Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2007 October 14

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October 14

Archiving references

When a new and better source is found, the old reference usually gets replaced and deleted altogether. But sometimes, I find that it's a good idea to keep an old reference, because I've spent a lot of time finding it, and it contains information that can be possibly used in the future. So is it ok to create a page that is specifically used for archiving old references, and have the page placed along the archives in the talk page? I'm referring to the article Britney Spears, and some editors have placed the old, unused references as a hidden note in the References section of the article. Although I believe it's a better idea to create an archive page for them so it's easier to arrange, organise and find them. Oops!...I did it again (talk) 00:56, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Usually old references are still relevant, even if it's just to point out that they're no longer valid. If they really don't apply to the article anymore, simply remove them. If you're concerned there may be some dispute about it, mention it on the Talk page and provide the links there. They'll naturally get archived as the Talk page does. -- Kesh 01:09, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

• Yes, when I create a new article I leave a link to all the dead tree sources and websites and Google searches I did before writing the article. Archiving existing links is a very good idea (unless keeping them is better) - Mgm|^(talk) 09:59, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Creating an article

Is it possible for me to make an article that isn't on Wikipedia? If so, where do i go to do so? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.127.84.193 (talk) 04:47, 14 October 2007 (UTC) |

Before creating an article, please search Wikipedia first to make sure that an article does not already exist on the subject. Please also review a few of our relevant policies and guidelines which all articles should comport with. As Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, articles must not contain original research, must be written from a neutral point of view, should cite to reliable sources which verify their content and must not contain unsourced, negative content about living people.

Articles must also demonstrate the notability of the subject. Please see our subject specific guidelines for people, bands and musicians, companies and organizations and web content and note that if you are closely associated with the subject, our conflict of interest guideline strongly recommends against you creating the article.

If you still think an article is appropriate, see Help:Starting a new page. You might also look at Wikipedia:Your first article and Wikipedia:How to write a great article for guidance, and please consider taking a tour through the Wikipedia:Tutorial so that you know how to properly format the article before creation. meshach 05:53, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Hello

I am very new here, could I know who owns the site thanks! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.96.238.110 (talk) 07:23, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

See Wikipedia:Very_Frequently_Asked_Questions#Who_owns_Wikipedia.3F for the answer to that question. That page contains the answers to many other common questions. meshach —Preceding signed but undated comment was added at 08:12, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

question

how can I download topics? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.4.104.11 (talk) 07:28, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

You're probably looking for Wikipedia:Database download. Best, PeaceNT 08:45, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Can I upload these pics?

there are loads of pics here http://www.last.fm/music/Michael+Jackson/+images?page=2

can they be uploaded to Wikipedia.. there is no copyright info over there..so just wanted to conform... —Preceding unsigned comment added by Sai2020 (talk • contribs) 09:12, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

• Unless specifically stated otherwise, you should assume the images are copyrighted. Since that site allows random internet users to upload images, it's reasonable to assume that at least half of them had no concept of copyright when they uploaded it, or simply chose to ignore it. The random internet user is usually unaware of copyright restrictions, so it would be unwise to trust their judgement. - Mgm|^(talk) 09:57, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

HYDRAULIC

What is the different between the close lube system @open lube system?

In many hydraulic operated machine having a open lube system and many machine close lube system.

Please give different between it

Daman Thakre —Preceding unsigned comment added by Daman Thakre (talk • contribs) 10:29, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Have you tried Wikipedia's Reference Desk? They specialize in knowledge questions and will try to answer any question in the universe (except how to use Wikipedia, since that is what this Help Desk is for). Just follow the link, select the relevant section, and ask away. I hope this helps. — Lost^(talk) 10:34, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

What to do when a {{cleanup}} tag is ignored?

