Andreea Teia

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Hello, Andreea Teia, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Unfortunately, one or more of the pages you created may not conform to some of Wikipedia's guidelines, and may not be retained.

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I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you have any questions, check out Wikipedia:Questions or ask me on my talk page. Again, welcome! —Torchiest ^talk_edits 23:14, 2 October 2012 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Young & Talented School of Stage & Screen

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A tag has been placed on Young & Talented School of Stage & Screen requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under section G12 of the criteria for speedy deletion, because the article or image appears to be a clear copyright infringement. For legal reasons, we cannot accept copyrighted text or images borrowed from other web sites or printed material, and as a consequence, your addition will most likely be deleted. You may use external websites as a source of information, but not as a source of sentences. This part is crucial: say it in your own words. Wikipedia takes copyright violations very seriously and persistent violators will be blocked from editing.

If the external website or image belongs to you, and you want to allow Wikipedia to use the text or image — which means allowing other people to modify it — then you must verify that externally by one of the processes explained at Wikipedia:Donating copyrighted materials. If you are not the owner of the external website or image but have permission from that owner, see Wikipedia:Requesting copyright permission. You might want to look at Wikipedia's policies and guidelines for more details, or ask a question here.

If you think that the page was nominated in error, contest the nomination by clicking on the button labelled "Click here to contest this speedy deletion" in the speedy deletion tag. Doing so will take you to the talk page where you can explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. You can also visit the page's talk page directly to give your reasons, but be aware that once a page is tagged for speedy deletion, it may be removed without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag yourself, but do not hesitate to add information that is consistent with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. —Torchiest ^talk_edits 23:14, 2 October 2012 (UTC)

Creating a new article in line with policy

Hi there. The problem with the article you created is that it looked like you copied and pasted almost all of its content from the website of the school. Since Wikipedia is supposed to be free for anyone to copy and redistribute, it cannot have any copyrighted material from anywhere else, because that can cause legal problems.

You have a few options. First, and probably best would be to rewrite the entire article, using the school's website as a source, but not copying directly from it. A second option is to get permission from the school to use its content, but that is generally not preferred for text, I believe. Check the links in the second paragraph in the section above this one for more information.

Having said all that, you should also take a look at the brief deletion discussion at this link to see a few other concerns. Wikipedia generally does not accept articles that only exist to promote subjects that don't seem to pass the general notability guideline. The GNG, as we call it (one other thing you'll find is that we love acronyms and abbreviations), is the basic guideline for determining whether or not an article's topic is something we should include here. The essence of it is that in order for a topic to pass the requirements, it must receive significant coverage from multiple reliable secondary sources. What the means in practice is that, for something like your school, you would probably need to find newspaper articles covering the school's opening, or major events at the school, stuff like that.

One final option is to try submitting your article at articles for creation, which a place where most experienced editors can review your ideas and decide if they will pass the GNG requirements before creating the article in the first place. The only issue with that is there tends to be a long waiting list to get submissions reviewed. On a related note, you can also work on the article in your own user namespace, as they call it. That would involve creating the article at User:Andreea Teia/Young & Talented School of Stage & Screen and working it up to a good state before moving it to the article namespace.

Sorry for the extremely long message, but I hope this is at least starting to answer your questions. Please let me know if you have any more questions. You can reply here, as I will watch this page. Cheers. —Torchiest ^talk_edits 13:09, 3 October 2012 (UTC)

Hello! Thank you for the useful tips. I did a better reseach to strength my article. I was wondering if it is possible for you to see my sandbox. I would like to write there the article modified (with reliable sourses and more sintetic) and would like you to take a look to see if it is better in the new format. Thank you so much for the support. I know that Editing Wiki is straightforward, the only thing that is intimidating me is the quantity of material to read as Info :D. And I am really glad that the Volunteers are doing such a great job helping people like me, willing to write but less practical with the navigation on the Wiki pages (sometimes I get lost in such amount of Info). Thank you again!!!! Andreea Teia (talk) 14:02, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

