2023 (UTC)

General: Article is new enough and long enough
New enough: Long enough:

Policy: Article is sourced, neutral, and free of copyright problems
Adequate sourcing: Neutral: Free of copyright violations, plagiarism, and close paraphrasing:

Hook: Hook has been verified by provided inline citation
Cited: - Offline/paywalled citation accepted in good faith Interesting:

Image: Image is freely licensed, used in the article, and clear at 100px.
Freely licensed: Used in article: Clear at 100px:

QPQ: Done.

Overall: Approve ALT0 only. While ALT1 might sound interesting, he wasn't actually "shipwrecked" three times, according to the article. Too much poetic distortion which won't survive the MP exposure it's going to get. BorgQueen (talk) 16:32, 25 April 2023 (UTC)