User:Walwal20/RfC Hartley Jackson

Request for comment: Are any or all of the sources below sufficient for stating that Hartley Jackson was part of the tag team The Mighty Don't Kneel (TMDK) in the years of 2015 and 2016?

Two important policies and guidelines to keep in mind here are:

• the official WP:SOURCES,
• the official WP:BLP,
• the unofficial list of reliable sources on pro wrestling (it is an WP:ESSAY).

The sources are as follows:

Main sources:

• [1] Official announcement of the event "Hostile Takeover 2016" hosted by Melbourne City Wrestling, stating that Hartley Jackson and Slex formed the team named The Mighty Don't Kneel. Might take a bit to load, but have faith (and patience).

No mention of which match involved TMDK so useless. 2001:8003:512D:C201:30B8:567C:1D83:DC8B (talk) 03:18, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

• [2] Official "wrestling rampage" advertisement of Hartley's appearance as a TMDK group. Can also find the facebook post here [3].

Can't use Wordpress. Not official. 2001:8003:512D:C201:30B8:567C:1D83:DC8B (talk) 03:18, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

• [4] Cage Match's website with all or most TMDK appearances, where Hartley Jackson appear multiple times as part of a TMDK team.

Matches results <> Stable membership no matter what 2001:8003:512D:C201:30B8:567C:1D83:DC8B (talk) 03:18, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

• [5] Article on the Vice claiming that Hartley was a member of TMDK in 2016.

Vice has no consensus on it's reliability. 2001:8003:512D:C201:30B8:567C:1D83:DC8B (talk) 03:18, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

• [6] Review on 411mania claiming that Hartley was a member of TMDK.

Not reliable outside of the main wrestling promotions when it comes to show reports. 2001:8003:512D:C201:30B8:567C:1D83:DC8B (talk) 03:18, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

• [7] Last Word on Sports article about the history of TMDK, which states that "By June of 2015, Hartley was competing in matches as a member of TMDK". According to the cagematch source above, that was indeed Hartley's first appearance with TMDK.

Source list in the Pro Wrestling project area also calls this unreliable. 2001:8003:512D:C201:30B8:567C:1D83:DC8B (talk) 03:18, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

If you are still unsure:

• [8] Article from a podcast on wrestling. It mentions Hartley as being part of TMDK.

Unreliable. Wordpress.

• [9] Another member of TMDK claiming that Hartley was once a member of TMDK.

Addict has said this was Reed going into business for himself. 2001:8003:512D:C201:30B8:567C:1D83:DC8B (talk) 03:18, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

• [10] Users commenting on a pro wrestling forum. They don't show any doubt that Hartley was part of TMDK.

Forums aren't reliable 2001:8003:512D:C201:30B8:567C:1D83:DC8B (talk) 03:18, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

• [11] Official "wrestling rampage" advertisement.

Ads aren't allowed. 2001:8003:512D:C201:30B8:567C:1D83:DC8B (talk) 03:18, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

• [12] Another official ad from "wrestling rampage", referring to the match June 20th 2015 match shown in the Cage Match source above as being TMDK (Hartley Jackson, Jonah Rock & Marcius Pitt) defeat The Brotherhood (Chris Vice, Damian Slater & Havok). The picture here shows Hartley on the same side as Jonah Rock and Marcius Pitt.

Ads aren't allowed. 2001:8003:512D:C201:30B8:567C:1D83:DC8B (talk) 03:18, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

Context of this RfC:

This RfC is the result of a lengthy discussion in the AfD Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Hartley_Jackson_(3rd_nomination), recently closed as keep.

Survey:

Please say Yes or Support if you think the answer to the RfC question is affirmative, that is, these sources justify stating that Hartley Jackson was a member of TMDK.
Say No or Oppose if you think the sources do not satisfy WP:VERIFIABILITY guidelines for asserting he was a member of TMDK.

• Yes, the first source in particular is official and reliable; the other sources increase the degree of certainty of the statement. Walwal20 ^{talk ▾ contribs} 22:41, 28 September 2020 (UTC)
• No This would be the place to show you how the sources fail the test of notability.
• The first source from the archives is a primary source. Under the rules of WP:BLP sources must be neutral. The MCW site is not neutral as it is a part of the professional wrestling business.
• The second source is not official because it is a blog hosted by Wordpress. Even if it was it is also not neutral per the first source. The same applies to the Facebook "back up".
• The third source is not to be used not because of a notability essay, but because of the formal listings here which carries the consensus of members of the project (or has sources)
• The fourth source is unreliable per the same page. It is explained on there that the managing editor of said source previously wrote for a well known unreliable source. Check it out.
• The other four sources are absolutely not permitted - Wordpress again, a forum (subject to gossip and rumour) and Facebook twice.
• It is clear per WP:SOCIALMEDIA that sources can not be "unduly self serving or an exceptional claim". These sources both. Further per WP:EXCEPTIONAL it is clear that exceptional sources are needed. None of the sources fulfill this criteria. Addicted4517 (talk) 01:48, 13 October 2020 (UTC)
  • Comment: The essay on pro wrestling notability says (for cagematch.com) Marginally reliable. Strictly used for match results and not other information. Takes user submissions but is reviewed by regional editors that verify all submissions before they are added to the database., and we are exactly using only match results here. That is, we aren't using anything from their [blog posts], for example. Walwal20 ^{talk ▾ contribs} 10:47, 13 October 2020 (UT
• Yes these sources definitely justify stating that Hartley Jackson was a member of TMDK. Jammo85 (talk) 15:10, 14 October 2020 (UTC)
• No See my additions. Not a member of TMDK. End of. 2001:8003:512D:C201:30B8:567C:1D83:DC8B (talk) 03:20, 8 July 2024 (UTC)