User talk:Rajat Ghai/Archive-1

March 15, 2006 to July 22, 2006

This is an archive. Please do not edit it. Use User talk:Rajat Ghai instead.

Archives: 1 | 2

Welcome to Wikipedia!!!

Hello Rajat Ghai/Archive-1! Welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. If you decide that you need help, check out Wikipedia:Where to ask a question, ask me on my talk page, or place {{helpme}} on your talk page and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions. Please remember to sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. Below are some recommended guidelines to facilitate your involvement. Happy Editing! Kukini 15:36, 24 April 2006 (UTC) Getting Started Wikipedia Tutorial How to edit a page The five pillars of Wikipedia Manual of Style Be bold in editing How to write a great article WikiProjects Getting your info out there Cite your sources Neutral Point of View Point of View Verifiability Uploading images Image use policy Getting more Wikipedia rules Policy Library Getting Help New contributors' help page Where to ask a question Help Desk Frequently Asked Questions Getting along Wikiquette Civility Sign your posts Wikipedians Conflict resolution Getting technical Pages needing attention Peer review Utilities Village pump

Recent Page Moves

Hi,

I see you've moved some of the Patna Sahib, Keshgarh Sahib, Hazur Sahib and Damdama Sahib. I moved these earlier because I felt "Takht Sri" was superfluous and unnecessary. Please do explain your reasons for moving it back. Thanks. Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 23:59, 28 April 2006 (UTC)

Image Tagging Image:Gandhi(new).jpg

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Some advise

I see that you have added a box to many pages related to castes. This is on the whole unwise, because it requires us to define in two words the social and hierarchical status of the caste. This is not always clear-cut and is often a topic of dispute. The ready information thus made available on Wikipedia will possibly be incorrect and will often be a fruitful source of discord. Please help to preserve amity on Wikipedia by not adding the box. Hope you understand. Thank you.

Do take a look at Template:India tasks, which contains a list of work that Indians would be interested in. I am sure you will do a wonderful job on Wikipedia with any of those. Regards, ImpuMozhi 23:09, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

Welcome!

Hi,

I've been watching your contributions to some of the pages on Wikipedia and I'm impressed. Rama's Arrow and I are currently working on the mess that is the Sikhism article to get it up to featured article status. Please take a look, and make your comments on the talk page. Thanks very much! Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 22:35, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

It might not have been your intent, but you recently removed content from Gujjar. Please be careful not to remove content from Wikipedia without a valid reason, which you should specify in the edit summary or on the article's talk page. Thank you. A link to the edit I have reverted can be found here: link. If you believe this edit should not have been reverted, please contact me. AmiDaniel (talk) 08:42, 26 May 2006 (UTC) Not vandalism, warning removed. AmiDaniel (talk) 09:20, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

My apologies for taking so long to get back to you; I was in the middle of fending off an onslaught while waiting for an administrator to intervene. Anyway, in looking over the edit again and your other contributions to the page, I agree that the edit was not remotely in bad-faith and have thus removed the warning from your talk page. In the future, please try to use edit summaries as they alert others of what changes you've made to the page and why, and doing so will help to prevent your edits from being mistakenly reverted as such. Again, sorry about this, and please keep up the good work! If you need help with anything, feel free to contact me. AmiDaniel (talk) 09:20, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

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Sikhism

Hi, I was wondering if you go my message about the article Sikhism? Thanks. Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 01:18, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

Hi, I've replied on my talk page. Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 23:13, 29 May 2006 (UTC)

Hi again

I see that your main interest lies in matters of caste and community. In that case, you will be able to appreciate better than most people the point I tried to make in my previous message to you. I request you once again, in the interests both of amity and of preventing the dissemination of misinformation via Wikipedia, to refrain from adding the box to various pages. I would in fact urge you to remove the box from pages where it is already placed by you. Thank you. ImpuMozhi 19:55, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

Reply

Hullo, sir. You are right in saying that I am interested mostly in matters of caste and community. However, in no way am I trying to cause caste or community wars on this site.

Rajat, I never said you were!

