User talk:FormalDude/Archive/6

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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RE: Draft:Rolf Engen

Hi User: FormalDude - first, thank you for working on this - I am relatively new to Wikipedia, and I just wanted to connect to determine to which areas you're specifically referring re: copyrighted content issues. I've been working on this one article for several months, and prior versions were denied on account of tone questions, but this is the first instance in which copyrighted material arose. But I am more than happy simply to remove it to move the ball forward. To which sections are you referring, that I may remove them? Thank you again. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Christopheraweed (talk • contribs) 07:05, 25 September 2021 (UTC)

See https://copyvios.toolforge.org/?lang=en&project=wikipedia&title=Draft%3ARolf_Engen&oldid=&action=search&use_engine=1&use_links=1 ––FormalDude talk 07:14, 25 September 2021 (UTC)

Help with tables

Hello!! Thank you for replying to my message on Oshwah's page! On the Dogfish Head Brewery Page, there are a couple of new year round selections that came out recently, and I've never added sections to a table/layout before, as I'm still learning how to edit certain formats. I have references to support the additions, just want to make sure I do it correctly. I greatly appreciate you offering to help, and thank you so much for the page on editing my home page, I appreciate it! On a side note, Oshwah has been inactive for a while, I hope he's ok! Spf121188 (talk) 21:13, 27 September 2021 (UTC)

@Spf121188: No problem, it's pretty easy once you know what to look for. This is an example of a row from the table:

|-

| Burton Baton || <span style="display:none">00</span> Nov 2004 || Year Round || English [[Old Ale]] mixed with the 90 Minute [[India Pale Ale|IPA]] || 10.0 || 70

|-

The first line and the last line identify the start and end of the row. The middle line defines the row parameters. All you have to do to add a new row to the table is copy the following three lines of code, replacing the *parameters* in the middle line with your own:

|-

| *NAME* || <span style="display:none">00</span> *DATE (Mon YYYY)* || *Availability* || *Description* || *ABV* || *IBU*

|-

Paste it where ever you want the row to appear on the table. If you need additional help, let me know. If you'd like I can always add a row for you if you give me the information, so that you have an example edit to go off of.

P.S. I hope Oshwah is okay as well; I think they are just taking a well-deserved break. ––FormalDude talk 21:32, 27 September 2021 (UTC)

Hello again! Thank you so much for the help! I was able to add a row to the table, and it looks like it worked out, but can I get you to check it out for me to make sure it looks ok and is cited correctly? Again, I really appreciate your help! Spf121188 (talk) 21:59, 27 September 2021 (UTC)

Good job, @Spf121188, looks great! ––FormalDude talk 23:47, 27 September 2021 (UTC)

Thank you again! If it’s okay I’ll reach back out if I need help with anything. I appreciate it! Spf121188 (talk) 00:36, 28 September 2021 (UTC)

Of course, anytime! ––FormalDude talk 00:38, 28 September 2021 (UTC))

Untitled comment

How to add a source? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Studio52group (talk • contribs) 07:38, 29 September 2021 (UTC)

Hi @Studio52group! You should check out referencing for beginners. What are the sources that you want to add? ––FormalDude talk 07:42, 29 September 2021 (UTC)

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Copyvio in Draft:Rolf Engen

Hello. I noticed you declined the submission of Draft:Rolf Engen due to a copyright violation. Earwig's report does not detect a copyvio in the draft. Most all of the detection is from direct quotes. Is there another detector you used to find a copyvio? Thanks. — Pbrks (talk) 21:02, 29 September 2021 (UTC)

@Pbrks: My mistake, I've reverted my decline. ––FormalDude talk 21:29, 29 September 2021 (UTC)

(talk page watcher) FormalDude, I don't think you were wrong at all – there was excessive taking from a large number of sources. Some has been removed, but I've (re-)declined the submission as a copyvio. I was right on the edge of blanking it and listing at WP:CP, and am still not sure that that wouldn't be the best option. Pbrks, "most all" isn't really good enough for us. Regards, Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 11:57, 30 September 2021 (UTC)

Thanks @Justlettersandnumbers, appreciate it. ––FormalDude talk 04:00, 1 October 2021 (UTC)

Red Bull

Hello again! I was wondering if you might have a moment to revisit the recent requests at Talk:Red Bull at your convenience. I am struggling to get feedback even though I'd like to think the proposed changes are clear improvements. I see an unregistered editor partially implemented this request (I assume coincidentally), but the edit request has still not been fully reviewed. Thanks for your consideration! Inkian Jason (talk) 14:45, 13 October 2021 (UTC)

@Inkian Jason: I've responded. ––FormalDude talk 02:39, 14 October 2021 (UTC)

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Orphaned non-free image File:Webull Logopng.png

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Tamarack Developments Corporation

why do big company get treated differently ? my post is the same as this one https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tamarack_Developments_Corporation — Preceding unsigned comment added by Abcops (talk • contribs) 16:38, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

Hi Abcops, big companies do not get treated differently here, I believe (correct me if I'm wrong here) you are referring to the WP:AFD nomination of Tamarack Developments Corporation and the rejection of the draft at User:Abcops/sandbox

Please, before you write/edit an article, if you do have a conflict of interest with the article you are trying to improve, make sure to disclose them by following instructions at Wikipedia:Conflict of interest.

Both subjects mentioned above is rejected/afded due to them not meeting the notability requirements on Wikipedia, basically, most articles follow the general notability guidelines (a subject must have at least two reliable sources providing significant coverage), some are under subject specific guidelines that you can read about here. Justiyaya 15:34, 7 October 2021 (UTC)

Kolping Society

So now I'm confused. Your notice was not especially helpful as it did not indicate where the particular difficulty lies. As there seemed to be both an edit conflict and a problem of which I was unaware I went ahead and saved the draft without the changes, which are now lost out in the cosmos. But now your message is reverted some six minutes later, and maybe there wasn't a problem, after all? What's going on? Manannan67 (talk) 04:25, 21 October 2021 (UTC)

@Manannan67: The decline for a copyright violation was my mistake. It came to my attention afterwards the material was public domain. Sorry for any inconvenience I caused. ––FormalDude talk 04:27, 21 October 2021 (UTC)

As PD was indicated in two separate templates, it seems a bit fast on the draw. Manannan67 (talk) 04:33, 21 October 2021 (UTC)

@Manannan67: You're 100% right. I deserve this:

Whack! You've been whacked with a wet trout. Don't take this too seriously. Someone just wants to let you know that you did something silly.

