User talk:IZAK/Archive 29
IZAK (talk · contribs · central auth · count · email)
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Joseph Carlebach
I'm one of the authors of the article about this great Rabbi in german language. My problem is: my english is not good enough to help the english article out of the stub status. Can we co-operate? Leschinski 12:55, 22 February 2007 (UTC)
- Hi, I already worked on it. I would be very happy to help you with this. IZAK 08:07, 23 February 2007 (UTC)
- Hi Izak, thank you. I'll start the next days to work on the englisch version. Do you think there is a mutual interest outside Hamburg to his actual honorship? Or should this be very short? The state Instutut für jüdische Geschichte (Institute for Jewish History [in Hamburg]) has the complete files of the Jewih Communnity incl. more that 400 artictles of Carlebach. Shall we make a little more about the Rabbi Carlebach? For Example his time in Palestine and his contacts with (and inspiration through) Rabbi Samuel Salant, Rabbi Jakob Schaul Eliaschar und Rabbi Abraham Isaak Hakohen Kook? Leschinski 10:37, 23 February 2007 (UTC)
- Yes, yes, everything, especially his contacts with those significant rabbis as he was first and foremost a rabbi. All aspects about him can and must be written up. PLEASE contact User:SlimVirgin and explain the subject as best you can, tell her I suggested you contact her, and tell her that you have all this great material at your disposal, she is a great writer and researcher and if one can combine your sources with her style and abilities to use it, you may even produce a Wikipedia:Featured article as she did with the article about Rudolf Vrba who was also an important Holocaust figure. Best wishes. Now I must get some sleep. (P.S. You may also want to contact User:Jayjg and User:Humus sapiens to help out with this.) All three are also admins who know their way around Wikipedia, and they have a great interest in Jewish history and the Holocaust. IZAK 11:30, 23 February 2007 (UTC)
- Hi Izak, thank you. I'll start the next days to work on the englisch version. Do you think there is a mutual interest outside Hamburg to his actual honorship? Or should this be very short? The state Instutut für jüdische Geschichte (Institute for Jewish History [in Hamburg]) has the complete files of the Jewih Communnity incl. more that 400 artictles of Carlebach. Shall we make a little more about the Rabbi Carlebach? For Example his time in Palestine and his contacts with (and inspiration through) Rabbi Samuel Salant, Rabbi Jakob Schaul Eliaschar und Rabbi Abraham Isaak Hakohen Kook? Leschinski 10:37, 23 February 2007 (UTC)
Hi Izak, thank you for your interest and you activity. I used the time to discuss to read more (Vrba etc.)and to discuss with some german participants to the Joseph Carlebach article. I hope you allow me to give a historical basic Background why J.C. has still such a honorable name in Hamburg and why you can still study the Jewish Language on the Germanistic Institute of the State University of Hamburg (i try to do it as short i can) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Leschinski (talk • contribs) :
- The City of Altona (Hamburgs beautyfull sister) was up to 1863 the 2nd bigest town of the liberal Denmark. After the danish/german war, it comes from 1864 to Germany. The Nazis finished the years of Independence 1937 and integrated Altona to the City of Hamburg. When J.C. become Rabbi in independent Altona, there were a young Lord Mayor, Max Brauer. Brauer were, to say it in our todays words a "Fan" of J.C. He visit very often his public talks and discussions. J.C. likes the liberal Altona and his young Leader mainly for the open gates for a lot of jewish emigrants from Eastern Europe (a lot of them on transit to Palestine and America). No surprise that even May Brauer has to emigrate (to New York) 1933. There he refreshed the contacts to jewish Hamburg Emigrants. When he came in power after 2nd WW as now: 1st Lord mayor and president of the senate (the official title, Hamburg become now an intependent state of the Federel repupblic of Germany), that means he become Governor of the state of Hamburg in the first democratic elections, he ask some emigrants for reimmigration. One of the important one was Herbert Weichmann, from an old yewish family from Slask (Schlesien), for eight years as Brauers scretary of finance. Than Weichmann become for six years the first jewish governor in the old city-republic of Hamburg in all the times. In this time the yewish community growth from 90 remaining people to 2500 (today about 4000). 1960 was builded a new Synagoge.Leschinski 07:34, 27 February 2007 (UTC)
Hi Leschinski: While I appreciate this information, let us stick to the subject and try to be VERY focused and disciplined. Therefore it would help if you post as much information about the life and accomplishments of Rabbi Joseph Carlebach to build up the article about him. Please try to quote references. Thank you, IZAK 07:41, 27 February 2007 (UTC)
Hi IZAK, to hold you informed: we work at first with some people to complete the german article. We have now even a retired teacher with a lot of time for the institute of yewish history. They have only a presence Library, make it difficult for people with regular work, but fantastic original material. We are still moving... Leschinski 15:00, 2 March 2007 (UTC)
Hi IZAK, sounds like an interesting project. Not sure I'll have time to do much Wikipedia work this weekend. Shabbat Shalom and happy Purim. --Shirahadasha 16:43, 2 March 2007 (UTC)
DEFAULTSORT
IZAK: I can't see any need for adding {{DEFAULTSORT:}} with the page name to articles, as that is the default anyway.--Redaktor 16:50, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
- Hi, I may have made a few mistakes in my usage of this template. But I think I have the hang of it now. IZAK 12:14, 28 May 2007 (UTC)
Could you please look at Shlomo Sawilowsky?