Look at the page, Khatri. It has been vandalised so many times, even before I placed the box there. Its talk page continues to be a battlefield. Surely, I am not responsible for all that.

Perhaps not, but the dispute is precisely about their caste identity. In the midst of the argument, you inserted the box blandly stating that the Khatris are Kshatriyas. They may well be, but that is what the ongoing argument is about. That argument illustrates precisely the points that I made to you in my previous two messages.

As for your castigation, well I agree with you.

I cannot imagine what word or phrase used in my previous two messages can be construed as being "castigation". Do let me know.

It is my mistake that I started editing on this site when I should'nt have....From now on, I will just read and not edit.

We have a saying in Telugu, related to bringing up children: Uppu veste pappu aya, paalu veste payasam aya. If you put salt in the boiling moong, you have daal; if you put milk, you have kheer. What you make of my advise depends largely upon you. What I intended was to help you edit better, not give up editing. If you choose to persevere on Wikipedia, you may grow to understand the tone and caution suitable to writing an encyclopaedic piece, grow to leaven energy with circumspection, to appreciate nuance, perhaps -- ahem -- even to accept well-meant advise. These are among the real benefits of being part of Wikipedia society. What it takes away is a whole lot of your time! I understand exactly what you mean about WP being an addiction. It can interfere with your work to an alarming extent, and make you think that you had better put an end to it. In that sense, should you choose to depart, I totally understand and respect that resolve. ImpuMozhi 04:16, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

Invitation and Recommendations for writing articles on Hindi Wikipedia

Hindi wikipedia invites and welcomes Wikipedians to contribute for the cause of spreading knowledge and the Hindi language. This page contains guidelines for writing a wiki-article on any topic at the Hindi Wikipedia, with special recommendations for writing in Hindi (Note: The script/font-family for Hindi is Devanāgari; the script/font-system for English is Roman script, also, the Hindi spelling system is not completely standardized). This article is yet in English language (mostly), in order to encourage even non-native/foreign people who have learnt/are learning Hindi to contribute to the Hindi wikipedia, and native Hindi speakers who normally write in English. The examples given below are only for explanation.

Recommendations:

