Marshalb
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Battle of Albuera
editHi Marshalb,
Re your changes to Battle of Albuera: I reverted your edits (don't panic yet!), because you broke a reference, and also contradicted a couple of cited sources in places. However, having done the revert, I went back through and re-applied the changes I agree were corrections to the previous version (Soult's name, timing of 4th division coming up from Badajoz, and Kemmis being stranded). BTW, Sherer is referred to as either Joseph or Moyle Sherer, but I once dug out his memoirs, and his name was actually Joseph Moyle Sherer :)
The one thing I'm still uncertain about is Lumley taking Long's position as commander of the Allied cavalry. Oman is pretty explicit that Beresford replaced Long with Lumley as a result of Long's hasty retreat from the French cavalry. Yes, Lumley was senior to Long, but at the time Lumley had command of an infantry brigade in 2nd Division – he was a former light dragoon, so had experience of commanding horse. You, however, changed the article to suggest this was an agreed-upon plan, and I'm afraid I'd want a source for that suggestion, since it contradicts what Oman says. Have you such a source? Perhaps I should check Fortescue too, since he was much more in favour of Long than Oman was (Fortescue largely following Napier's account of the battle).
Thoughts, opinions, discussions always welcome. Carre (talk) 21:24, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
- Ah, having checked Fortescue, I see where you get the Long/Lumley change from. That's interesting. Fortescue cites a couple of d'Urban's letters for his account – I'll see if I can find those letters, and if they check out, will apply that change to the article (with citation) then.
- Thanks for the corrections to the article, anyway! Such editing is good to see (although you need to be careful not to break stuff that's already referenced). Carre (talk) 21:44, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
Hi Carre
I just found this post by you on my Talk Page after leaving a post for you on your page. As I said, I am not very familiar with the workings of Wikipedia, but I think it is very odd to conduct a correspondence by means of "edits" to Talk Pages.
Marshalb (talk) 23:32, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
- Hello again,
- Got your note – if you check the article now, the Long/Lumley thing is discussed more completely, with both versions reported by historians covered (by the way, Fortescue supports the version that the replacement was due to seniority).
- On sources, I'm not too trusting of d'Urban, for the simple reason that Oman et al use d'Urban letters to support the "incompetent" reason for the replacement, while Fortescue et al ALSO use d'Urban letters to support the other view. However, since we have 4 sources supporting "seniority" (d'Urban, Long, Fortescue and Fletcher), and another 4-5 supporting "incompetent" (d'Urban, Napier, Oman, Weller, Glover), it was worth putting in both views with the note that historians differ. Primary sources are generally frowned on, because it's too easy to fall into Original Research, but in this case there's plenty of secondary sources too.
- The bit about Lumley not arriving until late is still up in the air, to an extent, since several sources are quite explicit about him being in command of an infantry brigade in 2nd Division, until taking command of the cavalry, but this is probably too much detail for the article.
- As to the "best" way to communicate changes like this: normally, you do exactly what you did, and just edit the page. The only time it becomes necessary to communicate via talk pages is when there's disagreement in the content, as was the case here. The best way to go about it then is to use the article's own talk page, rather than an editor's (see Talk:Battle of Albuera, the discussion on this matter is in there).
