User talk:Keith D/Archive 37

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Falkland Islands Units of Measure

Hi Keith

You revoked changes that I made to the article Falkland Islands on the pretext that you were aligning the text with MOSNUM. Would you please explain? MOSNUM states that metric units are usually used in UK-oriented articles, but in certain circumstances imperial units may be used [but are not mandatory] - miles may be used for distance. MOSNUM says nothing about areas, altitudes or height of vegetation, yet you revoked those. Why?

SI units are however the norm for Argentine-related articles. Given that there is a dispute between the UK and the Argentine over the Falkland Islands, is it not appropriate to use units of measure that are acceptable to both communities, is it not an expression of NPOV to use metric units?

I request that you revoke your changes. Martinvl (talk) 09:43, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

The Falkland Island articles have agreed their own convention on units as there was so many disputes and are set out Wikipedia:WikiProject South America/Falkland Islands work group/Units which is what I believe was in the article before you changed it. If there is a problem with this then take it up on the article talk page. Keith D (talk) 12:10, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

The Falkalnd Islands Group have not agreed on units - User:Khahstok (aka Pfainuk) - talk page at User talk:Kahastok and User:Wee Curry Monster imposed it on others, Both these editors have in the past been banned from the Gibralter project for disruptive editing. May I also draw to attention the page WP:FALKLANDSUNITS, written largely by Khahstok/Pfainuk - the first sentence is in my view text-book WP:SYN. Given the UK-Argentine dispute over the Falklands, you will see that this is also probably blatant WP:POV.

If you are of the view that this is a matter to be taken up on the relevant page, then please have the reinstate things how you found them before you walk away. Martinvl (talk) 12:21, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

I reverted your change from what was the stable version on units if you want to change from what was the stable version then discuss on the talk page of the article. Keith D (talk) 12:26, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

Will you be taking part in the debate or are you planning to just walk away? Martinvl (talk) 16:54, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

I have already commented at the MOS page do not want to split over several pages. Keith D (talk) 18:07, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

Howie Payne

A user is repeatedly removing referenced details from the Howie Payne] article, making false edit summaries claiming the details aren't referenced (when for instance there are 4 official references confirming the birth name spelling). Could you please take a look. Thanks. Also, I would point out that the article started out as a completely unreferenced PR styled article (and I believe that user may have been banned at the time), and it seems whoever was behind that now monitors the page and removes info they don't want on it regardless of how well referenced it is.

92.8.22.187 (talk) 11:54, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for the report. I have had to protect the page so that only registered auto-confirmed users can edit the page for the time being. Keith D (talk) 12:23, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

Hi Keith

I would like to protest the changes made by user 92.8.22.187 and subsequent locking of the page by yourself thus protecting his recent submissions. I have reverted the revisions made by this user several times due to lack of references and dubious POV submissions. The user was contacted and referred to previous talk message pages to point out & explain the issues with the revisions but despite this continued to revise the page without providing references for the changes submitted. As you have now locked the page with these incorrect/unreferenced submissions in place I would implore you to re evaluate the submissions made by user 92.8.22.187 and act accordingly.

I will go into detail here in the hope it may help resolve some the issues with the edits submitted by user 92.8.22.187:

• I see no reason to now have 4 references to support the spelling of a name that has not been contested. - One of which is a pay site and another that contains a personal address!
• The reference to Payne's involvement in The Stands (5) has been changed from a full length interview with Payne about The Stands in a national publication (Designer Magazine) to a review of a solo concert written 3 years after Payne's discontinuation of the group for a local fanzine that briefly introduces Payne as a former member of The Stands before reviewing a solo performance.
• Payne emigrating to US at age 13 - no reference to confirm this.
• Edgar Jones's commitment to Paul Weller being the reason for the break up of The Big Kids - No reference - Also Jones was no longer playing with Paul Weller at the time of The Big Kids break up (Winter 2001)
• The information regarding Pilgrim and Thomson's departure and the subsequent demise of the group as a result of this is wholly misleading - Pilgrim left The Stands in December - 2004 and was replaced by Graham Robinson in January 2005. The Stands then released the single Do It Like You Like which entered the UK to 40 at no 26 and was used on the worldwide Revlon London Look campaign featuring Kate Moss. The Stands then toured both the US with Brendon Benson and with Oasis on their European tour. Luke Thomson left The Stands in June 2005 http://www.gigwise.com/news/6615/Luke-Thomson-Leaves-The-Stands and was replaced by Paul Molloy.