1. Firstly for proper viewing, it is recommended to keep all links NOT-UNDERLINED. Otherwise the मात्रा below the Hindi alphabets might get partly hidden behind the underlines. For this, please go to My Preferences (मेरी पसंद) at the top of the page, then click Misc., and then choose "underline links -> Never". Save your settings. Also, do not click yes for "justify paragraphs", otherwise on some browsers, the devanagari script will appear highly distorted.
2. All users are requested and encouraged to contribute articles here, especially, to create new articles on general topics. They are also encouraged to expand the existing articles, and improve upon them. A non-user can also do the same; it is recommended but not required to register yourself as a wikipedian user at the Hindi wikipedia. As far as possible, each article should be written with a Neutral Point of View (NPOV)—no nationalistic or partiality or hatred based articles are welcome. The articles should be based on facts—and appropriate references should be provided as and where needed. See the English wiki's help page for editing in general. Almost all the general wiki-features are available for editing on Hindi wiki too. Guidelines for the content matter is mostly the same as given in English wiki.
3. Since the Hindi wiki is at its initial stages, users are welcome to take introduction and basic points from the English (or another) wikipedia's corresponding article and translate them for small articles. An in-page link to the English wiki's article will be deemed sufficient for references (a template might be created stating this). For longer articles, it is recommended to mention the references separately.
4. Since most computer users in India and elsewhere have the standard Western-type keyboard, it is best recommended (but not necessarily required) to use the virtual (software) keyboard like the one of Hindimozhi or of ISIS (Tavultesoft Keyman)—which are freewares. These are advantageous because the contemporary Hindi-speakers in India often write messages/chat using Hindi words but written in Roman (English) script, and the layout of these keyboards is quite the same that such people use. For example, using the "normal" keyboard with this software, typing ga would give ग and ghaa would give घा.
5. Create the article with its name written in Hindi (devanagari script). Always take care to include the nukta (dot below) for foreign / Urdu loanwords wherever it occurs in the standard spelling. For non-Indian names, use that spelling (for article name and other words) which is commonly encountered in Hindi newspapers, G.K.-books, Hindi-dubbed TV documentaries and Hollywood films and magazines. e.g., America-अमरीका (या अमेरिका), China-चीन, French-फ़्रांसिसी. For English acronyms/short-forms, use the initials in Roman script, and again create a full form in Hindi and redirect it to the short form. e.g. IPA (अन्तर्राष्ट्रीय ध्वनि वर्णाक्षर); UNO (संयुक्त राष्ट्र संघ). Doing the opposite is also fine. But creating the article with the Hindi short form, as सं०रा०सं०, is not recommended. Also, the article proper must be written with the proper nukta, as फ़ारसी, and then, a non-nukta (mis-)spelt version फारसी should preferably be created to redirect to the correct spelling.
6. Hindi wikipedia strongly recommends the users to write articles in everyday common Hindi in the खड़ीबोली dialect (Hindustani or Hindi-Urdu, i.e., बोलचाल वाली हिन्दी, which may include many loanwords from Persian and Arabic). The use of शुद्ध संस्कृतनिष्ठ हिन्दी is in general neither required nor recommended. E.g., use: वजह instead of कारण, ख़ास instead of विशेष, वगैरह instead of इत्यादि, लेकिन instead of परन्तु etc. However, for technical and specialized vocabulary, the use of शुद्ध संस्कृतनिष्ठ हिन्दी is recommended and usually mandatory. Thus: upper House of Parliament—संसद का उच्च सदन, but not Urdu—मजिलिस का ऐवान-ए-बाला ; Foreign Minister—विदेशमन्त्री, but not Urdu—वज़ीर-ए-ख़ारिजा ; knowledge/science—ज्ञान/विज्ञान, but not इल्म. Use spoken Hindi's ये and वो instead of यह and वह / वे. Do not use the title of respect जी after names, it is unencyclopedic. Thus: कृष्ण / श्री कृष्ण but not कृष्ण जी. Use the आप form and its corresponding 3rd person verbal conjugation for writing about respectable persons. Thus: श्री वाजपेयी मध्य प्रदेश में जन्मे थे. But not: वाजपेयी मध्य प्रदेश में जन्मा था. But do not use the pronoun "आप" itself in-text in biographies.