It needs a lot of cleanup, but I'm not in the mood to do it. Thanks. YechielMan 18:14, 27 May 2007 (UTC)
- Done. IZAK 12:12, 28 May 2007 (UTC)
Redirects
Hi IZAK, to save me rooting around could you point me to the relevant policy about shortcuts not linking to userspace pages? Just want to make sure I follow the rules :) Thanks, Deiz talk 11:34, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
- Hi Deiz: The policy is stated in the {{R from shortcut}} template itself: "This is a redirect from a Wikipedia shortcut. Shortcuts are generally reserved for Wikipedia project pages, their discussion pages and categories..." If you wish to create WP:NOA as you did, see Help:Modifying and Creating policy#How to propose a new policy and see also Wikipedia:Policies and guidelines#How are policies started? IZAK 11:50, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
- Hmm, I see you think it's cute to create useless "WP" "redirects" and "policies" that go absolutely nowhere, such as WP:EARLY - WP:CHILL - WP:REDBLUE - WP:HEY - WP:BO - WP:NMCHK - WP:NOA. What is to be gained by such activity? IZAK 12:27, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
- Wow, someone takes their redirects very seriously. I don't understand your notion that they are useless and link nowhere, they clearly link to essays - I'm not sure why you think they are "policies" - and some are used by various editors in deletion debates and other discussions. Check out [1] for an example. I'm surprised by your apparent incivility and would rather not have my work described as "useless", thanks very much. I could ask what is to be gained by worrying about trifling redirects and shortcuts, but I'm sure you have your reasons. Speaking of policies, where is the policy about this, the RfS template makes no mention of whether this is policy, guideline or opinion. Deiz talk 12:48, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
- Hi Deiz: Ok, I will not repaet what I said above because it's very clear and obvious unless one wishes to be obtuse about it. I will add the following to reinforce my point/s: (1) "WP" on Wikipedia yields the following disambiguation page: WP. (2) At the very top of that page it clearly states: "In Wikipedia, WP may refer to Wikipedia:List of shortcuts, Wikipedia:WikiProjects, or Wikipedia:Portal" (note, that funny experimental pages are excluded, so it means they are not desirable.) (3) (i) Click on Wikipedia:List of shortcuts and you will see at the top of the page that "Shortcuts" is part of Community · Directory · Maintenance · Projects · Quick directory · Requests · Shortcuts · Tips · Tools. (All only very important official parts of Wikipedia) (3) (ii) Click on Wikipedia:WikiProject, where a WikiProject is described as: "A WikiProject is a collection of pages devoted to the management of a specific topic or family of topics within Wikipedia; and, simultaneously, a group of editors that use said pages to collaborate on encyclopedic work. It is not a place to write encyclopedia articles directly, but a resource to help coordinate and organize article writing. The attached talk pages are a convenient forum for those interested in a particular project." (your stuff is surely not a "Wikiproject.") (3) (iii) Click on Wikipedia:Portal and you will read at the top that: "Portals are pages intended to serve as 'Main Pages' for specific topics or areas. Portals may be associated with one or more WikiProjects; unlike WikiProjects, however, they are meant for both readers and editors of Wikipedia, and should promote content and encourage contribution." (You are not a portal either.) (4) Thus from the foregoing three examples one can clearly see that the official usage of the "WP" prefix in any instance of "WP:_____" is the only universally accepted standard guiding users, which translates into a key policy. (5) As to when the "WP" abbreviation was "born" and if there is a specific "policy" that explains its use is to miss the point and that not every last detail of Wikipedia's modus operandi is enshrined in specific policies, which in any case would be redundant if a practice has gained universal acceptance. (6) One can therefore safely conclude, that frivolous and pointless uses of the "WP" prefix, and redirects to and from such haphazard abbreviations connected to it, that have not gained the widespread approval nor official recognition of the Wikipedia community run counter to long-standing Wikipedia usage/s and should therefore be avoided and/or deleted, see WP:SANDBOX for experimentation. Thank you, IZAK 13:24, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
