Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2008 September 17

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September 17

Bobby Trendy Article

There appear to be "editing wars" of sorts on the Wikipedia Bobby Trendy article. Multiple users are in disagreement regarding his birth name, birth year, birthplace, and high school graduation date. I have made several edits and given _actual sources_ for these factual bits of information, but people have changed them several different times in the last month, with one user (Causeloss, who has no other editing history) accusing me of vandalism on September 2 - even though his edit to my work didn't include a source, while mine did! In fact, I don't believe any edits to my work have given sources. I am disturbed that these people continue to edit the article without providing sources. Today, I made changes again, but am not sure how long it will take until the edit wars possibly start up again. In addition to my edits today, I also made a remark on the discussion page of Bobby Trendy, responding to a user who, like me, was concerned about these rampant edits without sources. If any assistance/help can be given to possibly resolve this situation, it would be great. --24.119.67.199 (talk) 00:38, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Well, you're definitely on the right track re: discussing it on the Talk page. That's the best way to start in fixing any content dispute. The main thing about WP, though, is that any info you provide must conform to WP:VER--in other words, any info you add must come from a verifiable, outside, printed and reliable source. So: Blogs are a source, yes, but not reliable. If you believe the sources you're offering are RELIABLE sources, and the other editors say they're not, you might want to take it to WP:RS/N. If you've got a bunch of people just saying "it's right because I say so, and no sources will make me think otherwise" then you've got a question for WP:AN/I--the Incidents board, where admins can come to look at issues that might merit their involvement. But as much as possible, we encourage users to talk it out--on the article's talk page, on their own talk pages, wherever they can. Sources are paramount--you sound like you've got a grasp of that. Also, just IMHO, you might look into creating a named account; sometimes, for reasons I can't explain, named accounts are taken more seriously than IPs in arguments. Hope this helps.Gladys J Cortez 01:03, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

ARTICLE TITLE

Help! The name of the article I'm editing is in incorrect. The last name of the person in the name of the page itself is not capitalized. What is the fix? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kennethrexroth (talk • contribs) 03:24, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

To rename an article we "move" it. Along the top of the article there are buttons for "Article" "Discussion" "Edit" "History" "Move" and "Watch". Click the "Move" button and then put in the new title. For more info see Help:Moving a page. If you have any more questions feel free to ask. I hope it helps. James086^{Talk | Email} 03:31, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

I moved the page for you. — Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 03:32, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

I feel better now. "Redirected from" in this case seems like a mistake. I wonder if there's a way to remove the "redirected from"? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kennethrexroth (talk • contribs) 03:35, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

The "redirected from" is there to show that you arrived at the relevant page via a redirect. It's not a bad thing, nor is it indicative of a mistake. – ukexpat (talk) 04:00, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

What's the best way to expand the editing base?

What is the best way of expanding the editing base on an area of articles? Falun Gong and its related articles are currently pretty much owned by FLG-related single purpose accounts and it has been quite a hassle in trying to communicate with them. This leads to a tendency of regular editors leaving them to their own accords because it's just such an annoyance, and resulted in a small editing base and very little improvements on the article. What is the best way to "advertise" this area so that more neutral inputs are gathered? --antilived^{T | C | G} 04:03, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Requests for feedback or Wikipedia:Peer review? — Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 08:06, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

You might find something useful at WP:EIW#Contro or WP:EIW#Dispute. Other possibilities:

• Wikipedia:WikiProject Atheism says "We will also help prevent religion-based censorship throughout Wikipedia."
• Wikipedia:WikiProject Religion says "WikiProject Religion ... also seeks to ensure NPOV across articles related to religion."
  • Wikipedia:WikiProject Religion#Potential work groups mentions Falun Gong. You might be able to drum up interest on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Religion in starting a Falun Gong work group.

Note that in general, religion articles present a special challenge to Wikipedia's neutral point of view policy, because the neutral point of view follows from an objectivist philosophy, whereas religions are generally faith based. Which is to say most religions are naturally antithetical to neutrality. In some religions, a neutral stance would amount to blasphemy (for example, see Jyllands-Posten Muhammad cartoons controversy, an article which satisfies Wikipedia's neutrality policy, but amounts to blasphemy in the minds of strict adherents of Islam). Since most people who are expert in a given religion are also adherents of that religion, with the degree of expertise often correlating with the intensity of religious commitment, expect to see lots of non-neutrality in religion articles on Wikipedia. Wikipedia's conflict of interest guideline mentions the possibility that an editor may have a religious conflict of interest. --Teratornis (talk) 17:39, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

I've posted a note on Religion WikiProject since WikiProject Atheism might be considered biased (hey it's better to play on the safe side) and also on WP:3O but so far no response yet. Thanks for the suggestions though. --antilived^{T | C | G} 23:52, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

manufacturing industry

give me an example of Manufactring (CLOTHES) industry.