7. English should be used sparingly, only when required; i.e., if the corresponding शुद्ध हिन्दी word is too "difficult and not generally encountered", or if it is a proper name of non-Indian person/place/terminology/title, or if the user is highly unsure of the proper translation. It is recommended (but not required) for English-to-Hindi translation while writing articles, the Shabdkosh online dictionary should be used. For each English word, that alternative should be used which is generally encountered in everyday spoken Hindi, and also fits well into the context. Use of intelligent guesses for newly encountered words is also allowed, and so are translations encountered in Hindi-dubbed TV documentaries, Hollywood films, Hindi-translated books, etc. e.g., दमपिशाच for en:Dementor (used in dubbed HP films).
8. If used, it is recommended to use the English words within the articles using the English (Roman) alphabets rather than devanagari (or better, the devanagari transliteration should be used in the sentence, followed by the English word in Roman alphabet in parentheses). Such words should be italicized and not put in quotation marks. Preferably, there should be an in-page interwiki link (like :en:) on the word to the English wikipedia. If the word comes as an integral part of a sentence, so as not to break the continuity, the en: prefix should be hidden by writing the word again after the pipe sign (piped link). Thus, recommended: हैरी पॉटर ने ''[[:en:Pensieve|Pensieve]]'' के अन्दर ''[[:en:Little Hangleton|Little Hangleton]]'' गाँव में लॉर्ड वोल्डेमॉर्ट की माँ ''[[:en:Merope Gaunt|Merope Gaunt]]'' को देखा. ''[[:en:Resplendent Quetzal|Resplendent Quetzal]]'' पक्षी के ऊपर एक मेक्सिकन पादरी डा० ''[[:en:Pablo de la Llave|Pablo de la Llave]]'' ने काफ़ी शोध किया था. Whence,
   • हैरी पॉटर ने Pensieve के अन्दर Little Hangleton गाँव में लॉर्ड वोल्डेमॉर्ट की माँ Merope Gaunt को देखा
   • Resplendent Quetzal पक्षी के ऊपर एक मेक्सिकन पादरी डा० Pablo de la Llave ने काफ़ी शोध किया था
9. Always start the first 1 or 2 lines of the article giving its definition (from any standard dictionary/other wiki) or suitable introduction. Thus, recommended: ललिता सहस्रनामन हिन्दू धर्मसुधारक आदि शंकराचार्य द्वारा रचित देवी दुर्गा को समर्पित एक पूजा-मन्त्र है, जिसे कई हिन्दू रोज़ श्रद्धा से जपते हैं । But not: ललिता सहस्रनामन मन्त्र जपने के लिये लड्डू-पेड़ा, ताम्बुल, सिन्दूर, लाल चुनरी के साथ नित्य इस मन्त्र का पाठ करें, तो जल्द ही गड़ा हुआ ख़जाना मिलेगा । Recommended: वैमानिक अभियान्त्रिकी (en:Aeronautical engineering) विमानों (en:Aircrafts) की अभिकल्पना, निर्माण और प्रचालन करने का विज्ञान, कला और कार्य है । (translated from Eng. Webster's New World Dictionary). But not: आजकल वैमानिक अभियान्त्रिकी के लिये देशभर में कई कॉलेज खुल गये हैं, जिनमें अग्रणी स्थान यूटोपिया स्थित लालू-यादव टेक्लिनक कॉलेज का है ।
10. For names of countries, cities, places, languages, people, books, films, technical vocabulary, mythology, etc, start the article like this:
    • 1. The name in bold ('''अपोलो''')
    • 2. starting parenthesis, then English name in Roman script, in-page interwiki-linked to English wiki ff. by semicolon ((अंग्रेज़ी : [[:en:Apollo]];)
    • 3. The native name(s) if applicable in the italicized native script, preferably followed either by its italicized approximate Hindi pronunciation or non-italicized phonological transcription within / /, ff. by closed parenthesis (यूनानी : ''Aπollων अपोल्लोन''))
    • 4. the rest of the definition or introduction (प्राचीन [[यूनानी धर्म]] (ग्रीक धर्म) और प्राचीन [[रोमन धर्म]] के सर्वोच्च देवता थे ।) For country names, only the standard short form of the name is needed in the first line. If there is a common name for a difficult word in Hindustani, also mention it. Whence: अपोलो (अंग्रेज़ी : en:Apollo; यूनानी : Aπollων अपोल्लोन) प्राचीन यूनानी धर्म (ग्रीक धर्म) और प्राचीन रोमन धर्म के सर्वोच्च देवता थे । If you don't give the interwiki English/another language link (which would be deemed to be the default reference), then you MUST provide an appropriate reference.