- Thanks for taking the time to outline your thoughts. With respect to most of the above, I'm pretty up on "how it all works". Regarding your assessment that "Thus from the foregoing three examples one can clearly see that the official usage of the "WP" prefix in any instance of "WP:_____" is the only universally accepted standard guiding users, which translates into a key policy.", I disagree, and find the use of terms such as "useless", "frivolous", "haphazard" and "pointless" a little distasteful and certainly unnecessary. Absent of a policy outlining the use of the WP: prefix, and any reason not to use it to redirect to useful pages in projectspace, I remain unconvinced of any compelling reason not to do so. Some if not all of these redirects have been in place for over a year, and many have been cited by many members of the community. Only one member of that community has, in all that time, voiced any objection, which I find to be less than indicative of a "universally accepted standard". Cheers, Deiz talk 13:51, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
- Hi Deiz: Do you plan on restructuring Wikipedia any time soon? IZAK 15:18, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
- Thanks for taking the time to outline your thoughts. With respect to most of the above, I'm pretty up on "how it all works". Regarding your assessment that "Thus from the foregoing three examples one can clearly see that the official usage of the "WP" prefix in any instance of "WP:_____" is the only universally accepted standard guiding users, which translates into a key policy.", I disagree, and find the use of terms such as "useless", "frivolous", "haphazard" and "pointless" a little distasteful and certainly unnecessary. Absent of a policy outlining the use of the WP: prefix, and any reason not to use it to redirect to useful pages in projectspace, I remain unconvinced of any compelling reason not to do so. Some if not all of these redirects have been in place for over a year, and many have been cited by many members of the community. Only one member of that community has, in all that time, voiced any objection, which I find to be less than indicative of a "universally accepted standard". Cheers, Deiz talk 13:51, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
- Hi Deiz: Ok, I will not repaet what I said above because it's very clear and obvious unless one wishes to be obtuse about it. I will add the following to reinforce my point/s: (1) "WP" on Wikipedia yields the following disambiguation page: WP. (2) At the very top of that page it clearly states: "In Wikipedia, WP may refer to Wikipedia:List of shortcuts, Wikipedia:WikiProjects, or Wikipedia:Portal" (note, that funny experimental pages are excluded, so it means they are not desirable.) (3) (i) Click on Wikipedia:List of shortcuts and you will see at the top of the page that "Shortcuts" is part of Community · Directory · Maintenance · Projects · Quick directory · Requests · Shortcuts · Tips · Tools. (All only very important official parts of Wikipedia) (3) (ii) Click on Wikipedia:WikiProject, where a WikiProject is described as: "A WikiProject is a collection of pages devoted to the management of a specific topic or family of topics within Wikipedia; and, simultaneously, a group of editors that use said pages to collaborate on encyclopedic work. It is not a place to write encyclopedia articles directly, but a resource to help coordinate and organize article writing. The attached talk pages are a convenient forum for those interested in a particular project." (your stuff is surely not a "Wikiproject.") (3) (iii) Click on Wikipedia:Portal and you will read at the top that: "Portals are pages intended to serve as 'Main Pages' for specific topics or areas. Portals may be associated with one or more WikiProjects; unlike WikiProjects, however, they are meant for both readers and editors of Wikipedia, and should promote content and encourage contribution." (You are not a portal either.) (4) Thus from the foregoing three examples one can clearly see that the official usage of the "WP" prefix in any instance of "WP:_____" is the only universally accepted standard guiding users, which translates into a key policy. (5) As to when the "WP" abbreviation was "born" and if there is a specific "policy" that explains its use is to miss the point and that not every last detail of Wikipedia's modus operandi is enshrined in specific policies, which in any case would be redundant if a practice has gained universal acceptance. (6) One can therefore safely conclude, that frivolous and pointless uses of the "WP" prefix, and redirects to and from such haphazard abbreviations connected to it, that have not gained the widespread approval nor official recognition of the Wikipedia community run counter to long-standing Wikipedia usage/s and should therefore be avoided and/or deleted, see WP:SANDBOX for experimentation. Thank you, IZAK 13:24, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
- Wow, someone takes their redirects very seriously. I don't understand your notion that they are useless and link nowhere, they clearly link to essays - I'm not sure why you think they are "policies" - and some are used by various editors in deletion debates and other discussions. Check out [1] for an example. I'm surprised by your apparent incivility and would rather not have my work described as "useless", thanks very much. I could ask what is to be gained by worrying about trifling redirects and shortcuts, but I'm sure you have your reasons. Speaking of policies, where is the policy about this, the RfS template makes no mention of whether this is policy, guideline or opinion. Deiz talk 12:48, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