I've noticed that cleanup tags, as well as their friends wikify, unsourced, OR, etc.. tend to sit on a page some times for months, even as long as years without the article ever actually being cleaned up in any way. Is there some way to draw attention to an article that's been in bad condition for a long time?--69.118.235.97 12:09, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

If it isn't already there, you might list at Wikipedia:Cleanup. --Moonriddengirl 12:16, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Thanks!--69.118.235.97 12:24, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

If there's a particular page that's annoying you, have a go at cleaning it up yourself. Don't be worried that you'll make a mess of it, even if you do, someone will rollback your changes. Regards, Ben Aveling 12:31, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Most of the time if I see a page that I can effectively clean myself, I do. Only in cases where the page is so bad that I can't tell what it's trying to say do I resort to a cleanup tag. Either that or cases where there's missing citations and I have no idea where to look for them, or if a page is so awkward that it would require a complete rewrite, or if I simply have no knowledge of the subject.--69.118.235.97 13:17, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Take for instance 453d Electronic Warfare Squadron (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views), it was written like a blurb from the army(?)'s website, and provides absolutely no context to the reader. I don't know the first thing about this subject, so the only thing I could do was add those templates, and change we to they. Or Volleyball in Canada (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) which after 6 major edits, by me, still requires cleanup, yet has received none. Another example being Abracadabra (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) which is virtually all original research, and seems to be based on the first hand observations of a wikipedian who happens to speak Hebrew, but since I know nothing about the subject, there's not much I could do to improve it. There's a similar story for virtually every article I've tagged.--69.118.235.97 13:24, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Have you tried to see if there are any books that back up those articles. What might look like original research often is just unreferenced information. - Mgm|^(talk) 16:49, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

my attempt to put a polyphone tabulature on http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tablature#

Dear wikipedia team,

sorry, my English is sooo bad, that i will write in German:

Ich habe gestern und heute versucht eine polyphone Tabulatur auf Ihrer Seite zu plazieren. Bei image Krieger-Menuett.jpg hat es geheißen, da sei ja Werbung drauf und die sei bei Wikipedia verboten....

Auf der selben Seite wird für guitar pro und andere Firmen jede Menge Werbung gemacht und das ist dann scheins nicht verboten....

Nebenbei bemerkt ich (Musiklehrfabrik Amberg) bin ein Einmann"Betrieb" und bin nach einem Herzinfarkt und 2 Schlaganfällen in Frührente, bzw. hab grad noch 3 Schüler. Ich kenne das Programm Obtiv und habe vor einem Jahr vorgeschlagen einen polyphonen Tabulatur Editor zu entwickeln, der mittlerweile ziemlich fertig ist. Soweit ich weiß, gibt es auf der Welt nichts dergleichen, somit ist dieses Programm doch eine Sensation! Bei herkömmlichen Tabulatur Editoren ist es nicht möglich in einem mehrstimmigen Satz (selbst, wenn es nur um 2 Stimmen geht) die Notenlänge anzugeben, das geht nun selbst in einem vierstimmigen Gitarren/Lauten Satz!

Ich habe dann noch versucht die Tabulatur Sor-iii auf Ihre Seite zu setzen. Hab die Fußzeile mit der angeblichen Werbung entfernt sodaß diese Tabulatur 100% Werbefrei ist. Und dennoch wird Sie von Ihren Mitarbeitern ständig rausgeschmissen.

Ich bin dieses Spiel (ich setze, Sie canceln) Satt. Vieleicht denke Sie ja doch nochmal darüber nach, ob Sie Sor-iii.jpg auf Ihrer Seite plazieren.... Ich finde es wäre eine schöne Bereicherung Ihrer Seite.

Ich wünsche Ihnen eine gute Woche und weiterhin viel Erfolg mit Ihrer Arbeit!

Mit freundlichen Grüßen

S.B.S.B. Stefan Buschhausen —Preceding signed but undated comment was added at 15:53, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Your English is far better than my (nonexistent) German. The best I can do is paste your question into Google language tools, which produces a somewhat readable result:

I spoke yesterday and today trying a polyphonic tablature on your page to place. In Krieger-Menuett.jpg image has been called, because it was yes, and the advertising was banned in Wikipedia ....

On the same page is for a guitar and other companies made a lot of advertising, and the license is not forbidden ....

Incidentally, I (music teaching factory Amberg) Einmann am an "operation" and am following a heart attack and stroke in two early retirement, or have still 3 grad students. I know the program Obtiv and had a year ago proposed a polyphonic tablature editor to develop the now quite finished. As far as I know, there is nothing in the world like, so this program is but a sensation! With conventional tablature editors, it is not possible in a polyphonic rate (even if it only goes to 2 votes) the note length indicate the challenge now even in a four guitars / sounds sentence!