––FormalDude talk 04:44, 21 October 2021 (UTC)

Not a problem, Have a good night. Manannan67 (talk) 04:48, 21 October 2021 (UTC)

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Manson close

I am challenging your close of Talk:Marilyn_Manson#RfC_(allegations_in_lead) ([1]), per WP:CLOSECHALLENGE. Firstly, you say "The supporters' argument that impacts to Manson's career have already been significant is clearly evidenced and stronger than the opposing argument. Recentism and the fact that the allegations are unconfirmed were also both dissenting arguments, but those are not strong enough reasons to not include this reliably sourced significant content in the lead." You say one side of inclusion's arguments are stronger than exclusion without actually explaining why as both sides are equally policy based. Secondly you say the explict consensus was 'along the lines of' ""In 2021, multiple women accused Manson of psychologically and sexually abusing them." when only person who voted yes explictly supported that wording. Hardly any specific wording was discussed in the RfC, so saying that is really out of the blue. And the 'along the lines of' in this essentially means the consensus version [2] considering this first revert. Please revert and let someone else close or reclose this as no consensus. Regards  Spy-cicle💥  ^Talk? 01:26, 22 September 2021 (UTC)

To your first issue: They are policy based arguments, but the discussion deemed them not persuasive enough. For recentism, it is not enough because of the significance of the impacts that the event had on Manson. For the allegations being unconfirmed, that doesn't matter, what matters is if they presented in reliable sources, which they are. It was rebutted in the discussion because the mere fact that the allegations are unconfirmed is not enough to omit such an occurrence from the lead section of Manson's article.

To your second issue: This is a fair point, there was some digression about the specific wording. But there was still a consensus to mention the allegations of sexual abuse against Manson in one sentence in the lead. I have adjusted the wording of my closure accordingly. ––FormalDude talk 01:44, 22 September 2021 (UTC)

"but the discussion deemed them not persuasive enough" That just seems like your POV. You have not actually explained why. "For recentism, it is not enough because of the significance of the impacts that the event had on Manson" I argued this point already it has affected him for what about 9-12 months to a year therefore it is impossible to tell how long it will last. At this point, you have opened an ANI case about the article [3], proposed different wording yourself on the talk page, and started adjusting abuse parts on the article itself making you WP:INVOLVED. So I now formally request you unclose the RfC and lot an uninvolved editor do it.  Spy-cicle💥  ^Talk? 14:22, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

@Spy-cicle: Request formally denied as I was completely uninvolved at the time of the close and have only made minor edits to the article since. Closing an RfC does not bar me from participating in an article. ––FormalDude talk 15:39, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

And it's not just my POV, it's the way the discussion went in reality. Numerous editors brought up how recentism is not applicable because the events have already had lasting impacts that are notable enough to warrant mention in the lead section. ––FormalDude talk 15:54, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

I would also like to take this opportunity to challenge your close here. Per the template at Closure Requests, I would like to discuss your closure of Talk:Marilyn_Manson#RfC_(allegations_in_lead), which I found perplexing. I do not disagree that the allegations should be included in the lead, but wholeheartedly disagree with your interpretation of the discussion, and how it was immediately interpreted by Sdbk to continue edit warring the article. There was no consensus that I can see which supported Sdbk's misinterpretation of MANDY--an essay that flies in the face of genuine Wikipedia policies like WP:BALANCE and WP:NPOV. Your closing statement that "Updates to the sentence should come from a talk page discussion." is in effect a furtherance of that misinterpretation, considering that editor's behavior. I would appreciate your feedback on these specific issues before I take this further. Thanks. Homeostasis07 (talk/contributions) 01:46, 22 September 2021 (UTC)

@Homeostasis07: I updated my consensus slightly, I believe it addresses your concerns. I also reverted Sdbk's edit. Please let me know if you have any other questions. ––FormalDude talk 01:59, 22 September 2021 (UTC)

Thank you. What, in your opinion, is the appropriate venue for having an essay removed from Wikipedia? I've never before in my 15 years on this site felt the need to nominate an essay for deletion, but genuinely do now and have no idea where to begin. Since this particular essay actively misinterprets policies in order to come to a conclusion that is in direct opposition to several of the WP:5PILLARS, I feel I have no choice but to... lest this be introduced by other users in future discussions or RfCs. I believe this would be of huge benefit to the community in general. Homeostasis07 (talk/contributions) 02:08, 22 September 2021 (UTC)

@Homeostasis07: Appropriate venue would be Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion. Although I might suggest talking about it at the essay's talk page first. Right now I personally don't share your belief that the essay needs to be deleted, but I guess I could be convinced if the reasoning was laid out well enough. ––FormalDude talk 02:17, 22 September 2021 (UTC)

Etymology and nicknames, Aibonito, Puerto Rico

Hello, the original information on Name in Aibonito, Puerto Rico did have no citations to begin with. All I did was reorganize everything that was already there and provide a background to that spurious information. Everything written there comes from word of mouth. Written information on the topic is non-existent to extremely limited at best. Most of the information related to the Taino language in Wikipedia is completely erroneous to begin with so I'd rather have a section where I can discuss all possibilities as such rather than incorrect fact as it was before I updated it. My research on the topic is unpublished as of right now (10/06/21) and no information has been published before mine. As I said, I would rather have all the possible options written on this article for the purpose of future improvement with citations rather than the mediocrity that you reverted the update to. This is Puerto Rico where information is limted not California for example where the Internet is full of resources waiting to be cited in Wikipedia. My goal is to provide more options to inspire and motivate others to improve Puerto Rican articles rather than leaving everything in obscurity. Thank you. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ligocsicnarf89 (talk • contribs) 05:45, 7 October 2021 (UTC)