Hi IZAK. Could you please have a look at the link and see if you can help? Some articles are needing more references in order to get released. You can leave your comments at the page as well. Thanks in advance. -- FayssalF - Wiki me up® 17:14, 29 May 2007 (UTC)
WikiProject:Judaism Barnstar award for you
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The Jewish Barnstar | |
| You have done so much for Jewish related articles perhaps you and me can get some Jewish articles to be featured User:Java7837 23:10, 30 May 2007 (UTC) |
- Thank you Java7837, I greatly appreciate your sentiments! IZAK 00:23, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
Hi
Just wanted to know if you created the template {{HasidicDynasties}}, and what you are going to use it for. It seems pretty pointless. --Smokizzy (talk) 16:44, 1 June 2007 (UTC)
- Hi Smokizzy: I "created" it because it's part of an ongoing effort to arrive at an acceptable "definition" on Wikipedia of what a Hasidic dynasty is. Anyone who knows something about this subject is welcome to improve the template! The template is meant to be placed on all articles about Hasidic dynasties (see Category:Hasidic dynasties) so that (a) all editors can work from a common dfefinition and (b) any readers who may know nothing about this topic can learn a basic definition of a Hasidic dynasty. I have already begun doing so at Bobov (Hasidic dynasty); Belz (Hasidic dynasty); Breslov (Hasidic dynasty); Ger (Hasidic dynasty) ; Ruzhin (Hasidic dynasty); Sanz (Hasidic dynasty); Satmar (Hasidic dynasty); Skver (Hasidic dynasty) and there's lot's more to go. Did you bother to read what I posted at Template talk:HasidicDynasties? Please do that (especially the serious discussions about this topic at Wikipedia:Mediation Cabal/Cases/2007-04-29 Mezhbizh (Hasidic dynasty)), and then come back here and ask me pointless questions. IZAK 21:09, 1 June 2007 (UTC)
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Ritual washing in Judaism
The Ritual washing in Judaism article has recently gone a major re-write, with much contentious material inserted. I've tried to clean up some of it, but I'd appreciate it if you could take a look. Jayjg (talk) 18:21, 3 June 2007 (UTC)
Reply
Someone had brought it up on #wikipedia and had presented a fair number of diffs IIRC (this was over a week ago). I'm pretty sure I did post those diffs - not sure exactly why it didn't show up (maybe there was a loss of session and I didn't see it) In any case, what's past is past, you can edit now so all seems well to me. -- Tawker 02:39, 4 June 2007 (UTC)
- Where, what? Who posted what diffs? I need to know exactly so that I can at least understand what was happening and see if there is any explanation. What the heck is "#wikipedia" -- do you think I am a moron? I do not appreciate your condescending comment here of "what's past is past" as you are thereby violating WP:OWN, and I certainly do not need your permission to edit anything AFAIK. I never heard of you or met you before. What do you know or have to do with Judaism articles where I mostly tend to edit? IZAK 02:45, 4 June 2007 (UTC)
Non-free use disputed for Image:IDF badge.gif
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Tawker didn't block you 19 May 07
He blocked you 20 May 06, over a year ago. (H) 05:50, 4 June 2007 (UTC)
- I can't even recall why that happened, and I do not recall why he did it. At any rate, I will withdraw my complaint against him on his talk page. Thanks for your help. IZAK 05:58, 4 June 2007 (UTC)
Sorry man
A year's just a little too old, you've got waaay too many contribs to figure out what happened a year ago. Don't worry about it, I'm sure everything is fine now :) Thank goodness someone pointed out it was a year old, I was confusing you w/ someone who I did block last week who had a kinda similar username. -- Tawker 06:08, 4 June 2007 (UTC)
- Hi Tawker: Yeah, I realize that. Sorry for my poor reading of the date also. A year is a long time for some of us on Wikipedia. Take care and keep cool. IZAK 06:31, 4 June 2007 (UTC)
Nicolas Sarkozy
Please see Nicolas Sarkozy... the second para about his Jewish background is not conclusive according to the def of "who is a jew". It is extremely long winded. There is no mainstream media sourcing his Jewish background. Please discuss. frummer 02:19, 6 June 2007 (UTC)
Request for Mediation
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The Military history WikiProject Newsletter: Issue XV (May 2007)
The May 2007 issue of the Military history WikiProject newsletter has been published. You may read the newsletter, change the format in which future issues will be delivered to you, or unsubscribe from this notification by following the link. Thank you.