I then tried the tablature Sor-iii on your side. Did the foot row with the alleged advertising away so that the tablature 100% free advertising. And yet you will always get your employees.

I am this game (I assume that you cancel) sated. You might think so but again about whether you Sor-iii.jpg place on your side .... I think it would be a nice enrichment your side.

I wish you a good week and continued success with your work!

Yours sincerely,

Now perhaps our English-speakers can have a go at it. --Teratornis 18:25, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Okay, it looks like this editor keeps trying to link to his own tabeleture on our article, like this. It has been continually reverted as spam. SB, please read our guidelines on external links to understand why your link is inappropriate. Further, please read our 3 reversion rule, as you've added this repeatedly despite its removal. -- Kesh 19:53, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

New Topic/Page

How can someone add a new topic? There is a new high school in Colorado that is not listed, that should be. —Preceding unsigned comment added by PhatKlownn (talk • contribs) 17:46, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

• Do a search for it. If it doesn't appear, click the red link that says "add this article." Cite sources, and you'll be on your way! JKBrooks85 17:51, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Creating a list based on date of birth/date

I would like to create a list of musicians/composers (about whom articles exist on Wikipedia) who were born or who died in specific years.

Of course, it is possible to view a list of everyone who died in, say, 1908. But can such a list be filtered by category?

Thank you.

Jim Bruce 18:29, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

We have categories for Category:Deaths by year and Category:Births by year - is that what you're looking for? Hersfold ^(t/a/c) 19:32, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

I think Jim would like to get the intersection of Category:Deaths by year and Category:Musicians, but I don't know how to produce such an intersection. — Timotab ^{Timothy (not Tim dagnabbit!)} 18:21, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Thank you for your responses. Timotab is correct. That is exactly what I would like. It would be an incredibly useful tool for anyone researching anniversaries among specific categories, e.g. politicians, writers, composers, etc. Perhaps it could go on the 'to-do' list? Or maybe someone has already worked out a temporary solution that is not too complicated for a lay person like myself. Jim Bruce 10:01, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

The ability to do this is a much-requested feature, but the developers haven't yet figured out a way to do it that returns results in a reasonable amount of time, so it isn't possible at the moment. --ais523 10:07, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

That's a pity. It would certainly enhance Wikipedia's status as a research tool, and probably be a unique feature compared with any equivalent online reference site. Jim Bruce 14:39, 20 October 2007 (UTC)

Bot flags

Hello, I just got a bot approved by the BRFA process, and was wondering if it can run without a flag. Neranei (talk) 20:48, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

• As far as I know all bots are flagged, which is why you had to request it in the first place. Why would you want to run it without a flag anyway? - Mgm|^(talk) 20:50, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

It only just got approved, and is awaiting a bureaucrat to flag it. I was just wondering if the bot can run in the meantime, that's all. Thanks! Neranei (talk) 20:52, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

You probably know this, but there's a reason for the flag: it allows people to hide bot edits when viewing recent changes/watchlists/stuff. It's not just cosmetic. ssepp^(talk) 21:39, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Yes, that's what I figured. Thanks for your help! Neranei (talk) 21:44, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

• If you're approved and just waiting for the flag, I suppose you could go ahead and edit, just keep the count/minute down so you don't overflow recent changes until you actually get your flag. - 131.211.210.11 07:36, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Question

Why do people get to edit the webpage? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.59.94.77 (talk) 21:10, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia is a wiki, which means that people work together to improve it. People can edit it in order to make articles better. Neranei (talk) 21:14, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

If only one person is allowed to edit, there's a limit on how much work can be done. By allowing more people to edit, more work can be done in the same amount of time. JKBrooks85 21:20, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

entry for Augustus (Octavian Augustus Caesar)

This entry (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Augustus) loads and then jumps immediately to a donation redirect page. Please investigate & resolve or explain reasoning for this anomalous behavior. Thank you. 4.166.144.127 21:16, 14 October 2007 (UTC)Anonymous User, Austin TX

That's odd, when I opened the page, it loaded this page. It seems fine now. Neranei (talk) 21:19, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

How do you create a user page?