I moved your signature to the bottom of your comment. I hope you don't mind. Make sure you put the ~~~~ at the end of your messages instead of the beginning. As for the article, yes, I can see your sandbox, so I'll take a look as see how it's going. And honestly, editing Wikipedia can be fairly complicated, so don't feel bad if it's confusing at first. It took me a while to get the hang of it, and after years I'm still finding plenty of new information. —Torchiest ^talk_edits 15:08, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

Okay, I took a look and made some changes to the first two paragraphs. The main thing you'll need to watch out for is too much promotional language. Anything that looks like an advertisement will get into trouble with other editors. The other thing I see that needs to be fixed is the external links section. You can go to this page for a detailed explanation of what external links are supposed to be, but a very short version is that they are generally just links to an official homepage of the article's subject, and maybe a couple other very closely related pages. I think most of what you have in that section are links that you would want to use as references inside the article itself. You've got them partially working, but they need some help. I will make an edit changing one and you can see what the looks like. —Torchiest ^talk_edits 15:14, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

Hello Torchiest! I read the talk on your page and I am going to write here the full content of the articles that I have on the References:

"Let's hear it from the girls, by Claire Rudd, East End Life, 19-25 June, 2006, page 23: Tower Hamlets teens will be showing each other some respect this week, thanks to a new play that looks at gang culture. R.E.S.P.E.C.T. 06 is a musical about young girls from two care homes who bump into each other at the Respect Festival in Victoria Park, and their battle to come out on top. The show was created by Young and Talented, a young person's theatre school based at OH! Art, in Bethnal Green, which helps young people's personal development through performing arts. Writer and director Suzann McLean Robinson told East End Life: "I wrote the story from the group's ideas. There's a lot in the press about girl gangs, bullying and violence. The group wanted a chance to explore this subject for themselves through performing arts". In the show, Rose-Marie Christian plays the role of Bukola, the leader of the St. Anne's gang. She said: "A lot of time it's just about proving who ends up on top. No one means for anything bad to happen. It's just about sving your reputation." The group has been rehearsing since January and now looking forward to pefroming their work, which they are all very proud of. Samantha White, who goes to Central Foundation School for Girls, plays the other gang leader Leticia. She said: "The story is excellent, it's true to life and is touching at the end. But there's lso this comedy in it too, which I can't tell you about - you'll just have to see it." Thirty-five youngsters between the age of five and 17 will perform in the show. "We have only been going a year" Suzann added, "and already the group is putting on some fantastic shows to packed audiences. Some of the songs have been written by individuals especially for this show. That tells me how committed they are to having a voice and to being heard." R.E.S.P.E.C.T. 06 is on June 24 at 7pm at Oh! Art, Oxford House, Derbyshire Street, Bethnal Green. Tickets are available in advance by calling 89812895."

"Young, gifted and dancing, by Claire Rudd, East End Life, 25 April-1 May 2005, Page 23: A NEW dance and drama course is starting in Bethnal Green from May 7. Young & Talented is run by Suzann Robinson and Susan Reynolds who both have extensive performing arts experience. Suzann is a professional actress who has worked for the Royal National Theatre and the Royal Shakespeare Company. Susan has extensive background in dance and has toured with Boyzone and performed with Beyoncè and Sean Paul. A high impact urban musical will be produced at the end of the term as part of the course. Term dates are May 7 to June 30, at oh! art, Oxford House, Derbyshire Street. For more information call 89812895."

