Wheeltapper

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Best to just delete attacks on biographies of living people

You added citation needed to an attack on the Christian Wolmar article. Next time it is probably best just to delete attacks that don't have a source. That's what I've done in this case. I left a warning on the user's talk page. Edward (talk) 23:05, 13 November 2011 (UTC)

Merge discussion for Croydon Variobahn

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Berlin Hauptbahnhof

Hallo Herr Radklopfer, saw your and filelakeshoe's comments, at 5 sources to 1,650 in Google Books why did you not RM the article back? In ictu oculi (talk) 00:59, 23 August 2012 (UTC)

Because I've been too busy to deal with the edit-war which would presumably break out with the person who is obsessed with creating new names for things. The debate over Praha hlavní nádraží (or is that Prague Central!) descended into outright misrepresentation of WP:UE and the content found in WP:RS. If someone wants to introduce a note of reality to Berlin Hbf then I'm more than happy to support them. If you want to see just how daft the invention of new names has to get, take a look at Koblenz City Centre Station. Or we could tell DB they are wrong about what their station is called! Wheeltapper (talk) 09:45, 23 August 2012 (UTC)

More than understood :), I was more concerned about later discoveries about Talk:Praha hlavní nádraží. I have reverted Frankfurt (Main) Hauptbahnhof, and would certainly support 1,650 English sources over 5 English sources if Berlin Hauptbahnhof was proposed as RM2. Filelakeshoe mentioned your Berlin Hauptbahnhof comments on Talk:Koblenz City Centre Station In ictu oculi (talk) 03:27, 26 August 2012 (UTC)

Railway station types in Germany

Hi Wheeltapper - thank you for your contributions to Wikipedia. On the subject of Hauptbahnhof, there have been numerous debates about the correct translation for this. I have also researched English-speaking practice. In summary, "main station" is clearly a literal translation and is not wrong. However, most English-speaking countries call the most important stations in a town or city "Foo Central" not "Foo Main". There are one or two exceptions, but the overwhelming usage is "Central Station". Confusingly many of them are not central either, but the naming convention has stuck. In some cases, the original importance of the station has declined, so they are not necessarily "main" stations either. Because neither translation is wrong and because both terms are used in English, we need to be inclusive in the article in question. Please leave both options in, with a link to central station which provides further clarity. --Bermicourt (talk) 14:01, 24 November 2012 (UTC)

If "main" is a) accurate b) not wrong c) used by WP:RS , while "central" is a) confusing (as you admit yourself) b) not the correct translation c) not attested in sources, what is the point in including central - shouldn't we be about clarity, accuracy and reality?

I've also researched English-speaking practice (using real-world rather than Wikipedia sources), and the idea that English speaking countries use the name "central" is simply not true. It certainly doesn't apply to the UK (see Liverpool, Exeter, Manchester), Ireland, the USA or Canada, I don't think it applies in the southern hemisphere, and it doesn't apply (other than in Wikipedia ) to real-world English treatment of German stations. Obviously I can't quote a source, as no-one is going to publish an article saying "Foo Union/Victoria/General/Piccadilly station is not called Central" any more than they are going to say "Foo U/V/G/P station is not called Purple Blancmange Spaceport". Wikipedia even has a (rather pointless IMHO) central station article which shows this, including things like tram stops and metro stations, but few main stations (no Liverpool Lime Street, Exeter St Davids, Edinburgh Waverley, Toronto Union). Wheeltapper (talk) 12:43, 25 November 2012 (UTC)

Merge discussion for Kuwait Metropolitan Rapid Transit System Project

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Central station

Hi Wheeltapper. I appreciate your contributions to railway articles, but please do not make edits to central station that you know are contentious unless consensus has been reached on the talk page. What the article needs is improving through research and authoritative references. Let's work on that. Regards. --Bermicourt (talk) 07:37, 27 June 2013 (UTC)

See WP:OWN. Removal of unsourced, unverified nonsense is not generally considered contentious. Wheeltapper (talk) 08:11, 27 June 2013 (UTC)

Vienna Central Station

Hi Wheeltapper. Please do not make any more controversial moves like you did at Vienna Central. You know the topic is hotly debated and there is no consensus and yet you went ahead without any discussion in direct contravention of Wiki guidelines. --Bermicourt (talk) 08:24, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

See WP:OWN. The previous - undiscussed - move of the article from the WP:UE WP:commonname Hauptbahnhof to the unsourced, inaccurate and downright misleading "Central" was a direct violation of article title guidelines and WP:OR. However the title now follows reliable English language sources, provides consistency with all the other Vienna (etc) stations and is not misleading for the English-speaking reader who is interested in learning about the station rather than what some Wikipedian thinks German-speakers ought to have called their stations. There is absolutely no consensus for the view that we need to devise new names for railway stations in German-speaking countries; indeed, Talk:Zürich Hauptbahnhof came out strongly in favour of using the common name rather than trying to devise a new one. Someone renaming a random German stations's Wikipedia page without discussion does not establish a consensus that the sources for Austria are all wrong! Wheeltapper (talk) 17:49, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Adana Central