- Anyway, I think all your major changes are now incorporated in the article, although in a slightly different way, so thanks for pointing out the mistakes :) Carre (talk) 08:59, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
It has nothing to do with who was first, and everything to do with being fair to the sources: historians have been arguing about Long's contribution to the battle and the causes for his dismissal for nearly 200 years and it doesn't matter how many new books come out on one side or the other, Wikipedia's job is to present both sides and let the reader decide. You are welcome to add new information and sources to the article provided they are sympathetic to the articles structure and prose, but to not make wholesale deletions of sourced material that you or your source happen to disagree with. Thanks--Jackyd101 (talk) 20:56, 14 February 2009 (UTC)
The current text about the Long replacement suggests that no one knows exactly how and why Long was removed. The new book by Dempsey provides the facts, which are that Wellington sent Long a letter on May 11 notifying him he was being removed from command but could retain his position until the replacement arrived. Long next sent Beresford a letter complaining about the seniority issue on May 13, and Beresford replied on the 14th that he was puting Lumley in charge. The fact that Lumley did not arrive at Albuera until the morning of the 16th is confirmed by other primary sources cited. That being the case, the speculative text in the article is unneccessary, even though footnoted, because it is specualation about matters which are now knowable as facts, not speculation. --Marshalb (talk) 21:12, 14 February 2009 (UTC)
- It is not unnecessary: quite apart from the importance of representing all viewpoints mentioned above, it is also important that wikipedia reflects other sources. For example, the Oxford Dictionary of National Biography is scathing on Long, accusing him on one occassion of losing "his head completely". Wikipedia should not blindly contradict such sources (nor should it follow them without qualification). Instead, it should acknowledge them all and provide evidence and context for the contrasting viewpoints so as the explain the discrepancies between the source material to readers. I have to add moreover that the evidence as you have described it above seems far from compelling and there will no doubt be further debate on the subject, so to remove earlier scholarship on the grounds that it has now been "superseeded" is probably unwise.--Jackyd101 (talk) 00:19, 15 February 2009 (UTC)
May 2009
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Constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, but a recent edit of yours to the article Battle of Albuera has an edit summary that appears to be inaccurate or inappropriate. Please use edit summaries that accurately tell other editors what you did, and feel free to use the sandbox for any tests you may want to do. Thank you. EyeSerenetalk 07:23, 6 May 2009 (UTC)
Re Albuera
editYou'll see from the edit history that the edit where you use the summary "Added description of Albuera terrain" contains nothing relating to the Albuera terrain (diff). I've deleted nothing from the edit history - although I'm an administrator, only those editors with the additional oversight permission (which I don't have) can do this, and then only in certain circumstances. Thus you seemed to me to be using a deliberately misleading edit summary to get your preferred version of Long's replacement back into the article as the canonical version. It has already been explained to you why this is problematic - when sources disagree, per Wikipedia editing policy we are not permitted to select a preferred version but should present all versions with appropriate weight and leave the reader to make up their own mind.
If there has been some problem with the software or you accidentally missed an edit and didn't save what you thought you did, then I sincerely apologise for my assumption; please disregard the above notice. However, please also stop trying to change the emphasis in that section to support one interpretation over another. You have failed to gain a consensus for your edits there, so continually reinserting them will be seen as disruptive editing. There are methods listed here that may be helpful in resolving content disputes. EyeSerenetalk 07:31, 8 May 2009 (UTC)
Eyeserene,
The edits I could not find have appeared, so thank you for that. However, I don't think you looked at what I did very closely since there is a long paragraph about the Albuera terrain in my May 6 edit. If your argument is that my title was misleading, you are incorrect and should have the courtesy to restore that material.
As for your other point about the Long controversy, I have explained over and over again that I am not attempting to "change the emphasis" or foster a particular interpretation. I am simply trying to correct the incorrect statement that Lumley superseded Long on May 15. (There may be some confusion because I did initially take issue with the reason why Long was replaced as well as the timing of the replacement. However, in response to the comments posted, I tried this last time to correct the factual point only and leave the details of the other controversy in the article.) I have posted specific cites and other information to support the correct facts and neither you nor anyone else has made the slightest attempt to refute that material. Why is this so hard? If you have evidence that Lumley replaced Long on the 15th, we could call it a controversy and leave it as an open question. If you and others do not have that evidence, why should you want to prevent the correction from being made?
Marshalb (talk) 04:19, 9 May 2009 (UTC)
- You're right, I overlooked the entire terrain paragraph :P Restored with my apologies! EyeSerenetalk 07:26, 11 May 2009 (UTC)
Marshalb (block log • active blocks • global blocks • contribs • deleted contribs • filter log • creation log • change block settings • unblock • checkuser (log))
Request reason:
I don't have multiple accounts. Do you have any sense of how bizarre and user-unfriendly this procedure for unblocking an account blocked in error appears to someone like me who is not an active user of Wikipedia? Marshalb (talk) 17:51, 12 January 2011 (UTC)
Accept reason:
I have exempted your IP from the rangeblock, you should be able to edit normally now. Elen of the Roads (talk) 19:39, 12 January 2011 (UTC)
July 2020
edit
{{unblock|reason=Your reason here ~~~~}}. Nick-D (talk) 10:36, 31 July 2020 (UTC)
Marshalb (block log • active blocks • global blocks • contribs • deleted contribs • filter log • creation log • change block settings • unblock • checkuser (log))
Request reason:
I have been blocked for using multiple accounts. I only have one Wikipedia account and have never had any others. Editors should not be allowed to create blocks without having a legitimate basis for doing so. This is the second time this has happened to me without explanation. If there is something I am doing which inadvertently triggers this reaction, please let me know what that is. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Marshalb (talk • contribs) 15:16, 29 September 2020 (UTC)
Decline reason:
In Special:Diff/980973940, this account attempted to contest a block on User talk:Snagemit, despite this account not being blocked at the time. Your comment included the words: "...I made bold edits to the Albuera article to correct factual errors." Both this account (Special:Diff/968497616) and Snagemit (Special:Diff/968516339) edited the Battle of Albuera article within just over two hours of each other, which makes Snagemit an illegitimate sockpuppet of this account. — Newslinger talk 09:52, 30 September 2020 (UTC)
If you want to make any further unblock requests, please read the guide to appealing blocks first, then use the {{unblock}} template again. If you make too many unconvincing or disruptive unblock requests, you may be prevented from editing this page until your block has expired. Do not remove this unblock review while you are blocked.