Que: What frustration that most leaders suffer from their jobs? give me example in Clothes Manufacturing ind. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.167.173.204 (talk) 07:12, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

You might find what you are looking for in the article about Textile manufacturing. If you cannot find the answer there, you can try asking your question at Wikipedia's Reference Desk. They will be glad to try to answer questions about anything in the universe (except about how to use Wikipedia, which is what this help desk is for). I hope this helps. Zain Ebrahim (talk) 07:38, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

How to determine contents of a list

I understand the notability requirements for article inclusion (the article must be neutral and able to be verified from reliable sources) but how do you determine notability for the contents of a list? This talk page post sparked my interest and I could not find the relevant Wikipedia guideline or explanation.--Commander Keane (talk) 07:36, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

The relevant guideline is WP:LIST. This states a requirement for notability but does not specify specific hard and fast list rules. Many list pages use the criterion that if an entries notability is not established in an article then a reference on the list page itself should be provided. It is not a requirement for a list entry to have a Wikipedia article (not to be confused with MOS:DAB pages which DO have this requirement). SpinningSpark 10:24, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Coord not working

I have added a coord tag to the Queensbury, West Yorkshire article with the following contents

coord|53|46|06|N|1|50|43|W|​display=title|region:GB_type:city

However it appears inline. What's wrong? -- Q Chris (talk) 08:33, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

I don't have much technical expertise, but perhaps it is somehow interacting with {{Infobox UK ward}}, which uses hCard microformat, particularly the "adr" class. — Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 09:09, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Thanks "Twas Now". If it is an interaction this is beyond me. Is there somewhere I should highlight this issue for expert assistance ho has this post on this page done that already? -- Q Chris (talk) 09:22, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Some technically minded people monitor this page, but Wikipedia:Village pump (technical) would give you better exposure. — Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 09:24, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Thanks, posted there!

Fixed. coord|53|46|06|N|1|50|43|W|​display=title|region:GB_type:city doesn't work, but coord|53|46|06|N|1|50|43|W|region:GB_type:city|​display=title does. Thanks for adding coordinates, and using {{coord}}! Andy Mabbett (User:Pigsonthewing); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 12:26, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Poetry

I don't often mess with poetry but I've come across this need a couple of times. Is there a quote template that will properly format poetry/songs without having to put ugly break tags at the end of every line? SpinningSpark 10:17, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

The <poem>...</poem> tag works. Algebraist 10:30, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Also, indenting using a colon : to being each line. — Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 18:37, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

The <poem> extension retains formatting such as line breaks; <blockquote indents the text; using both does both. There are also templates such as {{quote box2}}. --—— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 19:15, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Bottom of Page

Resolved

 – on talk page

How should I make a template always appear on the bottom of the talk page? -- Tyw7, Leading Innovations ‍ ‍‍ (Talk ● Contributions) 10:54, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

This user placed a {{helpme}} tag and asked on their talk page. Users are helping there. Gtstricky^{Talk or C} 13:28, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

hacking

i just wana learn hacking from the begining n in a easy way how could i learn n how couild i do it practically? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.167.63.91 (talk) 13:40, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

You won't find that information here, this is the Wikipedia Help Desk for asking questions about using Wikipedia. If you have a more specific question about computers they will be able to help you at the Reference Desk. Scottydude _review 13:55, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Don't think they'll help you to hack even at the Reference Desk though, since it is something illegal. I wouldn't keep my hopes up if I were you. Chamal ^Talk ± 14:00, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

That depends on what the questioner means by hacking. A hacker can be "a clever programmer" (with no illegality implied) or "someone who tries to break into a computer system." However, I doubt that anyone who uses the former definition would need to ask how to become a hacker - he (most likely a "he", as hackerdom is overwhelmingly male, no disrespect to the tiny minority of female hackers, but we're guessing about a stranger here, so we put our money on the 99% odds) would already know. --Teratornis (talk) 17:22, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

And whatever you mean by "hack", it won't be easy to learn. It takes a long time to master the skills, both "true hacking" and breaking into systems. --grawity 11:47, 19 September 2008 (UTC)