11. Please leave no article without an appropriate category. See the list of created categories here; you can also make a new category (pref. in Hindi). Please leave no article without at least ONE off page (like en:) interwiki link. E.g., the user can check the article name (say Apollo) on the finally redirected English page and append to the Hindi article ([[en:Appolo]])). These interlanguage links will help a bot to update all interwiki links for that article in all wikipedias. The category and the aforementioned link should be typed at the end of the article. If the article is very small, mention it as a stub/substub.
12. Use of templates is welcome. See the list of templates here. If creating a template, name it pref. in Hindi.
13. Use पूर्णविराम ( । ) instead of a period (.) for ending statements. The पूर्णविराम, semicolon, colon and dash (but not comma) must come after one space after the word to prevent ambiguity. Use the international form of the Hindu-Arabic numerals (1,2,3 instead of १,२,३), as used by the Constitution and the Government of India (even for Hindi). There is no need to use the हलन्त at the end of Sanskrit words wherever it occurs. Hence, prefer: संसद over संसद्; अथर्वन over अथर्वन्. Use the proper quotation marks “” from the Insert toolbox, not "". Write dates as 2 मई 2006 (ईसवी or ईसापूर्व). Write time as 3:45 pm. Separate common suffix-words like शास्त्र, विज्ञान, ज्ञान with a hyphen. Thus: रसायन-शास्त्र. For most others, leave both the words of the noun-cluster free. Combine them into one word only if it is very common to do so. Thus: सामवेद.
14. The use of ज़ for the en:voiced alveolar fricative (/z/, as in zoo, rose) is fundamentally wrong. Its nearest counterpart is the en:voiceless alveolar fricative /s/ (as in sea), and not Hindi ज (en:voiced palatal plosive). Hence, it is suggested and recommended that for the sound /z/, whether it comes in English (etc.) spellings (z) for while pronunciation otherwise, should be transcribed as स़ (स with a dot below, available in the Insert toolbox). Hence: Reason रीस़न, not रीज़न ; Roses रोस़ेस़, not रोज़ेज़. But common Hindi words borrowed from Persian/Arabic (so-called Urdu words) are allowed to continue with ज़ spelling. Thus: ज़रा, नज़र, तर्ज़. The en:voiced postalveolar fricative (/ʒ/ as in treasure), inexistent in Hindi, can similarly be transcribed with श़. Thus: treasure ट्रॅश़र. The nukta (dot) available in the Insert toolbox can be combined with various consonants to suggest a more exact phonetic devanagari rendering of foreign sounds. E.g., since phonetically, English Think and this are not equal to थिंक and दिस, a better transcription could be थ़िंक and द़िस. Please take care of the dot below in so-called Urdu words, otherwise the Hindi spelling is deemed incorrect.
15. For the following English vowels met, mate, mat, transcribe as मॅट (short vowel), मेट (not मेइट), मैट (not मॅट, as popular in Marathi). However in contemporary Hindi and here, it is acceptable to use ए instead of ऍ. Thus: अमेरिका is more popular than अमॅरिका. For cot, coat, caught, transcribe as कॉट, कोट, कॉट (not कौट). Transcribe English /t/ and /d/ as ट and ड.
16. Use half-न before त, थ, द, ध, न, instead of anuswaar अं. Use half-म before प, फ, ब, भ, म. Use the anuswaar before all the rest of the consonants (not half-ङ, ञ, ण). If the मात्रा is not above the alphabet, use chandra-bindu, but only for nasalization. Thus: अन्दर, not अंदर ; अन्त, not अंत ; हिन्दी, not हिंदी ; सम्भव, not संभव ; पंचमी, not पञ्चमी ; अंडा, not अण्डा ; कंठ, not कण्ठ ; लैंड, not लैण्ड ; आँख, not आंख. However, both forms are acceptable in contemporary Hindi as well as here; the prec. are just recommendations.
17. When proceded by another vowel, use the pure vowels instead of य (unless the य is clearly articulated while pronouncing). Thus : जाएँ, not जायें (not जावें) ; आएगा, not आयेगा . However, both forms are acceptable in contemporary Hindi as well as here.
18. Please pay careful attention to the masculine/feminine gender (and singular/plural) in adjectives and verbs, else the sentence becomes ungrammatical.