I am new to Wikipedia, and I was wondering how to create a user page. I'm completely baffled by the programming language that Wikipedia uses. Thanks in advance. NinSmartSpasms 21:45, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Your userpage doesn't have to use Wikimarkup at all. Some simple text about yourself is just fine. You can also visit WP:UP for information on what is and isn't allowed, and Wikipedia:User Page Design Center for wikimarkup help and design ideas. Neranei (talk) 21:48, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

(After edit conflict) Before you do anything else, I think you would benefit greatly by taking a tour through the Wikipedia:Tutorial (<---that's blue which means its a link). This will give you a hopefully not overwhelming introduction to Wikipedia, how it operates, the programming language it uses and so on. As for your userpage, please see (redundant links removed per above post:-) Wikipedia:WikiProject User Page Help and User:Danieltiger45/Userpage design--Fuhghettaboutit 21:55, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

You might benefit from watching the MediaWiki training videos. Also see the cheat sheet for the most frequently-used wikitext markup commands. --Teratornis 04:39, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Articles in english to be translated to Spanish.

Since wikipedia in English is the most complete, there are many articles well represented in English that i would like to translate to the Spanish language. However I am used to the tags, links, and edition tools in English. Is it possible to translate articles by automatically changing the editing tools (codes) to the Spanish ones? if so How can i do it? user:Camilo Sanchez —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.125.102.253 (talk) 21:49, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

One page that can help you is Wikipedia:Translation. Neranei (talk) 21:52, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

The question of how to copy templates and other features from the English Wikipedia also occurs with many if not most smaller wikis that run on the MediaWiki software, even if they are also in English. Therefore, many people have done what you are asking to do, as they built up their smaller wikis to have some of the nice features in the English Wikipedia. Your easiest option would be to find some technically proficient users on the Spanish Wikipedia who can assist you with importing features from the English Wikipedia. You can learn to do everything yourself, merely by reading online manuals and using trial and error, but it is tedious. To find the technically proficient users on the Spanish Wikipedia, browse to its equivalent of the Template: namespace, look for the most complicated templates you can find there, and check the histories to see the users who have edited them. --Teratornis 16:30, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Karen Strassman

The article on Karen Strassman was recently deleted and I'm too scared to repost it back on Wikipedia, because I'm nervous that they might redelete it again. Is there anyone out there available to recreate it, or is it going to be deleted for good? Because I remember recreating "???" and that eventually got redeleted. Can someone help me, please?Kitty53 21:57, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

The reason the article was deleted was because it was blantant adevertising, used only to promote someone or something. You can re-create the article just write it in a neutral point of view that doesn't read like an advertisment. The article will lots of sources too to back up the info in the article aswell. AngelOfSadness talk 22:05, 14 October 2007 (UTC

Reporting pages

Someone has made a bad editing, how to you report it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.226.11.201 (talk) 22:56, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

If the page has been vandalized, you can be bold and change it back yourself. :) If the vandal is still active, you can report them to Administrator intervention against vandalism. GlassCobra 23:07, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

That is true, but please remember to warn the vandal using the appropriate templates listed at Wikipedia:Template messages/User talk namespace and only report them if they ignore the warnings and continue to behave badly. Best, PeaceNT 04:47, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Please, please, please help me!

My friend scanned a picture from the book The Kennedy Women by Laurence Leamer onto her computer and enlarged it. She then sent it to me by using the private message setting on a website.

I would like to post that photograph on an article as opposed to one that is already being used. How do I write the summary, and which heading under licensing would I choose in order to upload it on to Wikipedia? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ajsoa (talk • contribs) 23:41, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

I can't seem to find an article on this book, but if your friend enlarged the image to a resolution higher than what we have, we probably cannot accept it. Our Non-free content policy generally restricts the use of high-resolution copyrighted images, in order to use them under a claim of fair use. Unless it's particularly ugly, the image currently in use is probably sufficient. Could you provide a link to the image or article in question? Hersfold ^(t/a/c) 23:50, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Also, if the picture appeared in a book, it probably is copyrighted; so you would have to get permission from the copyright owner to use it here! --Orange Mike 13:26, 15 October 2007 (UTC)