@Ligocsicnarf89 Thank you for trying to improve coverage on subjects that lack coverage on Wikipedia. Unfortunately Wikipedia has a policy on not allowing original research, all information in articles here needs to be verifiable. If you think information is wrong on Wikipedia, check if the source supports the information, if there is no source supporting it, feel free to remove it, but if there is a source, you can:

1. Find other reliable sources that contradict the original one and attempt to correct it
2. Ask for a correction in the citation's (source's) website.
3. Leave it alone, because:
   1. You might be wrong, research done by reliable sources are generally correct
   2. Other Wikipedians will most likely revert it

Remember to look offline for sources too, sometimes you can find some really valuable sources offline too.

If you have any problems with editing or research feel free to ask, thanks for contributing to the wiki :D Justiyaya 16:08, 7 October 2021 (UTC)

A bahnstar for you!

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Why was Yiannis Laouris page deleted

Hi FormalDude

I happen to be the person portrayed in the above page, which was created by American students and faculty almost 20 years ago when they met me as key figure in citizens' driven peace reconciliation and conflict resolution initiatives in Cyprus (between Greek and Turkish Cypriots) and in the Middle East (between Israelis and Palestinians).

I myself know almost nothing of how wikipedia works and I have created an account in order to find out why an almost 20 year old page can suddenly be deleted. After its original creation, I noticed many times in its history that lots of people kept adding or editing or changing things; sometimes in ways that I personally did not approve, including their choice of my picture (taken by a student during an event).

I would appreciate your advice and/or intervention for the restoration of the above page. I could provide you myself with any 3rd party references to add to that page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Yiannislaouris (talk • contribs) 18:06, 24 September 2021 (UTC)

Hi Yiannislaouris, essentially, the article was deleted for not not meeting the inclusion policy (WP:GNG) for Wikipedia, which is having atleast 2 reliable, independent sources that provides significant coverage on the subject, the deletion method used is WP:AFD and the relevant deletion discussion is located on Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Yiannis Laouris.

If you think there are sources that would justify notability for the subject, post links here and we'll review them and give our opinion on if they would satisfy WP:GNG

Do not attempt to recreate the page or engage in editing in areas which you have a conflict of interest, that would most likely result in the page being deleted again or the edit being reverted. Justiyaya 18:45, 24 September 2021 (UTC) (talk page watcher)

 Courtesy link: Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Yiannis_Laouris ––FormalDude talk 20:18, 24 September 2021 (UTC)

Hi FormalDude, I appreciate that you have responded to my message. For me to be able to provide with links of sources that would hopefully justify notability for the subject, I would need to be able to "view" what was written in the deleted article. Is there a way to get a copy of that article?— Preceding unsigned comment added by Yiannislaouris (talk • contribs)

@Yiannislaouris Requested refund at Wikipedia:Requests for undeletion#Yiannis Laouris (permalink), might take a while Justiyaya 05:20, 26 September 2021 (UTC)

Hi FormalDude, a page that I referred to from several others has disappeared. I found this discussion here and understood that the article was deleted because it did not have at least two verifiable sources. I, therefore, decided to engage here and provide some, but if you want me, I can do more research:

1. ONLIFE Manifesto

---

This scientist was one of 12 scientists/philosophers chosen by the European Commission (Digital Task Force)to author a Manifesto with guidelines on how to remain human in the digital era. Four or five of them have subsequently presented it in the European Parliament: https://digital-strategy.ec.europa.eu/en/events/being-human-hyperconnected-era https://epthinktank.eu/2014/12/08/what-makes-us-human-in-a-hyper-connected-era/ has a section of each presenter. Event is available as video at European parliament site https://multimedia.europarl.europa.eu/en/science-and-technology-options-assessment_20141202-1700-SPECIAL-UNKN_vd His talk starts on min 18:31:30 Book is open access by Springer https://link.springer.com/book/10.1007/978-3-319-04093-6

2. This individual is a key figure in the Cyprus Peace Process

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His name appears in at least 4-5 key initiatives such as: 2.1 Technology for Peace https://web.archive.org/web/20131017084742/http://www.tech4peace.org/nqcontent234c.html?a_id=1 https://web.archive.org/web/20110724203325/http://mirror.undp.org/cyprus/projects/project_details.asp?ProjectID=105 The UN document in the second one the organization Cyprus Neuroscience and Technology Institute, where this individual was the president of the Board at the time. 2.2 Youth Promoting Peace https://www.futureworlds.eu/wiki/Youth_Promoting_Peace 2.3 Also published many scientific articles (>10) about the conflict and attempts for reconciliation and a book: https://www.amazon.com/Masks-Demons-Discovering-Breaking-Stereotypes/dp/1461083206/ref=tmm_pap_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=1305577052&sr=1-2 His name appears in many authors' books/journals, eg RECONCILIATION AND PEACEEDUCATION IN CYPRUS: WHAT WILL IT TAKE? Laurie Johnson https://cyprusreview.org/index.php/cr/article/view/280/243

2.4 First Bicommunal Radio https://www.coe.int/t/dg4/cultureheritage/mars/source/resources/references/others/11%20-%20Media%20Working%20Together%20-%20CCMC%202012.pdf COE: is Council of Europe Originally supported by Washington DC-based organization: https://hasna.org/tuning-in-to-peace-bilingual-radio-program-in-cyprus-initiated-by-hasna-wins-award/

