Template:Did you know nominations/Temperance songs

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: rejected by — Maile (talk) 21:30, 18 November 2015 (UTC)
Withdrawn by nominator

Temperance songs

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Temperance song sheet music cover

... that Stephen Foster wrote a song against the dangers of alcohol (another temperance song pictured) set to the same tune as "Oh! Susanna"?

ALT1:... that the tune for "Oh! Susanna" by Stephen Foster was used ten years later by Foster to write a song (another temperance song pictured) against the dangers of alcohol?

Created by Barbara (WVS) (talk). Self-nominated at 10:46, 14 October 2015 (UTC).

Comments, not a review. @Barbara (WVS): Commendable subject, first of all. Secondly, I'm not sure you can claim Stephen Foster and Oh Susanna! as DYK, although you can link them in the hooks. I'm guessing that's what you really meant to do, but are uncertain about the process steps here.

Temperance songs created by Barbara (WVS) on October 14, 2015 - no problem with the date on this one.
Oh Susanna! is too old for DYK credit (but you can link it). It was created May 19, 2005 and has not been expanded.
Stephen Foster was created January 30, 2003 and was 10065 characters (0 words) "readable prose size" on Aug 25, 2015, the last date before you began expansion with your alternate account of Bfpage. It would have to be 50,325 characters of readable prose to qualify as 5X expansion. At present, it's only 12991 characters (0 words) "readable prose size" Also, the expansion needs to be done within 7 days of the nomination. You started that expansion on Sept 14, 2015.
You need to source the Political developments section.

So, I'm giving the turn-around arrow here, to make sure somebody gives this nomination a complete review. And I'm pinging @Mandarax: and @BlueMoonset: to see if any technical tweaks about the two hooks need to be given to this template.— Maile (talk) 22:12, 17 October 2015 (UTC)

Done. I also added a caption and (pictured), which anyone should feel free to shorten or otherwise tweak. MANdARAX • XAЯAbИAM 01:43, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

Thank you so much for the fix and I apologize for not fully understanding the process, which resulted in someone else having to take the time to clarify my submission to highlight the Temperance songs article. I knew the others didn't meet the standards but thought they all had to be submitted because they all appear in the hook. The graphic that accompanies the submission is a cover from another Temperance song, not the Stephen Foster song. The text on the graphic is quite amusing and says something like "the lips that touch liquor shall never touch mine" but it is not the temperance song he wrote. The graphic is meant to represent an example of a Temperance song, not the Stephen Foster song. Sorry to bore you with the details but the exact lyrics to Foster's temperance song is contained in the article Temperance songs. You'll have to hum "Oh Susanna" along with the new lyrics sometime, it will make you laugh.

Barbara (WVS) (talk) 02:08, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

Perhaps the Alt wording would be best to highlight the name of the article Temperance song.

Barbara (WVS) (talk) 02:12, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

For accuracy, the (pictured) is pretty wordy. It should ideally be trimmed if someone can figure out how to do it appropriately, or maybe it could be omitted. MANdARAX • XAЯAbИAM 02:34, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

I trimmed the "sheet music cover" phrase from the parenthetical "pictured" in both of the above hooks, while leaving "temperance" there so the word does appear somewhere in the hook, but I also reordered ALT1 as ALT1a below, which I hope is a bit more compact. Let me know if you think it works. BlueMoonset (talk) 03:07, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

ALT1a:... that Stephen Foster's tune for "Oh! Susanna" was reused by him ten years later to write a song against the dangers of alcohol (another temperance song pictured)?

I concur with the ALT1a version and have located other graphics to go with the hook, although I love the original graphic for its wording: "The lips that touch liquor shall never touch mine".

File:Oh! Susanna 1.jpg
The Drunkard's Progress - Color.jpg
File:StephenFoster.jpeg
File:Stephen Foster.jpg

Barbara (WVS) (talk) 16:28, 21 October 2015 (UTC)

Hi Barbara - Welcome. I have added some comments to the articles talk page as well as I hope made some useful additions. I'm still working at present. WE do have a problem with showing the complete lyrics to songs. This should really be in wikisource and we should only reproduce enough to support the article. I hope to suggest another hook in a moment, but I need to check that its sourced. Victuallers (talk) 16:18, 30 October 2015 (UTC)

Full review still needed. BlueMoonset (talk) 06:07, 11 November 2015 (UTC)

New enough, long enough, I like hook ALT 1a but I think the picture should be dropped, an image of text does not work well in DYK thumbnails, within policy, no copyvios found. However, the hook fact is not directly cited in the article, and worse, large chunks of the article are not cited at all, including the Oh! Susanna section to which the hook relates. QPQ not required for new editor. SpinningSpark 17:27, 12 November 2015 (UTC)

Since nominating this article, other editors have added content without references and have made, hmmm, other edits that may have lowered the quality of the article so I have to withdraw the nomination at this time since it would take a couple of hours to bring it up to standards. Best Regards,

Barbara (WVS) (talk) 13:35, 17 November 2015 (UTC)