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Rav Hutner
I don't understand why you removed my sourced information on the relationship between the Rebbe, Rav Hutner, and R' Soloveitchik, only to insert unsourced information. Please email me your response when you get back from vacation. --Yodamace1 10:51, 14 June 2007 (UTC)
Old Testament people
I was looking through the category schemes and came across Category:Old Testament people, in addition to Tanakh and Torah people. I was a little confused and searched google to find your archive. So I'm writing you know to see if you can help me understand why these seemingly separate but equal categorization schemes exist. Is there any place where these were discussed? At the very least, if OT people is going to be the parent cat for Tanakh and Torah people, in addition to the prophets, kings and judges subcategories, it seems like no articles should go in the parent cat OT people because they would be covered somewhere in the subcat. So before I go around removing the category "OT people" from articles, I wanted to see if you could help me understand the situation better. And judging by your past experience, you are least know something of this matter. Thanks for your consideration.-Andrew c 02:01, 16 June 2007 (UTC)
Orphaned non-free image (Image:IDF badge.gif)
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For deletion
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Claimed Messianic prophecies of Jesus— Preceding unsigned comment added by Java7837 (talk • contribs) 25 June 2007, see original full edit at [2]
Category:Jewish philosophy and philosophers for deletion
I've nominated a category you created, Category:Jewish philosophy and philosophers, for deletion. Thought I'd let you know. --Eliyak T·C 00:08, 28 June 2007 (UTC)
On that subject, IZAK, this may also interest you. Cheers, Tomertalk 03:16, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
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Commons
Please look at Image:Mass_Grave_Bergen_Belsen_May_1945.jpg, you have uploaded.The source of photo is necessary, unless it can be deleted by admin
Best regards: 85.89.162.47 15:20, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
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The Military history WikiProject Newsletter: Issue XVI (June 2007)
The June 2007 issue of the Military history WikiProject newsletter has been published. You may read the newsletter, change the format in which future issues will be delivered to you, or unsubscribe from this notification by following the link. Thank you.
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Everything OK there?
Hi IZAK, I was looking for someone to help with a Yiddish translation, and your name came up but I notice you've been quiet lately. Is everything OK with you? If you have a moment, please drop me a line - I'm trying to find out what [this intriguing picture] is about and maybe putting it on the Lion article. Cheers! Kla’quot (talk | contribs) 04:13, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
Jews categ not for individuals
Could you explain your comment. I have no objection about (Arthur Rubin) being moved to the subcategory, but I see no indication that, if we do not have a category for (country X jews), that an individual cannot not be in the Jews category. — Arthur Rubin | (talk) 13:53, 23 July 2007 (UTC)
- Hi Aurthur, by now there is a sub-category for any type of Jew on Wikipedia so there is no need to clutter up the parent category with useless names. IZAK 04:50, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
Welcome Back
Welcome back! We've missed you! --רח"ק | Talk | Contribs 23:53, 23 July 2007 (UTC)
Indeed, good to see you again. I hope your break was suitably refreshing. :) DanielC/T+ 10:29, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
this might interest you
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of Messianic Jews and Hebrew Christians --Yeshivish 06:32, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
Thanks
Thanks for your help with Irving Greenberg. I didn't know much about him but was surprized that WP didn't have an article since he seems to be fairly important. Steve Dufour 00:51, 28 July 2007 (UTC)
Articles that are anti-zionist
Palestinian people and History of Israel from prehistory to the modern day tend to be very bias please fix this for me --Java7837 02:08, 30 July 2007 (UTC)
Ronald Perelman & Orthodox
While I can see removing him from Category:Chabad-Lubavitch Hasidim (I was never very sure about that one, I only put him there because he financed some of their operations), I'm curious about your reasoning for removing him from Category: Orthodox Jews. As far as I know, he has gone to an Orthodox synagogue of some variety or another for at least thirty years. Chris Croy 04:02, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
- Hi, he may go to a synagogue that may be Orthodox but that does not make him Orthodox. And by the way, do you know the exact synagogues he goes to? Does he claim to be Orthodox? Being Orthodox is NOT defined by attending a synagogue, it is defined by observance of Shabbat and the 613 Mitzvot as they apply. IZAK 22:15, 7 August 2007 (UTC)
- He strictly observes the Shabbat. I can't speak with authority about whether he observes all 613 of the Mitzvot. He does keep a kosher household, but I'm pretty sure there's not a businessman alive who observes #534-537. I don't know where I got it from, but in my notes I have written that he goes to the "Fifth Avenue Synagogue", which describes itself as Modern Orthodox. He also married at least his fourth wife there, possibly previous wives too. Chris Croy 05:40, 13 August 2007 (UTC)
- Hi again Chris Coy: You cite his synagogue again, but that does not prove his or anyone's "Orthodoxy" or "orthodoxy" as many of those places often (unfortunately) function more as "clubs" (gathering points, watering holes, networking and bull-sessions) for some Jewish high and mighty than as spiritual centers of prayer and devotion and submssion to the ways of Judaism's true God. How do you know that he "strictly observes Shabbat"? What is your definition of observing Shabbat "strictly" and "keeping" a kosher home? Many Jews affiliated with Conservative Judaism also claim to do so, and they may even belong to Orthodox shulls at the same time, but it does not make them adherents of Orthodox Judaism. Perhaps the missing term in this discussion is "Conservadox"? Do you think that it may apply in this case? And oh, what's with the four wives? Is that part of being "stylishly Orthodox" too? And by the way, no-one alive today keeps the 613 Mitzvot as such. It's a number that has been arrived at by the rabbis and (a number of) which mitzvot are in it is disputed by the ancient sages. But being Shabbat-observant, defined as adhering to the 39 categories of work is a universal standard for deciding of true Orthodoxy. Can you WP:CITE some WP:SOURCES that prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that he is Orthodox? Not just hearsay and speculation based on "does he or doesn't he? only his hairdresser knows" type pseuo-reasoning that gets us nowhere! IZAK 09:27, 22 August 2007 (UTC)
- He WAS raised Conservative, but converted to Orthodoxy after going to Israel. So, details:
- -From an interview with his fourth wife, Ellen Barkin, with the Irish Independent: "Now we have a huge kitchen with a wall of refrigerators—one dairy, one meat. Ronald is one-hundred-per-cent kosher. I make the brisket on Passover.” Laughing, she said, “Ronald has me buy the meat from a kosher butcher shop where everything costs three times as much.” - A brief example of what kosher means to him.