3. PhD simultaneously with first degree; rare distinction in Germany

---

This person was the first foreign student (in 45 years) to receive PhD in parallel to graduation; also scored: suma cum laude I recall several newspaper links in the deleted article, which were probably in Greek and maybe not linked to newspapers archives, but other archives, so I found one in Germany https://www.nd-archiv.de/artikel/1044065.am-ende-des-studiums-bereits-promoviert.html?sstr=ende%7Cdes%7Cstudiums%7Cbereits%7Cpromoviert Cypriot newspapers covered this widely at the time (1985!) If this helps, I could do more research in Cypriot sources, etc (since I speak Greek) to discover more reliable sources.Futuristas (talk) 08:54, 3 October 2021 (UTC)

Hi FormalDude, do we have any developments regarding this page? Yiannislaouris (talk) 21:16, 18 October 2021 (UTC)

@Yiannislaouris: The subject needs to meet WP:NACADEMIC. Can you or Futuristas review that criteria and explain if and how he meets any of those criteria please, citing reliable sources? ––FormalDude talk 21:49, 18 October 2021 (UTC)

Hi FormalDude, your fast response is appreciated! At the top of this discussion, you noted "essentially, the article was deleted for not meeting the inclusion policy (WP:GNG) for Wikipedia, which is having at least 2 reliable, independent sources". Is it fair to assume that the sources provided by Futuristas satisfy that criterion, but the article still needs to also meet WP:NACADEMIC criteria? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Yiannislaouris (talk • contribs) 22:25, 18 October 2021 (UTC)

@Yiannislaouris: That was said by another editor, Justiyaya, who is also correct. The article must meet General Notability Guidelines as well as the subject-specific notability criteria. ––FormalDude talk 01:54, 19 October 2021 (UTC)

Hi FormalDude, in our last commuication you said "Can you or Futuristas review that criteria and explain if and how he meets any of those criteria please, citing reliable sources?" I also understand that you have requested that the page is moved to my sadbox or Wikipedia:Requests for undeletion#Yiannis Laouris (permalink), and that this might take a while @Justiyaya: but this did not happen yet. I would greatly appreciate to be given the opportunity to add reliable refereneces that meet the criteria mentioned above; which I cannot do without having access. I would also grealy appreciate yours and hopefully @Justiyaya: reviews/suggestions of any edits I will make.

Hi FormalDude, you have not responded to my previous message so I am writing again. I have reviewed once more the deletion process and as you have noted previously, it was a rather short and superficial process. Also, those who have contributed to the discussion have considered notability assuming that Laouris was an academic. One said, "his citation metrics are way too low to meet NPROF". I have followed Laouris and contributed to his page because he represents a unique case of an academic who left the security of a university to work in the real world. This alone makes him notable! If you google him, you will discover that he has been an "attractor" for change-makers. More than 100 young people have conducted unpaid internships with him. This individual has implemented over 100 social-change projects all funded through competitive grants. Very few academics get 100 grants! Regarding notability, the fact that he was chosen by the European Commission as one of 12 to draft the Manifesto for our ONLIFE world should have been sufficient. In your previous communication, you asked for at least two notable achievements. The live page had links to more than two relevant and reliable secondary sources on this and other achievements. In my opinion, the vision of Wikipedia is not served by the speedy deletion of pages that have been live for 2 decades and have been visited by a few thousand people, without careful research. I would kindly ask you to review the arguments I provided in the previous communication (3 October 2021) and take the necessary steps to revert the decision. Also, in our last communication, you asked "Can you or Futuristas review that criteria and explain if and how he meets any of those criteria please, citing reliable sources?" I was expecting for the page, as per your request, to be moved to my sandbox or Wikipedia:Requests for undeletion#Yiannis Laouris (permalink), so that I can add additional sources to establish notability. Is there any particular reason that the person responsible for moving the page to a sandbox has not done it yet?Futuristas (talk) 16:17, 7 March 2022 (UTC)

@Futuristas: The undeletion request was denied: Wikipedia:Requests_for_undeletion/Archive_367#Yiannis_Laouris. ––FormalDude talk 01:23, 8 March 2022 (UTC)

Peter Levine

I removed the BLPPROD tag, but I'd have no objection to AfD-ing the article, probably should be merged into Somatic experiencing. BubbaJoe123456 (talk) 18:56, 12 October 2021 (UTC)

@BubbaJoe123456: Sorry for my very delayed response. I agree with you, and have proposed a merger. ––FormalDude talk 08:59, 25 October 2021 (UTC)

Edit Request

Hello Sir, I raised an edit request on Talk:KSI yesterday. If you have time, would you mind checking it ? Thank you. —2402:E280:2316:74:99C1:527E:AC1:4CA1 (talk) 12:30, 17 October 2021 (UTC)

I've reviewed your edit request. ––FormalDude talk 19:22, 17 October 2021 (UTC)>

Quick question

Hello again! I wanted to see if I could get your help with something. I made a new addition to the Dogfish Head Brewery page, and the citation I added reads as a url when you hover over it. A Citationbot cleaned up a source of mine when I made a change to the table before, but I didn't want to do that without having used it before, just to clean up that up. Perhaps it isn't a big deal or even that important, I just want to be thorough and make sure I'm doing everything correctly. Thank you again, I appreciate your help! Spf121188 (talk) 14:22, 19 October 2021 (UTC)

Actually, I was able to figure it out :) but, I do have one weird question... I'm trying to construct my userpage, and I'd like to actually include a userbox that states "This user is a fan of Dogfish Head Brewery. I know that's a strange box to add, but in case anyone would have ever have a question about the place, since I've made edits on the page I just want it to be known. I appreciate your help! Thanks!Spf121188 (talk) 18:36, 19 October 2021 (UTC)

@Spf121188: I created a userbox for you at User:Spf121188/userbox/dogfish. To add it to your userpage, just copy and paste the code {{User:Spf121188/userbox/dogfish}}. If you have any changes you'd like made to the userbox, feel free to let me know. ––FormalDude talk 21:14, 19 October 2021 (UTC)

I love it, I can't thank you enough! I appreciate your help! Spf121188 (talk) 22:08, 19 October 2021 (UTC)

No problem! ––FormalDude talk 04:34, 20 October 2021 (UTC)