The Stands released Horse Fabulous in July 2005 played Glastonbury - V Festival - T in the Park - an Oasis UK stadium tour - and a UK headline tour before Howie Payne's statement saying he was discontinuing The Stands in Nov 2005, a full 11 months after Pilgrims departure (almost as long as Pilgrim had been in the group) and 6 months after Thomson's departure. All of this information plus the fact that the bands label, Echo Records was dissolved by Chrysalis during August 2005 and the undoubted effect of this on The Stands is available on The Stands dedicated wiki page. To portray this as user 92.8.22.187 has done is totally misleading and not based in fact.

Regarding Payne's solo career user 92.8.22.187 has detailed Payne spending time in Texas and Los Angeles with neither relevance or reference. There is a further edit regarding Payne's name spelling and the submission implies there is a miss-spelling or changed spelling. As the only documents that are can decisively prove the spelling of a persons birth name are Birth Certificate and Passport, neither of which are provided here, I will reserve judgment on this; I do think however describing the spelling of Elliot (as here) as 'standard' is ridiculous. There are at least 4 popular spellings of the name Elliott/Elliot/Eliot/Eliott/Elyott, the most popular of which appears to be Elliott. I do not wish to appear to be pedantic regarding this but it is typical of the caviler way user 92.8.22.187 has applied vague guesswork and portrayed as fact in his/her editing of the page in question.

I hope that as a long standing contributor to wikipeidia you can see that my aim is to prevent this page becoming a false interpretations of events littered with unnecessary unreferenced/POV information.

The previous page edition 01:30, 25 November 2012 to which I have been reverting has correct referenced information and I believe is a suitable and proper representation of events as per the information available at this point.

Thank you for your attention to this matter. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.3.173.203 (talk • contribs) 17:47, 28 November 2012‎ (UTC)

One problem with the page that you are trying to revert to is the spelling of the middle name for which the 4 references support the spelling as given now, the one on his record label supports the one that you want to revert to. May be he used a slightly different spelling than his birth name for some reason but. The initial reference supports more than the name it also supports year of birth which keeps getting changed from 1970 to 1975 and its location. Keith D (talk) 18:34, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

The reference that you indicate was removed actually is still in the article at a later point. I have added a second use of the reference where it was but do not think that that is really a disputed point. Keith D (talk) 18:48, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

Hi Keith Thanks for looking into this, although the page I am reverting to has the same date of birth as current 1970, and the spelling of the name is the same (Elliot). Also this does not adress any of the clearly inaccurate/misleading information on the now locked page. Here is the page version that that I am reverting to - http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Howie_Payne&oldid=524731095 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.3.173.203 (talk) 19:02, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

I have remove age 13 and Queens reference as not supported - have changed it to just teenage in New York as that is mentioned in the reference. The rest needs clarification as it is difficult to untangle what you are trying to say. Keith D (talk) 19:07, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

My point is the current page contains unreferenced POV or misleading material such as - The use of a site (Director Check) as a reference source that appears to contain a private residential address. (neither POV or misleading but surely irresponsible & unnecessary). The Big Kids splitting up being attributed to Edgar Jones's lack of commitment due to his being in Paul Weller's band. This is unreferenced and as such reads as a POV statement. That Payne's discontinuation of The Stands was a direct result of either Pilgrim or Thomson leaving the band (as implied) or the statement that Payne & & Ravera were left to recruit new members in order to fulfil touring and promotional commitments for the album. Pilgrims departure was a full 6 months earlier that Thomson's & following these departures The Stands released two singles, an LP and toured the UK, Europe & USA for a further 11 months.The current article implies Payne & Ravera were left to draft in replacement members to fulfil ongoing commitments only to split up once said commitments had been fulfilled. This is clearly a misleading summation of events and in no way corresponds with the clearly referenced information on the The Stands dedicated Wikipediea page. That Payne spent time in Los Angeles & Texas prior to recording the LP Bright Light Ballads is not referenced or of any apparent relevance and reads like a press release. That the name Elliot spelled with two L's and one T is a " the standard" spelling of that name. The Wikipedia article related to the name Elliot gives several accepted spellings and singles none out as "standard" or most used.