- -From When Money Is King, page 37: "A formal business meeting on Saturday, the Jewish Sabbath, was impossible for the observant Perelman. But so intent was he on convincing Folz to head up his team at Consolidated that he offered to join him for a social breakfast-even though Perelman was unshaven, carried no money, and would not talk business." - While I am(obviously) not very familiar with Jewish law, it is my understanding that shaving is one of the activities prohibited as 'work'.
- -From Stars of David, page 85: "He davens every morning with tefillin (...), keeps kosher, goes to Synagogue every Shabbat morning, and imports a Minyan when he's in the Caribbean." ... "On Friday nights, whenever the kids are around, we'll have dinner together," Perelman explains. "The girls will light the candles. We'll say the blessing over wine and bread. And then we'll have dinner and just hang around. And then Saturday, I let them do a lot of stuff, but there's a whole bunch of stuff they can't do and they know that." - He does not say so explicitly, but he strongly implies he observes the 39 categories of work.
- -Stars of David, page 86: "He keeps kosher at home, and his children have followed. "They're very aware of what they're eating. They'll ask a waiter what's in it. If they're having pasta at a restaurant, they'll ask, 'Is there any fish stock?' Even my nine-year-old will ask questions as to what's in it. After school, I'll say, 'What did you have for lunch?' She'll say, 'Well they served meatloaf, but I wasn't sure what was in it, so I didn't eat it.' Same with my twlve-year-old. Very aware. And aware of being respectful on shabbos." - More kosher stuff.
- If you still have your doubts, I can probably find a few more sources. Chris Croy 16:22, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
- Hi again Chris Coy: You cite his synagogue again, but that does not prove his or anyone's "Orthodoxy" or "orthodoxy" as many of those places often (unfortunately) function more as "clubs" (gathering points, watering holes, networking and bull-sessions) for some Jewish high and mighty than as spiritual centers of prayer and devotion and submssion to the ways of Judaism's true God. How do you know that he "strictly observes Shabbat"? What is your definition of observing Shabbat "strictly" and "keeping" a kosher home? Many Jews affiliated with Conservative Judaism also claim to do so, and they may even belong to Orthodox shulls at the same time, but it does not make them adherents of Orthodox Judaism. Perhaps the missing term in this discussion is "Conservadox"? Do you think that it may apply in this case? And oh, what's with the four wives? Is that part of being "stylishly Orthodox" too? And by the way, no-one alive today keeps the 613 Mitzvot as such. It's a number that has been arrived at by the rabbis and (a number of) which mitzvot are in it is disputed by the ancient sages. But being Shabbat-observant, defined as adhering to the 39 categories of work is a universal standard for deciding of true Orthodoxy. Can you WP:CITE some WP:SOURCES that prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that he is Orthodox? Not just hearsay and speculation based on "does he or doesn't he? only his hairdresser knows" type pseuo-reasoning that gets us nowhere! IZAK 09:27, 22 August 2007 (UTC)
- He strictly observes the Shabbat. I can't speak with authority about whether he observes all 613 of the Mitzvot. He does keep a kosher household, but I'm pretty sure there's not a businessman alive who observes #534-537. I don't know where I got it from, but in my notes I have written that he goes to the "Fifth Avenue Synagogue", which describes itself as Modern Orthodox. He also married at least his fourth wife there, possibly previous wives too. Chris Croy 05:40, 13 August 2007 (UTC)
Wow, Mr. Perelman does seem to be on the road to becoming a Baal teshuva. Your references do seem convincing that he is essentially (modern) Orthodox, but you can understand why I have had serious doubts. Mazel Tov! IZAK 17:05, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
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Rav Soloveitchik Image
- -Who has the copyright on the images of Rav Soloveitchik?
- -Am I allowed to print the image of him and frame it to put on my wall or is that prohibited?
Hebrew Bible-observance by Christians
I proposed to rename it to Hebrew Bible-observance by Christians--Java7837 13:42, 22 August 2007 (UTC)
Sorry, forgot to put a heading
Hi IZAK and thanks for your message. Just to explain: my interest is in the scholarly investigation of the Torah, whether this be source criticism, genre criticism, or other - in other words, I have no interest in the theology of the books. This isn't to denigrate those who do, just to clarify my own position.