Hello again! I'm so sorry to keep bothering you... On my userpage, in my first userbox, I wanted to change the colors from what they are now, to a dark blue and gold, as those are my colleges school colors. Is this something you can help with by chance? You can see the colors in the Shepherd Rams page. Thank you again! Spf121188 (talk) 19:02, 27 October 2021 (UTC)

No problem @Spf121188:, I'm happy to help anytime. I've updated your userbox for you. You may want to take a look at Template:userbox to see how you can change and design userboxes yourself, it's not too difficult! ––FormalDude talk 19:48, 27 October 2021 (UTC)

It looks perfect, thank you!! I'll take a look at that page and if I have any questions I'll let you know. I really appreciate it! Spf121188 (talk) 19:49, 27 October 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for move

Thanks for move now can you publish that page UserABCXYZ (talk) 05:21, 20 October 2021 (UTC)

@UserABCXYZ: I'll let someone else approve the draft. ––FormalDude talk 05:24, 20 October 2021 (UTC)

Mike Hall (musician) draft deletion reversal

• Hey there! I just want to thank you so much for the help you gave me in the live chat - as you said, if its not restored by tomorrow, I'll make a post proper in deletion review. ---- — Preceding unsigned comment added by Thefarcry (talk • contribs) 07:23, 24 October 2021 (UTC)

• Hey @Formaldude:! I want to sincerely thank you for cleaning up the draft, I just have a couple of questions:

1) The subject's date of birth needing a non primary source - from what is listed on https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Identifying_and_using_primary_sources#Primary_sources_should_be_used_carefully, a primary source can be used about a person if it is attributed to a non-contested claim. Since the subject's own website states the October 23rd, 1989 date of birth, would that be considered a non-contested claim?

2) The subjects Discography section - would an external link that cites the releases (like the subject's Spotify, website, etc) be sufficient for supporting that information, or would the information have to strictly come from reliable publications which are second hand sourced? If it's the latter, I would probably opt to just delete that section entirely for the draft since I can't recall any of the included sources mentioning release dates off the top of my head. Thefarcry (talk) 03:10, 25 October 2021 (UTC)

• @Thefarcry: After looking into it more, a primary source is actually acceptable per WP:ABOUTSELF. I've removed the non-primary sourced needed tag. An external link that cites the releases, such as a Spotify or Tidal (service), is certainly acceptable. ––FormalDude talk 05:06, 25 October 2021 (UTC)

• Hey @Formaldude:, I just made a variety of edits to the draft that I believe address your suggested changes, and ward against future potential editor/admin interpretations of "unambiguous advertising and promotion". Also, whenever you're free, I would truly appreciate your thoughts on the current state of the draft + perception of the subject's notability via criterion 1 & 7 with the currently listed sources.

Once again, thank you so much for all of your help thus far! Thefarcry (talk) 09:45, 25 October 2021 (UTC)

• @Thefarcry: I assume you're referring to criteria #1 and #7 of WP:MUSICBIO? If so, I agree that it currently meets those criteria. ––FormalDude talk 03:22, 26 October 2021 (UTC)

• @Formaldude: I was indeed referring to WP:MUSICBIO, and I'm glad to see that you agree to the subject's notability threshold being achieved. That being said, with the draft currently in review for AfC, is it possible for you to view the draft to approve into the main article space? Or, does it have to be by another randomly assigned editor like it was the first time around? Either way, thank you once again for your help in getting the draft into a healthy state for resubmission! Thefarcry (talk) 04:38, 26 October 2021 (UTC)

• @Thefarcry: I'll leave the draft for someone else to review since I am WP:INVOLVED.

P.S. There's no need to ping me on my talk page, I get notifications anytime somebody edits it. ––FormalDude talk 05:46, 26 October 2021 (UTC)

Understood, thanks again for everything! Thefarcry (talk) 05:48, 26 October 2021 (UTC)

Happy to help! ––FormalDude talk 05:49, 26 October 2021 (UTC)

Lsmt does not meet the G14 criteria for speedy deletion as it references two extant articles

The page does disambiguate two extant articles (LSMT and LSM-tree). I don't see a reason for deleting it. PasqualiRB (talk) 22:42, 26 October 2021 (UTC)

@PasqualiRB: LSMT should be the disambiguation page if there's going to be one, not Lsmt. I personally don't think these topics need any further disambiguation besides WP:HATNOTES. ––FormalDude talk 00:58, 27 October 2021 (UTC)

I think it's reasonable to disambiguate LSMT as you said, but I opted for a more conservative (i.e. not changing too much) approach -- so I've added a hatnote in LSMT page. The rationale is:

• As I noticed during a brief research, the abbreviation "LSMT" for Log-structured merge-tree is not as common as "LSM-tree". It was me who added "LSMT" as an abbreviation in Log-structured merge-tree page based on an academic paper using the term (and there are probably others using this abbreviation as it seems natural to do so -- e.g. [1], [2]). By the way, the term "LSMT" is not referenced in the original paper about the data structure, and I don't know whether or not a standard rule exist to use the abbreviation. The main point I want to address is minimizing confusion regarding the term. P.S. I've also added a hatnote in the page LSTM (which is about Long short-term memory, a subject that is also part of computer science).
• Based on pageviews, the organization/place London School of Musical Theatre is more popular than the computer science data structure Log-structured merge-tree.

PasqualiRB (talk) 19:26, 27 October 2021 (UTC)

@PasqualiRB: In that case, is Lsmt still needed? ––FormalDude talk 03:33, 28 October 2021 (UTC)

Pinging @Liz who declined the CSD to see what she thinks. ––FormalDude talk 00:58, 27 October 2021 (UTC)

A change to the Bare Knuckle Boxing page

Hi FormalDude,

I received a message from you saying that I had made a change to the Bare Knuckle Boxing Wikipedia page that had been taken down because of citing issues. The thing is I don't actually remember making any changes, and after trying to move to this message page I have lost which account it was associated with. I assume the change is linked to my IP address, so I was wondering if you could let me know what the change was (so that I know I'm not being hacked haha)

Thanks 46.233.83.120 (talk) 09:36, 27 October 2021 (UTC)Ain, 27/10/2021 46.233.83.120 (talk) 09:36, 27 October 2021 (UTC)iceicesmell@gmail.com

The following change was made here by someone using your IP address:

Bareknuckle boxing is now legal in one state in the United States. As it stands in the other 51 States of the United States of America it is still illegal. ––FormalDude talk 09:39, 27 October 2021 (UTC)

University Federal Credit Union

Hello,

On the University Federal Credit Union Page you said that "any text that cannot be properly sourced with an inline citation should be removed." Would you mind elaborating on this can going through the draft to point out what needs a citation?