I hope this is clear and you can see fit to deal with and correct the issues mentioned.

Thanks Keith — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.3.173.203 (talk) 23:46, 28 November 2012 (UTC)

Hi Keith

I appreciate the improvements you have made to this page in regards to the issues outlined in my previous message and think on the whole the page is much better. The information regarding The Stands however could still be improved as it is still misleading.

The album All Years Leaving was produced by Payne - self produced, as used suggests it was self produced by The Stands The album Horse Fabulous was produced by Tom Rothrock Although Pilgrim's departure was directly after the recording of Horse Fabulous, Thomson's was not. Thomson's departure was some 6 months later; after subsequent tours of the UK, US and Europe, and the release of the single "Do It Like You Like". http://www.gigwise.com/news/6615/Luke-Thomson-Leaves-The-Stands The statement - Following the changes in band personnel, the band announced their split in November 2005 - while technically accurate, is not a true representation of events. Just as the statement - following the departure of Bonehead and Guigsy Oasis announced their split - is true but not a true representation of events. The Stands did not announce their split in Nov 05, rather Payne announced his discontinuation of The Stands. The NME headline in the article referenced says this but Payne's statement within the referenced article clearly does not. This is two completely different courses action and the page should reflect this.

Once again thanks for your input, attention and help in improving this page. I'm sure you will see fit to deal accordingly with the issues mentioned.

Thanks Keith 80.3.173.203 (talk) 14:38, 29 November 2012 (UTC)

WikiProject Yorkshire Newsletter - December 2012

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Andy McDonald (politician)

Hi there,

Thanks for finding the ward which AM represented. Do you want to be a co-nom/co-author for the DYK? In which case is there anything you want to add to the article before we go for it? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Peter cohen (talk • contribs) 15:15, 1 December 2012‎ (UTC)

Can do if you do not want to take all of the glory. You need to have a look at Headway which goes to a dab page, there is nothing on the dab page but it indicates see Headway Devon. May be a redirect to the Devon article may suffice. Keith D (talk) 18:11, 1 December 2012 (UTC)

The speed with which you replaced my one sentence starting version of the article made me think that you were already working on it when I started the article. I therefore think it is only polite to offer you a co-credit. As for Headway, I opted for the redirect page as what struck me as the least bad choice given I wasn't prepared to create an article on Headway at the time.--Peter cohen (talk) 23:23, 1 December 2012 (UTC)

Yes I was working on it and got an edit conflict when I tried to save it. Keith D (talk) 23:25, 1 December 2012 (UTC)

I've now done the DYK nom with you as co-author. I mucked up the template and it doesn't show as a self-nom but I think I'm meant to do a review of someone else's DYK nomination. I actually have some paid proof-reading to do which should be higher up my priority list. I'll think about the review some other time.--Peter cohen (talk) 00:47, 2 December 2012 (UTC)

Sheff Station

Sorry about leaving the user template, I was meant to remove it when I reverted SheffieldPosh's edits. Thanks for noticing it and removing it. Captain Scarlet and the Mysterons 13:01, 3 December 2012 (UTC)

Marquis de la Eirron

That account you found a wee while ago seems to be editing - all of the usual places, including "offical" images with wdtk "permissions" - might want to take a look - Priti MP. Blue Square Thing (talk) 13:00, 5 December 2012 (UTC)

Walton, Wakefield

Hi Keith, thanks for correcting my mistakes, it's my first day editing Wikipedia so I have lots to learn.
Thanks again,
Liam.
TenzingClimbedMountains (talk) 16:29, 7 December 2012 (UTC)

Hull

Hello Keith, just saw your page. Are you another fellow Hull / ERY resident? --Adamlonsdale (talk) 22:04, 10 December 2012 (UTC)

An ex resident of Hull I now live in Coventry though visit regularly. Keith D (talk) 22:53, 10 December 2012 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for your comment and support for Grade I listed churches in Lancashire which made it to FL. It's Cumbria next! --Peter I. Vardy (talk) 15:00, 15 December 2012 (UTC)

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