"Young and Talented - Education, Parents Time, Edition 1, page 3, January 2010: Actress/Director Suzann McLean saw a void in the quality of arts education available to children and set up Young & Talented performing arts school. Young & Talented is for youngsters aged between the ages of 6 and 16. Here they develop their talent training with professional singers, dancers and actors. "But it's not just about performing" says founder Suzann, "crucial life skills are learnt here that promote self belief, confidence, cultural diversity and by having a goal to work towards they develop teamwork and leadership skills to foster esprit de corp." Suzann is an established actress and director who trained at the prestigious Italia Conti drama school. Suzann's credits include Shakespeare plays at the National Theatre, starred in Dr. Who and the Bafta nominated comedy show Little Miss Jocelyn as well as directing 3 shows at the Hackney Empire. Young & Talented is finding its niche in the market of leading performing arts schools, "I wanted to offer professional opportunity to a wider community", says Suzann. Young & Talented schools based in greater London areas where you will find a broad demographic of the population living and working together. "Talent is not related to how much money a person has", continues Suzann, "however the opportunities to develop talent are often subject to your affordability as the really good schools tend to cater to people from a certain socio-economic background". Young & Talented has recently opend a new Branch in West Norwood where there is a distinct mix of British, Black British, Caribbean, African and Portuguese. The founding school is based in the heart of London's East End in Bethnal Green which embraces the Bangladeshi and Somalian community. There is a growing understanding in the benefits of performing arts training, "Many parents have told us that school teachers remarked that Young & Talented has had a positive effect on their child, developing well rounded young citizens who understand what it takes to succeed in both the arts and in life". They master all 3 disciplins when asked why Suzann replied "My professional experience has taught me importance of singing, dancing and acting. Singers need to tell the story of the song and move with expression, Dancers need to portray deelings in their movement and present a story and Actors need to move fluently and use a wide vocal range. More than that, the benefits extend to any future job - The doctor must read body language, the lawyer must speak to specific audiences, the footballer must have an adept appreciation for space and movement." The training at Young & Talented can also prepare students who wish to embrak on a professional career in the field of television, film and theatre. They achieve this by nurturing a wide selection of bright, energetic and talented children each having their own unique, confident and distinctive personality. "We work hard to make sure that they don't lose their natural qualities so that they can portray the real lives of young people today." As discussed on colourful radio Young & Talented students are taking the profession by storm, recent successes include Korie (10) in the acclaimed TV drama Law & Order. Reece (7) in two commercials currently on our screens for McDonald's and the Co-op. Mohammadur and Jordan performing live at the Whitechapel Gallery event in East London. "Our doors are always open" concludes international director Suzann, "We have made Young & Talented somewhere that is all embracing, affordable and professional." More information on Young & Talented can be found at www.youngandtalented.co.uk or by calling 02085565348."

"Olympic Torch Relay, Waltham Forest News, Issue 71, 30 July 2012, page 4- 5: More than 80,000 residents turned out to welcome the Olympic Torch to Waltham Forest. Heralding the arrival of the Olympic Games, Waltham Forest residents filled the borough's streets and attended special celebratory events as they welcomed the arrival of the Olympic Torch on Saturday 21 July. Waltham Forest's Torchbearers: Jay Acharya, Dr. Rashid Akhtar, Riah Biscette, Christine Bower, Edmond Chan, Frank Charles, Steven Cheung, Teresa Deacon, Jane Farrier, Tracey Goddard, Adam Hall, Erim Hassan, Shah Husain, Suzann McLean Robinson, Mo Morris, Osaro Otobo, Jamaal Otto, Kyra Sandy, Amar Sharif, Antoni Spooner, Roy Stratton, Georgia Tuckfield, Brad Wilson."

These are the articles in full. Hope it will streghten my article. Thank you very much of taking care of the article. Andreea Teia (talk) 12:01, 26 November 2012 (UTC)

Notability claim for "Young and Talented School of Stage and Screen"

Hi Andreea,

I see you've done a lot of work over the years on Young and Talented School of Stage and Screen, I assume that you are personally involved in the school itself.

As I mentioned on the articles talk-page two years ago, the article read like an advertisement. Phrases like "Children and young people at Young and Talented who want to go that extra mile..." and "Roy is experienced in working with children and young people" very clearly show that this article is written by someone who is associated with the subject, and trying to use WP for marketing purposes. More importantly, it still doesn't make any claim to the Notability of the subject. I've just returned to the article, two years later, and these problems still exists. None of the footnotes, nor any of the sentences in the article itself, make any claim as to why this school deserves a Wikipedia article. (At this point it's probably relevant to point out that "the fact the school exists does not, in itself, mean it is "notable" for wikipedia's purposes.