97.117.154.105 (talk) 16:00, 27 October 2021 (UTC) From: Ellyse-Firetoss Date: 10/27/21

I removed the unsourced content. Feel free to add back anything that you find a proper citation for. ––FormalDude talk 08:13, 28 October 2021 (UTC)

See Wikipedia:Verifiability for more info Justiyaya 08:26, 28 October 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Fez, Morocco

The article Fez, Morocco you nominated as a good article has been placed on hold . The article is close to meeting the good article criteria, but there are some minor changes or clarifications needing to be addressed. If these are fixed within 7 days, the article will pass; otherwise it may fail. See Talk:Fez, Morocco for issues which need to be addressed. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Mertbiol -- Mertbiol (talk) 19:20, 31 October 2021 (UTC)

Feedback request: All RFCs request for comment

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Feedback request: Politics, government, and law request for comment

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Mentorship

Hey FormalDude! [here is the article I'm working on]. When you have time, I'd appreciate any feedback/direction you can provide. And as for music... Here's an invitation to revisit the soundtrack to The Sound of Music - especially "Maria" and "Do-Re-Mi" :) and thank you for your offer to help! WhichWench (talk) 07:49, 17 October 2021 (UTC)WhichWench

No problem @WhichWench, and thank you for the reccomendation! I've left a comment on your draft's talk page. ––FormalDude talk 21:04, 18 October 2021 (UTC)

Sorry

Sorry, I won't do it again. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 61.18.127.99 (talk) 12:37, 1 November 2021 (UTC)

The Photograph That Changed My Life

Hi,

My references are from Financial Times, Guardian and RPS websites, I wonder why you don't accept these articles as reliable, secondary sources that are independent. I think they are very reliable and very independent resources. Could you please explain why you don't accept them? Thank you — Preceding unsigned comment added by Elifnurk (talk • contribs) 01:21, 2 November 2021 (UTC)

@Elifnurk: The Financial Times source is paywalled and not archived, so I'm not able to review it. The Guardian source does not contain significant coverage. That makes RPS the only acceptable and accessible source currently, which is not enough for the subject to be considered notable for a Wikipedia article. ––FormalDude talk 01:30, 2 November 2021 (UTC)

Edit Request

Hello, I raised an edit request on Talk:KSI a few weeks ago and you accepted it. However, I just checked that they have since been undone for no reason. So I have raised an updated request on Talk:KSI. Would you be able to check it ? Thank you. —103.59.75.157 (talk) 18:40, 2 November 2021 (UTC)

 Done by ScottishFinnishRadish minutes after post above Justiyaya 00:02, 6 November 2021 (UTC)

regarding Nadeem Naushad page recjection

could you help me to understand , how I can get the approvals

best regards Biju — Preceding unsigned comment added by Bijukunhappa (talk • contribs) 05:09, 3 November 2021 (UTC)

@Bijukunhappa: The topic has been rejected as it is not notable for a Wikipedia article. At this time, there is no way for an article about the Nadeem Naushad to be created. I apologize for the inconvenience, but not everyone is notable for a Wikipedia article, in fact, most people are not. ––FormalDude talk 05:23, 3 November 2021 (UTC)

Zemmour close

Hi FormalDude, you probably were a little tired yesterday night, right? 😊 You forgot to sign your close at Talk:Éric Zemmour and wrote "Zemmouir" instead of "Zemmour". Best. JBchrch talk 13:20, 4 November 2021 (UTC)

@JBchrch: Thanks, I've fixed it now. ––FormalDude talk 14:56, 4 November 2021 (UTC)

Notice of noticeboard discussion

There is currently a discussion at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you.Emigré55 (talk) 09:41, 7 November 2021 (UTC) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Administrators%27_noticeboard/Archive338#Eric_Zemmour_talk_page:_Abnormal_and_biased_closure

 Courtesy link: Special:Permalink/1055024264

Hope you don't mind

Hello FormalDude​, i just wanted to ask a favor of you. I was wondering if you could watch over the Connor McGregor page for a weeks as there is an editor User:NEDOCHAN who has been making unconstructive edits on it and got into an edit war with me due to it. You can read the edit summaries there to understand what happened. I understand that you had problems with the same editor on the exact same page and as he has reported me to the admins and I'll probably get banned i didn't want that editor to make more unconstructive edits in my absence. I thought he will respect a more experienced editor like you. Hope you don't mind, if you can't be bothered that's fine as well. Jaconsurto (talk) 12:38, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

Above user has been placed back in the sock drawer. – ².O.^Boxing 13:24, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

Red Bull

Hi again! I have submitted a fairly minor request here to add mention of a couple additional notable Red Bull events to the Events section, which you've reviewed previously. There are two other events with separate Wikipedia entries which I think could be added to this section. Another editor seems to think enough events are mentioned; I will give some thought to how this section could be better organized (perhaps grouping by type or region), but in the meantime, do you think these two notable events could be included in the list? Thanks again for your prior help! Inkian Jason (talk) 14:14, 8 November 2021 (UTC)

PROD policy

Editors are allowed to remove PRODs for any reason. This goes for the article's creators as well. Please do not edit war over a PROD, as you did here. Sdrqaz (talk) 14:11, 15 November 2021 (UTC)

@Sdrqaz: Thanks. I wouldn't call my one revert edit warring though... ––FormalDude ^talk 01:35, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

Sorry but when policy prohibits even one revert in this instance, I think it's edit-warring. If you you were to breach 3RR over a PROD (the "bright line"), I think a block would be justified. Sdrqaz (talk) 11:43, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Fez, Morocco

The article Fez, Morocco you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Fez, Morocco for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already appeared on the main page as a "Did you know" item, or as a bold link under "In the News" or in the "On This Day" prose section, you can nominate it within the next seven days to appear in DYK. Bolded names with dates listed at the bottom of the "On This Day" column do not affect DYK eligibility. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Mertbiol -- Mertbiol (talk) 19:21, 1 November 2021 (UTC)

Brian Tudor Speedy Deletion https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Brian_Tudor

Are you a card trick expert?

