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Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/Rock-climbing equipment/archive1

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The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was promoted by PresN via FACBot (talk) 00:25, 22 August 2024 (UTC) [1].[reply]

Rock-climbing equipment

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Rock-climbing equipment (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

Toolbox
Nominator(s): Aszx5000 (talk) 11:56, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I am nominating this for featured list because this is a comprehensive list of equipment for the discipline of rock climbing. While individual elements of rock climbing equipment will change/evolve, the essence is quite stable. Rock climbing is now a new Olympic Sport, so I think this area will get even more attention in the future. I had proposed it as a GA but the recommendation was that the article was more of a list, which is correct, and that it would be a good suggestion as an FL per Talk:Rock-climbing equipment/GA1. thank you. Aszx5000 (talk) 11:56, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Comments by RunningTiger123

This review will take me a little while – feel free to ping me if I go more than a few days without following up.

  • Images need alt text
Done.
  • "And finally" → "Finally,"
Done.
  • The lead lists modern devices with the older devices they replaced – where is this information supported in the body? For instance, I see no mention of chockstones after the lead.
Done., I have mentioned chockstones in the body, where they were replaced by nuts.
  • Not technically wrong, but the list has a tendency to overuse parentheses; some of them can be reworked
    • Example: Under Type of climbing, "and its X variant" doesn't need parentheses
Done., hopefully that is better now.
    • Another example: The second paragraph of Ropes (starting with "Some climbers will use...") has 4 sets of parentheses in one sentence. This ends up feeling really choppy.
Done., and agree, hopefully better now.
  • Per MOS:ACRO1STUSE, write out acronyms where they first appear: UIAA, CEN, OSHA, maybe CE marking?
Done., CE marking is the actual name here.
  • "in lieu CEN" → "in lieu of CEN"
Done.
  • "which are (circa 7–8 mm)" – misuse of parentheses
Done.
  • "(or 'tape')," – no comma needed
Done.

— RunningTiger123 (talk) 02:50, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delighted that you are willing to help @RunningTiger123. This is (clearly) my first attempt at Featured article status. I have a few GAs under my belt and I think I am writing at a reasonable GA standard, but have little concept of FA stardard, but if you are up for it, I would love to learn and happy to spend time on this with you at whatever pace you prefer. thanks again :) Aszx5000 (talk) 13:02, 23 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

More comments:

  • "European European Committee for Standardization" – redundant
Done.
  • "e.g. the asymmetric/offset D-shape is the most common" – misuse of "e.g."
Done.
    • "e.g." means "for example" – if you substitute "for example" in place of "e.g." and it doesn't make sense, you're using the wrong phrase
understand thanks,
  • "(and materials used)" – no need for parentheses
Done.
  • "e.g. they require little in the way of gear-carrying loops" – another misuse of "e.g."
Done.
  • "e.g. to fit around heaving winter clothing" – same thing
Done.
Done.
  • First paragraph under Belay devices is unsourced
Done.
  • "e.g. a static rope that is hanging from a fixed anchor" – another "e.g."
Done.
  • "Petzel Traxion" – typo for Petzl
Done.
  • "Petzel Micro Traxion, and Camp Lift" – no comma needed, also same typo?
Done.
  • "SCLDs" – should be SLCDs? (occurs twice)
Done.
  • "like a Hex" – use lowercase for consistency
Done.
  • Don't hyphenate "bolt-hangers" for consistency
Done.
  • "stands one on aider" – I think this should be "stands on one aider"?
Done.
  • "Rock climbing hammers are mainly used..." – bullet point doesn't follow the same opening format as all of the others
Done.
  • A lot of bullet points under Miscellaneous equipment are unsourced
Done., I also added one extra item, the Knee pad, which is a commonly used piece of equipment
  • "is used by all rock climbers" – all is a strong word, so it either needs to be clearly sourced or removed
Done., changed to "is very popular amongst rock climbers"
  • Remove comma after parentheses for medical tape
Done.
  • Suggest archiving web sources (see WP:IABOT)
checking this.

— RunningTiger123 (talk) 00:45, 25 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@RunningTiger123, thanks for those comments. I have made all of the changes but I am not sure I understand the last one re WP:IABOT? My understanding is that that bot runs automatically, or am I meant to run it? thanks. Aszx5000 (talk) 10:08, 25 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
You can run IABot on demand here – it's not required but it can be nice to include. Also, I think you missed the "e.g. a static rope..." comment above, but I don't think it's worth waiting to support over that. RunningTiger123 (talk) 01:58, 26 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry about that, have fixed the "static rope" now, and I will run the IAB. Thanks so much for your help and comments on this. Aszx5000 (talk) 09:09, 26 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Just ran the IABot as well - wasn't aware of that. Thanks again. Aszx5000 (talk) 09:14, 26 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support – RunningTiger123 (talk) 01:58, 26 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Gonzo_fan2007