For more information/suggestions/criticisms, please contact any one of the administrators of Hindi wiki here, preferably en:User:Magicalsaumy.

This page can also be found here.

Thank you,

Cygnus_hansa 02:56, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

Punjabi translation

Hi,

User:Nichalp approached me the other day to translate Template:Nazi symbol into Punjabi. Unfortunately, although my ability to read Punjabi isn't bad, I don't think I can do a decent translation of that. Are you able to do that? Thanks. Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 00:29, 9 June 2006 (UTC)

An award!

Hey Rajatghai, I'd like to award you a barnstar for your stellar work on Wikipedia! Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 00:32, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

		The Original Barnstar
		For your exceptional work as a newcomer: clocking in over 2,000 edits in four months! Sukh

Khatri clans

Thanks for creating the Khatri clans category. I will try to research and add more clans, although I am afraid it will be a slow process because the research required.--Vikramsingh 22:36, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

User: Abulfazl

Insha Allah, By God's help, you will see more changes soon in the Punjabi dialect section. I will try to get more stuff. Abulfazl 08:50, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

Dear brother, Sat Sri Akal.

If you have some knowledge about the Chadhar clan in East Punjab please update Chadhar, but I request you that the information must not have been taken from Jattan De Itehas.

Second thing, I also want write articles in Punjabi. But I don't know which word porcessor I can find on the net to start writing articles.

Abulfazl 08:59, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

Re:Singh

Hi Rajat - Its good that you noted the symbolic importance of the Lion in a detailed way, but I think the article should have 1-2 paras on it in one section, and focus on the people, usage of surname, history, etymology, significance. "Singh" is far more used in Hindu society than in Sikhs, extending into UP, Rajasthan, MP, Bihar and even Gujarat. This Fire Burns.....Always 09:35, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

Hi

Hi Rajat, this is the first time we are interacting. Sukh guided me to you. I had asked him a question and wonder if you know the answer. I am copying it from Sukh's page below:

I was trying to work on Chail, which is supposed to have been habilitated by Maharaja Bhupinder Singh. Infact, right from my young days, I have heard a legend that the Maharaja had a tiff with Lord Kitchener and eloped with his daughter. He was banned from entering Shimla after that. So he made his palace at Chail. Most of the websites corroborate this. But they all seem to be wrong. To begin with, Lord Kitchener did not have a daughter. Secondly, the Maharaja was born in 1891 and the Lord was in Shimla in the first decade of 1900s. Chail was established in the late 1800s.

If you or any other Punjabi reading this has any knowledge about the subject, please enlighten me. -- Lost 18:41, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

Thanks a lot -- Lost 19:01, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

Re: Jast clans

Hi Rajat I tried but it was deleted. I was single to defend. Kindly go and defend otherwise it is a bad trend. One line stub can be expanded over time. We need more hands to defend. Thanks burdak 12:35, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

Castes and Tribes of the Punjab

Just split the template. Add the Jatt tribes to one template and other others to others. That way it will be more appropriate. Street Scholar

Hi Rajatghai. I've replied to your message on my talk page! Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 19:38, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

ANI report

Hi - please have a look at [1]. This Fire Burns Always 06:10, 17 July 2006 (UTC)

Welcome to WikiProject Sikhism

Hi! Thanks for joining WikiProject Sikhism. Please visit the project page and give your thoughts on how we can best begin! Sukh | ਸੁਖ | Talk 00:02, 18 July 2006 (UTC)

Re:Castes and Tribes of the Punjab

I have, as of now, protected the page to prevent this major revert war. Please discuss changes and reach consensus on the template's talk page.--May the Force be with you! Shreshth91($ |-| ŗ 3 $ |-| ţ |-|) 04:43, 21 July 2006 (UTC)

Yes of course you can call me Nirav. Most people incorrectly call me "Rama," when I'm really just his "arrow." This (appears) a straightforward issue to me. I agree with you, and I've given my suggestion on the talkpage. This Fire Burns Always 05:48, 21 July 2006 (UTC)

To add, I think you should have asked for other people's intervention much earlier. It is indeed unfortunate that you were involved in extensive revert-warring, which might result in a temporary block for you and your opponent. My advice is never think that your work is hijacked, because everything works by community. Please commit yourself not to revert war and hopefully admins who see this will not block you over WP:3RR. Satbir obviously must do the same. This Fire Burns Always 05:53, 21 July 2006 (UTC)

No your account won't be suspended, but you can be blocked from editing Wikipedia for a said duration of time - 24 hrs, 48hrs. Unrepentants can be blocked for weeks, months. Mostly since you've moved to resolve this issue with the community, admins might overlook this violation but I suggest you commit yourself not to revert war with Satbir or anybody else, and go through WP:3RR. This Fire Burns Always 06:02, 21 July 2006 (UTC)

Just make a clear declaration to Shreshth and on the template talkpage (and with Satbir, I suggest) that you won't enter into another revert war. You should keep this rule in mind if faced with a conflict on any other page. Ideally move to ask for other people's help if the other editor doesn't come to the talkpage to resolve an issue. This Fire Burns Always 06:06, 21 July 2006 (UTC)

Yes its good. Hopefully this issue will be resolved swiftly. This Fire Burns Always 06:25, 21 July 2006 (UTC)