Image displacement

Another editor has been reorganising images because, as he/she sees the page, all the images (which are spread l & r in the article) end up in two columns at the bottom of the page. Is there some simple explanation? Thanks Motmit (talk) 16:20, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Which page is it? PrimeHunter (talk) 16:42, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Your question is hard to understand, but you seem to describe reorganizing separate images into a gallery tag. See WP:EIW#Gallery and WP:GALLERY for information about how that works. (I'm not commenting on whether a gallery tag is a good idea because I don't know what page you have in mind, and like PrimeHunter I'm not a mind-reader.) --Teratornis (talk) 17:44, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Osney Lock is one of the pages which I have restored after they were put in a gallery by the editor because to him/her they all ended up at the bottom anyway. Motmit (talk) 17:56, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

The other editor was probably using a gallery tag to fix the bunched-up edit links, but see WP:BUNCH for another solution which would keep the images more or less in their current positions. If you fix the bunched-up edit links, you will reduce the tendency of other editors to put back a gallery tag. --Teratornis (talk) 07:59, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

Asif Ali Zardari - President of Pakistan

Please let me know Asif Ali Zardari's assets in Pakistan and abroad.

1. Money in Banks
2. Land in Pakistan and abroad
3. Immovable properties in Pakistan and abroad.

—Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.243.120.68 (talk) 17:31, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

I reorganized your items into a numbered list. It looks better now, don't you agree? As to the question, you could try asking on the Reference desk, or try a {{Google}} search:

• Asif Ali Zardari assets in Pakistan and abroad

Some of the search results look interesting. So does Wikipedia's Asif Ali Zardari article. --Teratornis (talk) 17:50, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

MAKE A SYMBOL AS EMBLEM FOR NEW VENTURE WITH THE LETTERS SHD,DHS,HSD OR DHHS

GROUP OF BUSINESS ACTIVITIES ARE RUNNING NOW I WANT TO CREATE AN EMBEM FOR MY GROUP OF BUSINESS WITH THE FIRST LETTERS OF MY FAMILY MEMBERS AND THOSE ARE HSDH61.1.225.90 (talk) 17:36, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

This is for asking questions about using Wikipedia. Your question, from what I can see, has nothing to do with Wikipedia. I wouldn't even suggest asking it on the reference desk as you are not asking for any sort of reference. Finally, do not type in all caps. It is the equivalent of screaming at everyone. -- kainaw™ 17:38, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

create an entry

How do I submit a new entry. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jzolak (talk • contribs) 18:36, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Before creating an article, please search Wikipedia first to make sure that an article does not already exist on the subject. Please also review a few of our relevant policies and guidelines which all articles should comport with. As Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, articles must not contain original research, must be written from a neutral point of view, should cite to reliable sources which verify their content and must not contain unsourced, negative content about living people.

Articles must also demonstrate the notability of the subject. Please see our subject specific guidelines for people, bands and musicians, companies and organizations and web content and note that if you are closely associated with the subject, our conflict of interest guideline strongly recommends against you creating the article.

If you still think an article is appropriate, see Help:Starting a new page. You might also look at Wikipedia:Your first article and Wikipedia:How to write a great article for guidance, and please consider taking a tour through the Wikipedia:Tutorial so that you know how to properly format the article before creation. _Gb^T/c 19:20, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Would someone please edit the template for the box at the top of this page to include a big, a really, really big, flashing red link to Wikipedia:Your first article? Thanks. – ukexpat (talk) 19:46, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

We discuss which instructions to add or remove from Wikipedia:Help desk/Header on Wikipedia talk:Help desk. Currently we tell people to search the Help desk archives before asking a question, and searching the Help desk for: how do I create a new article does find quite a few repeats of the answer. The answer to this question is also the very first FAQ entry: WP:FAQ#CREATE. I'd just as soon answer the FAQs that appear on the Help desk with FAQ shortcut links (such as WP:FAQ#CREATE), to save space on the Help desk, and to help users who ask FAQs to realize we have a FAQ. One of the first things new Wikipedia users need to learn is that almost every new user question has been asked by up to 48,308,136 users before them. And since Wikipedia is an extremely efficient documenting tool, we've documented most of the answers. --Teratornis (talk) 08:08, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

Image problem?