I suggest you look at the Mosaic authorship article (which, I modestly add, I started myself, having failed to get anyone else to do it) - you might be able to lend a hand there. We've had some good input from a young Jewish chap calling himself Wolf-something, at least I get the impression he's young, but we could always use more contributors with detailed knowledge of Jewish tradition.
Cheers
Image:Nancy_and_Ronald_Reagan.jpg
I have tagged Image:Nancy_and_Ronald_Reagan.jpg as {{orphaned fairuse}}. In order for the image to be kept at Wikipedia, it must be included in at least one article. If this image is being used as a link target instead of displayed inline, please add {{not orphan}} to the image description page to prevent it being accidentally marked as orphaned again. Calliopejen1 07:40, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
Messianic Jewish theology redirect
You mentioned that (redirect to Messianic Judaism per ongoing discussion) is the reason to redirect Messianic Jewish theology to Messianic Judaism. The MJT article was created to simplify the MJ article and expand the theology section appropriately off the main MJ article which was ballooning. My question is, what "ongoing discussion" are you referring to that justifies a complete redirect of the page back to MJ? Am I missing something? inigmatus 19:17, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
Category
Hello there IZAK. I noticed you reverted my edit to Category:Messianic Judaism. Just wanted to let you know that the reason I added the category was to adhere WP:NPOV. Curious why you removed it? --Tλε Rαnδom Eδιτor (tαlk) 23:21, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
I deleted this page as an expired proposed deletion. The page was nominated for deletion (2007-07-31T02:52:52 . . PinchasC (Talk | contribs | block) (812 bytes) (prod)) and deleted 5 days later. As you are contesting this deletion, I am now restoring the page. Thank you, — xaosflux Talk 00:37, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
- Dear Xaosflux: Thank you for responding. Now things make sense! PinchasC (talk · contribs) is a well-known pro-Chabad editor and unfortunately in that area he is prone to follwo the Chabad-Lubavitch party line. They hate Rabbi Chaim Dov Keller because he has been one of the most outspoken critics of their controversial movement's messianist ideology. I am actually very sad that User:PinchasC prodded the article and will keep an eye out. You should proceed with caution and check with other editors in such cases when there may be the slighest doubt. Thanks again. IZAK 07:37, 26 August 2007 (UTC)
This is an automated message from CorenSearchBot. I have performed a web search with the contents of Yated Ne'eman (United States), and it appears to be a substantial copy of http://www.yated.com/. For legal reasons, we cannot accept copyrighted text or images borrowed from other web sites or printed material; such additions will be deleted. You may use external websites as a source of information, but not as a source of sentences.
This message was placed automatically, and it is possible that the bot is confused and found similarity where none actually exists. If that is the case, you can remove the tag from the article and it would be appreciated if you could drop a note on the maintainer's talk page. CorenSearchBot 11:08, 26 August 2007 (UTC)
I replied to the maintainer's talk page as follows:
Hi Coren: I received a message about "copyrighted" material on the new Yated Ne'eman (United States) I have just created. The joke is, that this newspaper does not publish on the web. All that I quoted in the article was the ONLY two lines on http://www.yated.com/ that offers readers an alternate option and indeed the Wikipedia article explains why that is so and what's behind it. Thus the copyright issue is not relevant and I am removing it. Thank you. IZAK 11:15, 26 August 2007 (UTC)
Anti-Zionism catogery
The Category in itself is very problematic and i would like to thank u for bringing it to the attention of the community. Lets face it there are orthodox Jewish sentiment against Zionism, they may be trivia and non worthy to write about, but as of now consensus has it that they are indeed important. (Thanks to their meeting with Acmadiniszhad.) So lets get to work a little harder, we must define it well and deal with it. I have stated to clean it up but i need your help. Thanks so much for your tiresome work here.--יודל 14:57, 28 August 2007 (UTC)
- IZAK, I have responded to your concerns on the talk page. Apparently you have simply ignored everything that I wrote. I made a whole list for you of groups which are virulently anti-Zionist and groups which are not. I have clearly written that I DO NOT intend on including groups such as the Litvaks, Ger, Belz, Sadigura, Boyan etc in the category. I have EXPLICITLY WRITTEN that. Please get new glasses or read what I read again. I feel insulted by your total disregard of what I wrote. --Eidah 11:14, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
- I just got a new prescription recently actually and the doctor told me my vision is now 20/20. What a joke, you "feel insulted" when you spend every second of your time on Wikipedia insulting every Jew or Jewish group or article that you don't like. Poor little maniac, should I shed some tears for you?! Oh, and I have left the following message on your talk page and I am still waiting for your response before I take further action against you: "Question: Are you a sock puppet of banned User:Daniel575? See also Category:Suspected Wikipedia sockpuppets of Daniel575. Please reply ASAP and explain why not and how you are different. Thank you." IZAK 11:27, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