edit
General
  • Be conscientious of your use of "where", which is often not the best word for what you are trying to say.
done, good point and have reduced the # of where's to 3
  • I'm not sure of Wikipedia's policy on "e.g."... Ill try to see if I can find something.
I found MOS:ABBR, and while there is no mention of "e.g." it does use the term a lot?
  • You use a lot of parentheses; not necessarily bad but it is best to try to word sentences in such a way that this isn't needed as much.
That is a fair point. I have taken out most cases where they are used outside of when it is an "(e.g. )" or "(also known as..)" situation.
Lead
  • Why is "rock-climbing" hyphenated in the title and the article? Rock climbing isn't.
I am not sure about the grammar of whether combining the word "equipment" necessitates the hyphen. I have found books with/without the hyphen. I am happy to do either way but would need admin support to remove it as it was originally moved from the existing rock climbing equipment in 2011?
When this FLC is done, it should be moved. I've never seen the hyphen before and don't see any grammatical necessity for it. « Gonzo fan2007 (talk) @ 15:33, 12 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Can you link "climbing" as climbing in the first sentence?
done
  • Bouldering needs the least equipment outside of shoes and chalk and optional crash pads. replace the first "and" with a comma.
done
  • Finally, aid climbing uses unique equipment (e.g. aiders). - add to assist the climber in upward movement (e.g. aiders) or something similar
done, said ".. to give mechanical assistance to the climber in their upward movement (e.g. aiders)"
  • done manually, and with greater control (in all conditions) and less effort delete the first "and"
done
Use and certification
  • Equipment is limited to climbing shoes and chalk (with chalk bag). add "generally" before "limited" as neither shoes nor chalk are technically actually required to climb
done
  • variant, adds a rope, harness, and belay device, but no general climbing protection outside of that which is used to create the anchor point at the top of the climb from which the top rope is hung (which is usually done with carabiners, slings, and/or cord) run-on sentence. Recommend a full stop after "belay device"
done
  • Recommend replacing "in-situ" with on-site or linking in-situ
done, replaced with on-site
done, should not be hyphenated
  • every pitch needs to be solo climbed (SLDs) what is "SLDs" referencing here? SLDs is later defined in the article as "self-locking devices"
done, expanded to self-locking device and added "using"
  • At least link "Brexit" or explain. Like "After the United Kingdom left the European Union, it adopted the UKCA certification in place of the CEN.
done, used your wording which is better
  • UKCA needs to be defined
done, linked to the UKCA marking article
Ropes and slings
  • Some climbers will use a single full-thickness climbing rope of circa 9–11 mm circa -> approximately. mm should be defined ({{Abbr}})
done for both
  • both shouldn't be italicized
done
  • "Circa" again, just use the more common "approximately"
done it for the full article
  • Where two thinner ropes are used that are both clipped into each protection point (i.e. it is not to reduce rope drag, but instead to have a backup rope for long climbs), it is known as twin roping add in the 7-8 mm thickness after "tinner rope", like two thinner ropes, typically 7-8 mm in thickness, are. Also, it would sound better to just start with Twin roping is...
done all suggestions
  • Climbers use webbing that has been sewn using a certified standard of reinforced stitching into various lengths of closed loops called "slings" (or "runners"), which can be used in a wide range of situations, including wrapping around sections of rock (e.g. for abseiling, or creating belay anchors, or as passive protection), or tied to other equipment—often via carabiners—to create a longer version of a quickdraw or even a makeshift lanyard. long run-on sentence. Find somewhere to split into two.
done.
  • "Circa" again
done, replaced for full article.
  • Cord loops (also known as "cordelettes") serve a wide variety of functions in rock climbing including creating friction prusik knots for ascending or gripping fixed climbing ropes, usually using thinner circa 5–6 mm cord, or for attaching to, and equalizing forces across, multiple fixed anchors points,[15] such as when setting up abseil or belay anchors on multi-pitch climbing routes, usually using thicker circa 7–8 mm cord. long run-on sentence again. Split.
done
Rope devices
  • You define "SLD" multiple times in the article. You also link the second use of the term. You should really link and define at the first instance. Maybe move the SLD section up above descenders?
done, per above, I have now linked to it at its first mention in the "Type of climbing" sub-section. Given that, have not moved the SLD section above Descenders, and left in alphabetical order?
Protection devices
  • This section is the only one where you introduce the term with a full stop immediately after (e.g. Hexes. instead of Hexes are...). Recommend changing to be consistent.
done, have changed to be consistent with the rest of the article
  • Tricams are typically cheaper and lighter than SLCDs, and are less in use today. and -> but and no comma needed
done
  • Similar to the previous section, you use SLCD before you define it. Maybe move "Active" before "Passive"
done, swapped
  • is attached into which carabiners (and quickdraws) can be clipped. no need for the parentheses.
done
  • decade, but have a finite, comma not need
done
  • protection of choice, but are still, comma not needed
done
  • Define or link "crag"
done, linked to crag (climbing)
Aid equipment
  • "aid" to the aid climber in ascending, no need for the second "aid"
