- The following discussion is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was: promoted by Crisco 1492 (talk) 14:32, 15 April 2012 (UTC)
Martin Lutz
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- ... that in 1974, conductor Martin Lutz started the career of the concert choir Schiersteiner Kantorei in the Christophoruskirche (pictured) in a suburb of Wiesbaden?
- Reviewed: Blue Gum Forest, Blue Mountains
Created/expanded by Dr. Blofeld (talk), Gerda Arendt (talk), Symposiarch (talk). Nominated by Gerda Arendt (talk) at 23:22, 30 March 2012 (UTC)
Not a direct citation on the hook on the Martin Lutz article, but an even bigger problem is that the Lutz article does not say that he started the career of Schiersteiner Kantorei. Also, is bachs-cantatas.com a reliable source, especially for a BLP? I would try to find better sources. Finally, you might want to make a cited mention of Martin Lutz on the Christophoruskirche article so that they both tie in together for a double nom. Right now, Lutz has a mention of Christophoruskirche, but Christophoruskirche does not mention Lutz.--¿3family6 contribs 12:29, 13 April 2012 (UTC)
- I will look after the sourcing, please help me word that Lutz found the rather usual church choir at the Schierstein church and made it an unusual large concert choir, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:41, 13 April 2012 (UTC)
- I'm not sure what the sources say, but depending on what is cited, you could say something to the lines of "Lutz discovered the choir at Schierstein church and transformed it into an unusual large concert choir." If you're looking to make that the hook, the wording will have to be polished. Is that what you are after?--¿3family6 contribs 12:55, 13 April 2012 (UTC)
- I now made the ref name="goethe" (de) the primary source, bach-cantatas supporting (en). I copied some from Lutz to the church and some from the choir to Lutz and hope not to get into trouble because of plagiarism. Lutz didn't discover the choir but took over from his predecessor and made it "zu einem der heute mit 140 Sängerinnen und Sängern größten und leistungsfähigsten Chöre Hessens", one of Hesse's largest and most capable (?? Google translate knows no good word) choirs. Can you polish? I am German ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:34, 13 April 2012 (UTC)
- No problem. How does this sound for a hook?
- ALT1 ... that Martin Lutz of the Christophoruskirche (pictured) expanded the Schiersteiner Kantorei to one of the largest choirs in Hesse?
- Comment: I'm still a little uneasy about the use of bachs-cantatas.com as a source for Martin Lutz, because it appears to be a self-published source. But the hook is cited good.--¿3family6 contribs 16:52, 13 April 2012 (UTC)
- Bach-cantatas was introduced by the other author who doesn't speak German that well, I don't want to through it out, for most facts is just a support. If you question what is said about him as a harpsichordist the article could live without it. Bach-cantatas copies and translates from other sources. The hook: to introduce two unknown topics without even mentioning the country seems a bit tricky.
- ALT2 ... that Martin Lutz developed the Schiersteiner Kantorei from a church choir at the Christophoruskirche (pictured) in a suburb of Wiesbaden to one of the largest choirs in Hesse? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:15, 13 April 2012 (UTC)
- A bit wordy. Maybe if it could be condensed a little, that should work (maybe also Germany could be mentioned). I still am uneasy about the use of bachs-cantatas.com because self-published sources should never be used to makes statements about living people, unless published by the person themselves. But that shouldn't hold up the DYK.
- Nor should lenght, I think, because in double noms the title of the second entry is not counted. - As for the source, I think that restriction makes sense in case of something negative about the person. Trying to shorten:
- ALT3 ... that German conductor Martin Lutz developed the Schiersteiner Kantorei from a suburbian church choir at the Christophoruskirche (pictured) to one of the largest choirs in Hesse? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 06:34, 14 April 2012 (UTC)