Daniel
I replied on my talk page -- Y not? 03:42, 3 September 2007 (UTC)
- Hi Y: See my responses there too. IZAK 01:19, 4 September 2007 (UTC)
IZAK, Thanks for pointing this out. If there is a next time, suggest supplying specific quotes from the new sock side-by-side with quotes from known ones to make the similarity more explicit. The folks who make judgments about sockpuppet matters aren't familiar with his track record, so unfortunately it's just not true that "everyone" knows and we have to work with it. Best, --Shirahadasha 03:51, 5 September 2007 (UTC)
Haredim and Zionism
Please keep your eyes out on this article. user yidisheryid is trying to push his POV across and I've had to have the page protected twice already. Yossiea (talk) 15:12, 4 September 2007 (UTC)
- I also want to welcome u over there in that talk page, blocking is good trick to get the article prolonged but in the end we will have the best most NPOV there, looking forward for the collaboration on this topic as well, i was already a little board working with u only on those missionary articles. Who said celebration isn't delicious...--יודל 15:51, 4 September 2007 (UTC)
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Hi, there is currently a discussion about the notability of Rabbi Shraga Hager your insight on this would greatly be appreciated[3]. Have a beautiful day--יודל 13:10, 9 September 2007 (UTC)
your a doofus
I just noticed your blatant personal attack on [4] (which was later deleted by another reasonable editor who made the same point as you without lowering himself as you did) in your "comment" to my deletion vote, and your subtle personal attack on me when you voted. I, therefore, wish to respond. "Yeshivish" is my user name but it does not represent my ideology. I chose that user name because I thought it was cute. I have nothing against secular education. As a matter of fact, I probably have more higher degrees then you. I say that because you act in a boorish - hence uneducated - manner around WP. --Yeshivish 02:39, 12 September 2007 (UTC)
- Wait, a guy who claims to have multiple higher degrees just started a topic with the subject header "your a doofus"? I smirked. --tjstrf talk 02:51, 12 September 2007 (UTC)
Yeshivish: I just don't get how it's a "personal attack" when you call yourself "yeshivish"? IZAK 03:07, 12 September 2007 (UTC)
- I love his response, I had a good laugh. But wait, I'm taller than you are. ROFL--Shmaltz 03:09, 12 September 2007 (UTC)
- Very cute. Your sockpuppet Shmaltz coincidentally edited your user page two minutes after you did. I didn't know that you are such a great teacher and master that other people read your discussion page.--Yeshivish 04:17, 12 September 2007 (UTC)
- Completely uncalled for. I have IZAK's talk page watchlisted, as I do yours. Are accusing both of us of being sockpuppets of yourself? Comment on articles and content, Yeshivish, not editors. -- Avi 04:58, 12 September 2007 (UTC)
- Very cute. Your sockpuppet Shmaltz coincidentally edited your user page two minutes after you did. I didn't know that you are such a great teacher and master that other people read your discussion page.--Yeshivish 04:17, 12 September 2007 (UTC)
Wow this is getting better by the minute, so since you look foolish you found the easiest way out, accuse everyone of being sockpuppets. I like that. The first edit on my talk page was IZAK, and I have watched his talk page since.--Shmaltz 15:36, 12 September 2007 (UTC)
- Well, I am getting a little confused here. According to Yeshivish (talk · contribs) who are the "sockpuppets" here? On another note, seems that User:Yeshivish also spells in a truly yeshivish way, when in his opening words he accuses me of "your a doofus" which should have been written as "you're a doofus" as "your a doofus" makes no sense grammaticaly. Further, dufus is not such a "nice" word and is clearly a violation of WP:NPA. Has User:Yeshivish ever read WP:DICK? Now would be as good a time as any... IZAK 05:58, 17 September 2007 (UTC)
Hi IZAK. Going through this category, I noticed that several Rabbis do not appear to have been sorted properly (e.g. Meir ben Judah Leib Poppers is under "M"). As I have no idea about which part of the (long) names to sort by, I was hoping you could help. Thanks, Number 57 16:35, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
- Hi Number 57: Thank you for bringing this to my attention. I went through the entire list and wikified some names. But the names of rabbis from the Middle Ages and before the modern era begin with their first names, as surnames is a relatively recent historical phenomenon (after the Napoleonic era) and rabbis of the past, as with all Jews, did not have and were not known by the first names. Hope this helps. Best wishes, IZAK
- OK, Many thanks for looking into it, Number 57 20:08, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
Deletion sorting
Just so you know, we don't have to remove deleted articles manually anymore. That is what the bot: User:The wubbot does. Apparently, the bot also archives a list. SefringleTalk 20:58, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
- Thanks for letting me know. IZAK