done
  • which are a central part of the technique of aid climbing where they are normally used in pairs some rewrite needed as it is confusing. Is it a central part of aid climbing only when used in pairs? "where" is probably not the right word either (when is more appropriate)
done, split sentence and re-worded to ".. and are a central part of the technique of aid climbing. They are normally used in pairs .."
  • Like aiders, daisy chains are also a central part of aid climbing where they link the harness to the aider (see above); not sure what you mean by "where they link the harness to the aider" nor do I understand what the "see above" is referencing.
done, re-worded to "Like aiders, daisy chains are also a central part of aid climbing. They are used to attach the harness to the aider. Care has to be taken ...."
  • Copperheads are only used in aid climbing and their low strength means that they can only handle the "static bodyweight" of an ascending aid climber, and will likely fail where the climber makes a dynamic fall. the first and should be a "but" and the comma before the second "and" isn't needed
done
  • These are steel hooks of various shapes (e.g. bat hook, talon hook, grappling hook, etc.,) that are hung from cracks and flakes (e.g. the fifi hook and skyhook). Mostly used in aid climbing, but they have been used in extreme traditional climbing routes as a last resort (i.e.hook placements may not withstand a dynamic fall). -> Steel hooks of various shapes (e.g. bat hook, talon hook, grappling hook, etc.,) are hung from cracks and flakes (e.g. the fifi hook and skyhook). They are mostly used in aid climbing but have been used in extreme traditional climbing routes as a last resort (i.e. the hook placements may not withstand a dynamic fall). Note that in my update, I fixed a missing space between "i.e." and "hook"
done, and merged sentence with the heading of "Hooks", per earlier changes.
  • These are mainly used by aid climbers to hammer in various types of pitons while ascending routes; note that clean aid climbing does not allow the use of hammers as all clean aid equipment must only be inserted on a temporary basis. -> A type of hammer made insert various types of pitons whilee ascending routes; clean aid climbing does not allow the use of hammers because all clean aid equipment must only be inserted on a temporary basis.
done
Clothing equipment
  • The anchor link to belay glasses doesn't work for me (i.e. it doesn't go to the specific term in that page)
done, linked to the Belay glasses article
  • Belay gloves are used to protect the hands when doing lots of belaying (especially on big wall climbing routes), and their construction from leather or other hard-wearing materials, generally improves grip with the rope, which lessens the risk of a failure of the belay system. I would recommend deleting ""when doing lots of belaying" as an obvious statement. Then add a full stop after the parenthetical.
done
done
  • "edging", and softer delete the comma
done
  • particularly where the falling lead climber is flipped over. where -> when
done
Misc equipment
  • This is the only section without an intro sentence. Recommend adding one for consistency.
done
  • , which could cause ankle or back injuries. -> leading to injury.
done
  • that has been dangerously worn down delete "dangerously" as editorializing
done
  • Nut tools should be singular or "are" should be used
done, made singular
  • climbers even use toothbrushes to clean the smallest holds without damaging them -> toothbrushes may be used to clean the smallest holds without damaging them
done
Training equipment
  • A narrow flexible (e.g. it can be rolled up) all-metal, or PVC/webbing, ladder that, too many consecutive adjectives. Reword to something like A narrow and flexible ladder, typically capable of being rolled up, made from metal, PVC or webbing that
done
  • that may be climbed up and down without the aid of the feet. replace "may" with "is typically"
done
  • the "hangboard" is focused on change to "was developed to focus on"
done, re-worded the two sentences to say "is related to the campus board and was developed to focus on building static arm and finger strength;"
See also
  • The Wikimedia commons box goes in the "External links" section per its documentation
done
Images
  • All photos are appropriately licensed, captioned and have alt text. All do a good job of helping the article.

Nice work! Aszx5000 Please ping me when you are ready. « Gonzo fan2007 (talk) @ 20:12, 2 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks @Gonzo fan2007 - only just back from my travels over the last few weeks but will get to work on the above shortly. Much appreciated! Aszx5000 (talk) 10:13, 9 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Gonzo fan2007:. Thanks for all your great input and comments listed above, all of which I have now hopefully incorporated into the article. Aszx5000 (talk) 13:38, 10 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Support, really nice work on what is an atypical and challenging list Aszx5000. I made two small copyedits in the article, hope that they are ok with you. « Gonzo fan2007 (talk) @ 15:33, 12 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Those changes are great and your support is very much appreciated! Aszx5000 (talk) 15:51, 12 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Source review passed; promoting. --PresN 21:37, 21 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • Closing note: This candidate has been promoted, but there may be a delay in bot processing of the close. Please see WP:FLC/ar, and leave the {{featured list candidates}} template in place on the talk page until the bot goes through.
The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
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