Hello, you have once again redirected Adana Central Station to just Adana station. There are several railway stations in Adana therefore the main station is called "Central station", just saying Adana station wouldn't mean that it's a rail station. (Adana Gar in Turkish) But Adana gar (station) may also refer to the Bus station. Therefore Central is the correct version. If you look at other main station articles on wikipedia for Turkey you'll see the same. Cheers (Central Data Bank (talk))

Do we have any evidence that it is called "Central"? This sign appears to say simply "Adana"[1] as does this website[2] Just because there is more than one station doesn't mean that one of them has to be called Central (see Istanbul for an obvious example). In English a "station" is normally a railway station unless otherwise specified (hence "bus station", "fire station", etc). Wheeltapper (talk) 15:27, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Actually there is quite an amount of evidence. Do you live in Turkey or speak Turkish? Well, anyway gar (station) is usually used to refer to a bus station rather than a train station, due to buses being the primary mode of intercity transport. Therefore "railway station" is always used in Turkey. Also, Central station is used as "Ana gar". (Central Data Bank (talk))

I don't live in Turkey or speak Turkish (but then this is the English-language Wikipedia). Certain users have been trying to create new names which they think English speakers ought to use for stations irrespective of what sources say (see the failed attempt to rebrand Praha hlavní nádraží etc). I have no particular interest in Adana beyond accuracy. Do we have any good sources for the inclusion of the word "Central"? Does "gar" specifically mean central, not just station? Does the word for "central" appear on, say, signs and timetables or in books? Wheeltapper (talk) 10:12, 12 August 2013 (UTC)

Can we work together please?

Hi Wheeltapper. Can we find a better way of working than constantly reverting each others edits which is quite time-consuming and runs the risk of edit warring and a ban? There are always going to be some things we disagree on, but equally I'm sure there must be words, phrases and courses of action that we can agree on. This may involve compromise, but that's life. If we reach an impasse, we can always ask for a second opinion. I'm willing to give this a go - how about you? --Bermicourt (talk) 18:47, 15 August 2013 (UTC)

August 2013

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Leipzig

Hi. Do you intend to place a RM template on Leipzig Central Station to restore the title? In ictu oculi (talk) 07:48, 9 September 2013 (UTC)

I've been off travelling (via London Central Station, then Eurostar to Brussels Cent...oh...) and only just got back. Does it still need doing? Wheeltapper (talk) 22:09, 18 September 2013 (UTC)

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October 2013

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Markt station

Hi, I'm about to move your article Markt station to Leipzig Markt station. Would that be fine with you (and hopefully everybody else) or should I set up a regular RM? Besides "Leipzig Markt" obviously being the official station name once the station gets opened in December 2013, it seems to me that Markt station should rather be a disambiguation page as there are other "Markt" stations, e.g. "Ahrweiler Markt" along Ahr Valley Railway. Regards, Kleeblatt187 (talk) 21:40, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

Yes, using whatever is the official name sounds sensible. We can then await someone suggesting it should be something "English" like Leipsic Market or Leipzig City Thameslink! ;-) Wheeltapper (talk) 13:24, 18 November 2013 (UTC)

Done for now and ready for further proposals ... ;-) Kleeblatt187 (talk) 21:32, 18 November 2013 (UTC)

April 2014

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• <ref>{{cite web |url=http://www.bahnhof.de/?lang=en#station/17620| title=Station profile > Berlin Hauptbahnhof|publisher=Deutsche Bahn |place=Germany|accessdate=23 August 2013}}</ref> Main<

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DSB

Hi and thanks for your interest in the DSB (railway company) article. You inserted a cn-tag about the privatisation of DSB. I also agree that the article needs more information on this process. There is/was definitely a political will to first commercialise and then subsequently privatise the constructed company and large parts of the company has been sold off to other market competitors, such as the Arriva company, which also operates in the UK, as far as I know. There is already some info in the article as is, but it could probably be in need of more elaborate explanations. Alas, if you find it interesting, sources should be plentiful and the article would benefit from some work on this issue. I might indulge later myself, if I find the time.

One last thing. As DSB is already transformed to a public company many years ago, does this not in itself account for the will to privatise?

RhinoMind (talk) 16:35, 17 July 2015 (UTC)

We need to be careful to avoid confusing terminology. In English, privatisation means selling it to the private sector. If it is state-owned, then (by definition) it is not privatised. This confusion often occurs with railways (especially Deutsche Bahn, where even the company itself sometimes gets confused!) because non-native English speakers sometimes say a railway was "privatised" at the point it was changed from being a government department to being a company owned by the state. However in English this would not be considered privatisation - not least because that is how many British nationalised companies were structured anyway. The terminology is also often dependent on the political point someone is trying to make...

As for Arriva, it was founded in Britain as a private company (selling motorbikes), and is still based in Britain. However since it has been bought by a foreign state-owned company it falls into a bit of a terminological grey area. Wheeltapper (talk) 18:33, 17 July 2015 (UTC)

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