Can anyone else see the third image here? I can't, and when I click-through to the image page I get an empty box there too. Any ideas? Maury (talk) 19:12, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

There's no image of that name, it would appear, on clicking through to File:Aircraft engine Orenda 14 front.jpg...why it takes you to the upload page, I'm not quite sure. _Gb^T/c 19:15, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

In confirmation to GB, no image of Airecraft engine Orenda 14 front exist on Wikipedia - even through the search process it turned up nothing, you may need to upload or find the image on Wikimedia-Commons. Terra 19:31, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

It was deleted [1] from Commons in February. PrimeHunter (talk) 20:31, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

That's the second engine image. I don't see the third one. I see I left out "engine" in the first post. Maury (talk) 20:46, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

If you mean Image:Orenda PS.jpg in the section Orenda Aerospace#Orenda Iroquois then I see it fine both in the article and the image page. If you mean something else then please give the image name. The deleted image has been removed.[2] PrimeHunter (talk) 21:20, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Printing

How can I print entry - on Goethe - I have iMac? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.188.51.105 (talk) 19:18, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

This page is for questions about using Wikipedia. Please consider asking this question at the Wikipedia:Reference desk. They specialize in knowledge questions and will try to answer any question in the universe (except how to use Wikipedia, since that is what this Help Desk is for). Just follow the link, select the relevant section, and ask away. You could always try searching Wikipedia for an article related to the topic you want to know more about. I hope this helps.Terra 19:19, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Er, isn't this question about using Wikipedia? To answer the question, click on this link: Johann Wolfgang von Goethe, then find and click on the "printable version" link in the tool box section on the left hand side of the page, then from your File menu select and click "print". – ukexpat (talk) 19:51, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

I thought this was off-topic so I placed {{subst:HD/rd}} - if the question included more detail about what he/she wanted to know then I wouldn't have placed the message down. Terra 19:54, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Universal Express currections

directly below what it says now on wikipedia....what it should legally say is under it in bold...(the facts)

Universal Express (Pink Sheets: USXP) claimed to be a transportation and logistics service company and was registered in Nevada and headquartered in Boca Raton, Florida.[1] However, investigation by the SEC clearly revealed that the primary business of USXP was the production of and distribution of billions of illegal, unregistered shares. The money from these sales went directly to support the lavish lifestyle of Richard Altomare and his supporters. Some funds were diverted to advertising designed to push the sale of additional shares. A receiver was appointed for Universal Express by a federal judge at the request of the S.E.C. The judge ordered Universal and its top officers to pay $21.9 million and barred them from future penny stock sales. [1]

Altomare was ordered to prison for contempt of court in April 2008.[2] As of May, 2008, he was resident in the Metropolitan Correctional Center, New York City.[3]

Universal Express (Pink Sheets: USXP) was a transportation and logistics service company and was registered in Nevada and headquartered in Boca Raton, Florida.[1] On August 31, 2007, Federal District Judge Gerard E. Lynch of the Southern District of New York, appointed a Receiver over the operations of Universal Express, Inc. and its subsidiaries. An appeal court date is set for October for Universal Express Officers to appeal the SEC ruling and take over of Universal Express in New York. The judge ordered Universal and its top officers to pay $21.9 million and barred them from future penny stock sales. [1]

Altomare was ordered to prison for civil contempt of court in April 2008.[2] As of May, 2008, he was resident in the Metropolitan Correctional Center, New York City.[3] Richard Altomare is currently out of prison for civil contempt, as no debtors prison exists in the united states for inability to pay a fine. He awiats his court case appeal against the securities and exchange commission.

go to www.usxp.com to confirm the above facts. Also court orders are available to prove the above is true and balanced not slanted like the present one. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Evangelistfighter (talk • contribs) 21:26, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

I've given this s.p.a. a first-level NPOV warning. --Orange Mike | Talk 22:57, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Rename article

I am thinking of renaming Timeline of Algebra into "Algebra Timeline. It should therefore be able to catch the attention of more that look at "Algebra." Would you recommend this change or reject it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Dale S. Satre (talk • contribs) 22:02, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

You could propose it on the discussion page and see what other editors think - right now it's unedited. Otherwise, just be bold. Cheers. Wisdom89 _{(T / ^C)} 22:36, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

I would ask the question: is this change consistent with other "timeline" pages. This Google search suggests that if we want to keep things consistent then we should leave the title as it is.—Noah 23:20, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

I suggest you simply create a Redirect page called "Albebra timeline". That way, anyone who selects "Algebra timeline" will be taken directly to Timeline of Algebra. Anyone who searches under "Algebra" will likely see "Algebra timeline" show up as one of the early options. Dolphin51 (talk) 03:41, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

I note that the user has gone ahead and moved it, just three minutes after posting a note on the discussion page seeking input.--92.41.182.34 (talk) 05:50, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

• I went ahead and relocated the article because I recieved the permission to do so. And besides, it is now in its own category.--Dale S. Satre 00:09, 19 September 2008 (UTC)