I am an avid fan of specialty card tricks and when I found that wikipedia had articles about it I was surprised to find that they didn't have a profile for one of my very favorite magicians. How does Lee Asher, Chris Kenner, Daniel and David Buck - Dan and Dave who all worked with him have pages, yet he does not?

He is mentioned in several articles as the creator of the genre:

[[4]] (Multiple mentions) [[5]] [[6]]

The authority on card flourishes, Jerry Cestkowski said in his book, Tudor had "very, very good flourish cuts and some unbelievable false flourish cuts." (http://docshare.tips/the-encyclopedia-of-playing-card-flourishes_587545e9b6d87f86848b49f5.html )

This is the single most prolific producer of card flourishing publications, how does that still not make him notable?

I was asked for more independent sources to confirm his notability, the article lists that he is cited as notable by:

1. Vanity Fair 2. Encyclopedia of Playing Card Flourishes 3. Urban Dictionary 4. Genii Magazine 5. Magic Magazine 6. DecemberBoys.com.ua 7. Bicycle Playing Card website 8. "Flash Cards with Jerry Cestkowski" podcast

There are 27 total references. I was told I needed seven, and now I have plenty more, how many do I need to satisfy you? Chris Kenner has much fewer and has his own article.

I am in contact with the cited noble contributors such as David Copperfield, Chris Kenner, and Dave and Dan, but they all don't understand why the draft would be rejected.

Do you have any tips to help me accomplish this? — Preceding unsigned comment added by CardistryExpert (talk • contribs) 01:03, 3 November 2021 (UTC)

Hi @CardistryExpert, first things first, what is your affiliation with Brian Tudor? Have you been paid to write this article? Considering you say you're in contact with several people in the magic world, it seems you may have a possible conflict of interest. Wikimedia's terms of use require you to disclose any conflict of interest, especially paid editing. ––FormalDude talk 01:20, 3 November 2021 (UTC)

I am not affiliated with him, just a fan, but I have asked Chris Kenner, etc. through social media channels and they believe he should have his own page, being integral to the inception and adoption of cardistry techniques. — Preceding unsigned comment added by CardistryExpert (talk • contribs) 23:30, 5 November 2021 (UTC)

@CardistryExpert About the draft, please ensure that all your sources are reliable, and please read Wikipedia:Reliable sources, an article should only need two quality sources that provide significant coverage to be accepted. If you are unsure what counts as a reliable source, please check if there's a discussion about your source up on WP:RSPS.
This is a draft about a living person, one of the hardest to article types to get right due to it's stringent requirements for the quality of source. If you intend on making positive contributions on Wikipedia, I would strongly suggest you edit elsewhere for a while to gain a stronger understanding of Wikipedia, then come come back to it when you are more experienced. Justiyaya 23:59, 5 November 2021 (UTC)

I submitted more than two quality sources, Vanity Fair and Genii Magazine are mainstream sources that are well respected in the industry and elsewhere as reliable and independent. — Preceding unsigned comment added by CardistryExpert (talk • contribs) 00:20, 6 November 2021 (UTC)

@CardistryExpert Significant coverage? Justiyaya 05:27, 6 November 2021 (UTC)

Yes, the Vanity Fair article details how he was the pioneer of this unique style and influenced many magicians (who are notable with their own wikipedia pages,) and they all follow and support him on social media.

Vanity Fair has paragraphs on his contributions: 'When the Bucks were 13, they became mesmerized by a VHS instructional tape called “Show Off” in which a performer named Brian Tudor taught eye-popping cuts with playing cards... [unique] one-handed cuts broken into three packets, with the third twisting an added 180 revolution. Eyes sufficiently bugged out, the Bucks fell down a rabbit hole.' 'Brian Tudor’s VHS tape “Show Off”... a card move called “The Five Faces of Sybil,” described as “a quick cut flourish to demonstrate skill and dexterity.” Using all available fingers, Sybil divides a deck of cards into five distinct stacks, resembling staircases in an Escher print. [Tudor] can deftly perform Sybil the way guitarists can run through a blues progression."

Genii Magazine: "the flourishes, amazing multiple in-the-hands cuts and shuffles, are being performed (in real time) by a 19-year-old mere mortal by the name of Brian Tudor.") and Magic magazines

@CardistryExpert See comment on Draft:Brian Tudor by Worldbruce Justiyaya 06:50, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

References

Question about WP:NONAZI

Thanks for your suggestion over at Wikipedia talk:No Nazis. I struck the notice as you suggested. Honestly I was unsure if it was the appropriate venue, but I do now have a question: apart from ANI, is there a place where I can seek additional input when it seems to me that one or another of the bright lines described on NONAZI have been crossed? In this case it seems clear that editors were explicitly arguing that white people are more intelligent than non-whites, ie.e item #1 of the WP:RACISTBELIEFS section, which appears to be the kind of action for which NONAZIS warns editors who come here to push this fringe point of view in articles, under the guise of the neutral point of view policy, are typically blocked as POV pushers. Have I misunderstood the purpose of the essay or the consensus behind it? It seems I must have, but I'm unsure now what I'm meant to do when it appears that NONAZIS is being brazenly overstepped. Generalrelative (talk) 02:52, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

@Generalrelative: no problem, I appreciate you striking the comment.