- Hi, would you care to explain this then? Ed talk! 17:56, 29 September 2020 (UTC)
Marshalb (block log • active blocks • global blocks • contribs • deleted contribs • filter log • creation log • change block settings • unblock • checkuser (log))
Request reason:
I do not have another account. I have seen the name Snagemit in the edit history page and I thought that Snagemit was the editor that imposed a block on me, which is the reason I wrote something on Snagemit's talk page. The editorial process of Wikipedia is Kafka-esque, with a strong dose of guilty until proven innocent with no way of providing evidences of the latter.
Decline reason:
The edit in question, Special:Diff/969914132, predates your block on this account. The explanation provided here is thus obviously inadequate. signed, Rosguill talk 19:36, 13 October 2020 (UTC)
If you want to make any further unblock requests, please read the guide to appealing blocks first, then use the {{unblock}} template again. If you make too many unconvincing or disruptive unblock requests, you may be prevented from editing this page until your block has expired. Do not remove this unblock review while you are blocked.
- This account had never been blocked, so that's an obvious lie. Nick-D (talk) 11:06, 1 October 2020 (UTC)
Appeal
edit Marshalb (block log • active blocks • global blocks • contribs • deleted contribs • filter log • creation log • change block settings • unblock • checkuser (log))
Request reason:
I appealed this indefinite block and was given an appeal No. f7be696fa1e6b58160db87b99c8eabce. Is there a way to check the progress of the appeal? Also, I learned today for the firt time that you have a tool called "checkuser" that can identify IP addresses. If you use that tool you will see that there is not connection between me and Snagemit except for the post I made to Snagemit's Talk page when I thought Snagemit was an editor who had blocked me. There is no other connection between me and Snagemit.Marshalb (talk) 16:11, 31 March 2021 (UTC)
Decline reason:
Checkuser will be no help here, as you know perfectly well (see Wikipedia:Sockpuppet_investigations/Marshalb/Archive). You've provided no coherent explanation for your outing of yourself as a sockpuppet, so I'm declining this request. Yamla (talk) 10:52, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
If you want to make any further unblock requests, please read the guide to appealing blocks first, then use the {{unblock}} template again. If you make too many unconvincing or disruptive unblock requests, you may be prevented from editing this page until your block has expired. Do not remove this unblock review while you are blocked.
Marshalb (block log • active blocks • global blocks • contribs • deleted contribs • filter log • creation log • change block settings • unblock • checkuser (log))
Request reason:
Thank you Yamla for responding. I don't know how to provide a more "coherent" explanation of "outing myself" because what I have written is the factual truth. Wikipedia is so confusing that I formed the impression from things I saw on the Albuera discussion page the Snagemit was an editor who had blocked my account. What I wrote on Snagemit's talk page was an appeal to Snagemit to lift the block on me. (Please re-read my post from that perspective.) Due to that one mistake, I have been effectively banned from contributing to Wikipedia. I was also completely unaware of the checkuser discussion you referred me, so your sarcastic comment is inappropriate. How would I ever have know about that? (People such as yourself who are Wikipedia experts seem to have forgotten that the way it works is not that obvious to non-experts.) I don't see any information in that discussion that shows any other connection between me and Snagemit except for my unfortunate post on his or her talk page, which I have already explained. If I really was a sockpuppet master, I would know enough about Wikipedia to avoid posting on my puppet's page.Marshalb (talk) 23:57, 1 April 2021 (UTC)
Decline reason:
This is getting ridiculous. Your account was not blocked, so you had reason to post about blocks. Since we're going around in circles here, I'm revoking your talk page access. NinjaRobotPirate (talk) 03:29, 6 April 2021 (UTC)
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