So... I've given it two years, I'll give it a couple more weeks. Please go through and scrub the article for self-promoting phrases, and please make a notability claim that is backed up with reliable sources (e.g. "...is considered the best/oldest/most-significant school of its type in the country", or "is cited by three of it's BAFTA-award-winning graduates as crucial to their getting a 'break' in the industry" etc. etc. ). Without these things, it's an advertisement. A lovingly written advertisement, but an ad nonetheless.... Please advise me when you've been able to make these necessary changes, otherwise I will have to nominate it for deletion. I realise that I probably sound harsh/angry - please be assured that I'm not and have no ill-will towards your school, but I think that 2 years is a pretty long time to have those "this article has multiple issues" tag at the top... Wittylama 14:17, 27 February 2015 (UTC)

Hi Wittylama,

Thank you so much for getting in touch with me. Over the years I tried to make the article more rich in references and add reliable sources to streghen it.

After reading you last message I made changes to the page in order to comply with the Wiki rules. Please would you like to have a look at these changes and let me know if it is good the way I did it. And please flag up if there are mistakes and please guide me on how to improve them.

I do not want at all for this page to be an advert!! So I am waiting for your precious advice to make the necessary changes to be in line with Wiki rules.

Thank you and I am looking forward to hearing from you!

Warmest regards,

Andreea.

Hi @Andreea Teia:, Thanks for getting back to me. I can see you've gone to great efforts to improve this article - not just recently but over the years. One of the biggest complaints/frustrations that people have when first entering the 'wikiverse' is that they often feel that their first efforts are summarily dismissed and that they feel so underappreciated that they never return. I sincerely hope you don't feel this way even though I am critiquing your good-faith work!

I still feel that this article suffers from the same problem that it always had, right from the start - that it does not explain why the subject is notable enough to have a Wikipedia entry. I've previously mentioned the policy we have that "merely existing" doesn't mean something should get a WP article - and I'm still struggling to see how this particular school "deserves" a WP article and not the (presumably) many hundreds of other children's acting programs that exist around the country. Your article explains (and comprehensively footnotes) that the school's existence, but nothing that makes it remarkable. The closest thing is one small-business award. I draw your attention to this template which you can expand each section:

As you can see, Wikipedia has articles about many drama/acting schools in the UK already. I've not analysed them all personally, but I'm fairly confident that each one has a "claim to fame" that is obvious - generally it is the extensive list of "notable alumni" (generally people with their own pre-existing WP biographies) and/or the school offers formal accreditation through the UK tertiary education system.

Do you think you can address this specific concern, please?

As a side note, I don't know who you are personally, but there is a high likelihood of your being professionally involved in the organisation about which you're writing. In which case, I would like to point you to this policy page Wikipedia:FAQ/Organizations which describes the best-practices for people who are writing about their own organisation. Like I said, I don't know that this applies to you, but there is a reasonable probability, and it's important for everyone to disclose their professional affiliations lest they appear to be using WP for advertising.

All the best, Wittylama 16:22, 10 March 2015 (UTC). (I'll just mention @Torchiest: here too since they're involved in the article's development and may wish to stay abreast of this conversation)

With respect, I have to take issue with your statement that the article must explain why the subject is notable. WP:GNG does not mention that. Instead, it says an article is presumed notable if it "has received significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject". The idea is that the coverage itself is what makes a subject notable. I think you might be conflating the issue with the valid complaint about articles that only have sources showing they exist, such as things like directory listings, without any actual details about the subject. This article has sources focused solely and specifically on it that go into some detail. —Torchiest ^talk_edits 16:35, 10 March 2015 (UTC)

Hi again @Torchiest: and @Andreea Teia:. You're right Torchiest that the notability guideline doesn't say that you have to prove "why" the subject is notable. But given that so many of the sources that are being used to justify the notability here are so very "tenuous" (for wont of a better word), the article remains very thinly justified IMHO. I've made an analysis of the first 25 footnotes used and placed it on the talkpage of the article here: Talk:Young and Talented School of Stage and Screen. (I thought it sensible to return this conversation to the article's own talkpage rather than here :-) Wittylama 16:00, 16 March 2015 (UTC)

Hi Wittylama and Torchiest,

Thank you both for your comments and tips. I am working on the page to improve using your sugestions! If you have further comments please do let me know!!! Once again, thank you for your work and effort!! All the best, Andreea.