Since it's just an essay, it can be easily construed as canvassing those with similar opinions as you to a discussion. Currently the best place to raise those types of concerns would most likely be at Wikipedia:Neutral point of view/Noticeboard. I don't think you've misunderstood the purpose of the essay, but possibly you have misunderstood the consensus behind it. Essays are not policies nor guidelines and as such don't carry the same weight as them. While it appears a majority of the community supports this particular essay, it is still just an essay.

If there's editors who you think are blatantly violating the spirit of Wikipedia, you can do as the essay suggests and report them to WP:ANI. ––FormalDude ^talk 03:52, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

Thanks very much, FormalDude. I will keep this in mind. Generalrelative (talk) 04:07, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

@Generalrelative: happy to help. You may have seen my suggestion on the talk page to start an RfC for this. Often that's a good way to get more editors involved and on the record, and it makes it easier for a consensus to form. Up to you though of course. ––FormalDude ^talk 04:42, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

I appreciate the suggestion, and would of course participate. But I'd prefer to let those seeking to alter the article decided how they want to frame the question. There is so much bad blood in that topic area among those who are salty about the existing consensus that I fear any RfC I were to frame would be decried as biased in some way and wouldn't actually end debate. Not sure if you've been following shenanigans at ArbCom but these folks truly do not drop sticks, even in the face of overwhelming consensus. Generalrelative (talk) 05:13, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

Hella gay userbox

Hi, cool userbox, but I just wanted to point out that for some reason it has a bit of whitespace in front of it which makes it not align with any other userboxes and that just really bothers the designer in me.

I've been listening to a lot of Protest the Hero the last few days. May not be your cup of tea (pun intended) but you asked to share so here we are.

--CupOfTea696 (talk) 02:53, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

@CupOfTea696: Yeah, it's driving me a bit insane too. I can't figure out what's causing it though; I've been tinkering with it for a while. Probably need a programmer to help lol. And thanks for the suggestion! Feel free to add one or more of your favorite songs of theirs to my list. ––FormalDude ^talk 03:05, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

@CupOfTea696: The wonderful Eviolite was able to fix it! ––FormalDude ^talk 03:58, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

@FormalDude: Awesome news! Glad you got it sorted :) —CupOfTea696 (talk) 13:10, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for the music! The Polyphia song is really cool. ––FormalDude ^talk 13:37, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

Extended Confirmed confirmation

Hello again! I wanted to ask you a question as you've been super helpful for me in the past. I do believe my account has reach 500 edits and is more than 30 days old. Is there any process that can grant me extended confirmed user status? I suppose it really isn't a huge deal, I just wanted to inquire about it. Thanks again for all you've done to help me out as I find my niche, I've been having a great time getting acclimated to the site. Spf121188 (talk) 15:54, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

Actually, scratch that, it looks like it updated automatically. My apologies for cluttering your talk page! Spf121188 (talk) 15:56, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

(talk page stalker)The extended confirmed process happens automatically as soon as you have the required number of edits and account age. You don't need to specifically apply or ask for it. Trainsandotherthings (talk) 18:04, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

Capitol Attack

Moved to Talk:2021 United States Capitol attack § Dispute over two categories

RfC on WSJ Talk Page

Hey, I checked the archive for the previous RfC on the talk page, and it was archived without being closed. Someone started a new RfC, with some previously uninvolved editors, and it is currently being discussed on the talk page. Thought you might want to know, since you voted in the previous one. Bill Williams 01:32, 24 November 2021 (UTC)

@Bill Williams: Thanks for the notice, appreciate it. ––FormalDude ^talk 08:52, 24 November 2021 (UTC)

No problem, and thanks for working things out on the Kenosha article. Bill Williams 08:53, 24 November 2021 (UTC)

Close of Brake check AfD

I very strongly disagree with this close; a plurality of !votes were to keep the article, as the !votes to merge were divided on which article to merge to. GhostOfDanGurney (talk) 08:24, 28 November 2021 (UTC)

@GhostOfDanGurney: Stronger policy-based arguments were made in favor of merging. It's not a ballot. ––FormalDude ^talk 08:35, 28 November 2021 (UTC)

The only policy-based argument on either side that I see is a !vote to merge to Road rage and not Tailgating, though...? GhostOfDanGurney (talk) 08:47, 28 November 2021 (UTC)

As someone who believes that the subject can be expanded on, it'd be easier for me to write about the subject within an article on Road rage than one on Tailgating. GhostOfDanGurney (talk) 08:54, 28 November 2021 (UTC)

@GhostOfDanGurney: My closure does not prevent you from still doing that. ––FormalDude ^talk 09:48, 28 November 2021 (UTC)

I feel that this would now require an RfD, unless you can assure me that no one would call it disruptive to BOLDly retarget the redirect to Road rage. GhostOfDanGurney (talk) 16:07, 28 November 2021 (UTC)

• Hi FormalDude. Could you please elaborate on the relevant policy(s) which were cited by users advocating merger with tailgating? As far as I can tell, clear arguments AGAINST such a merger were made, but not refuted. I'm struggling to understand how you came to your decision on consensus here. A7V2 (talk) 11:37, 28 November 2021 (UTC)

  @A7V2: Notability guidelines. The topic was not notable for a standalone article. ––FormalDude ^talk 07:51, 29 November 2021 (UTC)

  Speaking for myself, I can't say that I'm satisfied by this elaboration; you still haven't addressed why the decision was made to merge to Tailgating and not Road rage. Neither of the two !votes to merge to Tailgating cited a wikipedia policy and the nominator themself wasn't even concerned about notability. -"Ghost of Dan Gurney" 15:27, 29 November 2021 (UTC)

Deletion review for Brake check

An editor has asked for a deletion review of Brake check. Because you closed the deletion discussion for this page, speedily deleted it, or otherwise were interested in the page, you might want to participate in the deletion review. -"Ghost of Dan Gurney" 17:49, 29 November 2021 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.