Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2008 September 23

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September 23

Assuming Good Faith

I'm still kind of confused as to what assuming good faith is. Like, I'm using Twinkle. What does the Rollback AGF thing mean? I thought it was something to use if a person was trying to help but they weren't helping WIkipedia with the edit, and they should be treated differently than vandals, but today I was told otherwise... could someone explain this to me in more detail? THe project page didn't help much. KJS77 Join the Revolution 00:15, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Well, yes that's the general idea. See WP:AGF. That particular edit was not clear vandalism, probably a good faith edit or a test. What you have done is correct (reverting it using 'rollback AGF' in twinkle). The message you have received is about using rollback. Rollback should not be used unless it is clearly vandalism, but using Twinkle is not the same as using rollback. I think the user who gave you the message must have misunderstood. Cheers. Chamal ^Talk ± 00:27, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Problem this afternoon

Hey, I'm pretty sure this is the wrong place, sorry, but I coudln't find anywhere else to post this. I tried to open Wikipedia today and got an error page from the Wikimedia foundation saying that was a problem, try back in a few minutes which didn't work so I tried every now and then over the course of an hour and still couldn't access the site. The error page said to report the problem and quote this code: "Request: GET http://en.wikipedia.org/, from 78.105.17.164 via knsq2.knams.wikimedia.org (squid/2.6.STABLE21) to () Error: ERR_SOCKET_FAILURE, errno (98) Address already in use at Mon, 22 Sep 2008 15:18:58 GMT". That's all, no question, just thought I'd let you guys know about it. Sorry about posting this here, but I couldn't find a better place to post this - I'd suggest making the system for reporting errors like this a little clearer. I didn't think it was a software bug so I didn't put it in that section, but maybe I should have. Thanks all the same. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.105.17.164 (talk) 01:12, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Server problem; see Wikipedia:Village pump (technical)#error. --—— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 01:17, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

We already have a system for reporting bugs; it's called Bugzilla. GO-PCHS-NJROTC ^(Messages) 03:05, 24 September 2008 (UTC)

New Article Creation & Posting

Hello,

I've just created a new article "Riedel Global Experts". The creation of the page was fine, but when I search for it, I can't find it until I go back to my account and see user:Riedel Global Experts.

Q#1 Is this posting in the process of being added to Wiki or Q#2 do I need to followup additional steps to have the article appear to the public?

Thank you. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Riedel Global Experts (talk • contribs) 01:32, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Where to start? You've created a userpage, not an article, about Reidel Global Experts. It looks very much like an advert, against Wikipedia's rules - rather than delete it myself, I've tagged it for another administrator to review. Your username is promotional, which is again inappropriate. Please don't use Wikipedia for advertising in the future. If you want to stay, please ask to change your username before this account is blocked. Regards, Bencherlite^Talk 01:41, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Yes, you really need to read WP:FAQ#BUSINESS. --—— Gadget850 (Ed) ^talk - 01:56, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

WP:FAQ/Business works better. PrimeHunter (talk) 02:01, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

net work operation

I want know working and operation of net —Preceding unsigned comment added by 218.248.68.63 (talk) 04:41, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

You might find what you are looking for in the article about Internet. If you cannot find the answer there, you can try asking your question at Wikipedia's Reference Desk. They will be glad to try to answer questions about anything in the universe (except about how to use Wikipedia, which is what this help desk is for). I hope this helps. Zain Ebrahim (talk) 06:14, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

A question was recently asked about how the Internet works, you can find it here. Good luck, Matt (Talk) 06:23, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Check an edit please

Could some kind editor please check this edit. I don't feel comfortable going to the site (I'm at work) that the IP added to see if it's a legit edit (official site of the subject) or not. Thanks, Dismas|^(talk) 06:33, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

I took a look at it, seems official enough, probably not a problem to have on the article. (It's pretty tame by internet standards, but you're probably better off staying away from it at work all the same.) AlexiusHoratius 07:16, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Thanks! Dismas|^(talk) 07:40, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Images that are on Commons: when should they have a page here?

I'm noticing that a lot of images that are actually at Commons are also "here" as well, in that they have a page that just consists of something like a category, but no file attached (an example: Image:Aplomado.JPG). Why do we need these pseudo-images here? Commons has both categories for sorting all files, and galleries for displaying an organized collection of good images. I suppose featured pictures can be an exception, but is there anything else that should have a page here? There isn't really any central place to discuss images (and get a response within any reasonable period of time) so I'm asking here instead. Do we even have a policy/guideline on this? Richard001 (talk) 06:54, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

You might want to look at WikiProject Moving free images to Wikimedia Commons LegoK^ontribsT^alkM 07:33, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

There don't seem to be any pages here that outline what to do in such cases. I notice a few of these ghost pages are former FPC nominations - it seems rather annoying that they didn't get automatically deleted afterwards. We need a policy on this, and I have raised it at the page you suggested, but at the moment I'm just going to try tagging them for deletion with {{ncd}} and seeing how things go. Richard001 (talk) 10:01, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

how to start writing?

Hi,

I just sign up at wikipedia,and actually id like to write about some designers profile to add on in wikipedia, But im little confused, where/how can i start to write the article.

Thank you so much.

Fullofthreads (talk) 07:28, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Please see Your first article.

1. Ensure that you have an account and you are logged in. If you don't have an account, create one
2. Make sure the subject is notable enough to have their own article
3. Find references
4. Make sure no article on the subject exists under a different title by typing the subject into the search box to the left (←) and clicking 'Search'
5. Type the page name in the search box to the left (←) and click 'Go'
6. Click 'Create this page'
7. Create the article, including all your references, making sure you adhere to the Manual of Style and our article layout guidelines
8. Be aware that Wikipedia deletes thousands of new articles for failing to adhere to our policies and guidelines. New articles by new users are at extra risk of deletion, due to new users' unfamiliarity with our rules. Consider gaining experience by editing existing articles before attempting to create new ones Dark Mage 07:30, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Jaygray3 (talk) 09:06, 23 September 2008 (UTC)Johnny Gray Bio Page

I want to edit this page. But I need to be a member of group it says. I am his son and want to add more to the page. Also add a picture as well.

Jaygray3 (talk) 09:06, 23 September 2008 (UTC)Johnny Gray III

What says that you need to be a member of a group? I just edited the Johnny Gray article, I'm assuming that's the article that you're talking about, and I didn't get any sort of warning about a group.

You're free to edit the page although you can't just go adding anything that you happen to know about your father. Whatever information that you add should have a reliable source. Also, your edits may be suspect since you represent a conflict of interest. It is possible to edit articles about family members but generally people find it hard to maintain a neutral point of view. Dismas|^(talk) 09:17, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

The database was locked a few minutes ago. Perhaps that's what confused the OP. Zain Ebrahim (talk) 09:24, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

rename my article

i worte an article named: Concord reaserch center.

due to spelling error and inaccuracy, i want to cahnge his name but i was unsuccessful in doing it.

the new name i want to give it is- Concord Research Center for Integration of International Law in Israel

thank you, ariel —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ariel Yosef (talk • contribs) 10:11, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

In general this is done with the move 'tab' but your account is to fresh to do that. Now it seems to me that 'in Israel' is not really part of the institute's name nor would adding it comply with our naming conventions. so should the title be " Concord Research Center for Integration of International Law"?--Tikiwont (talk) 12:50, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

I've moved the article to Concord research center. Let me know if this helps. TN‑X-Man 12:51, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

congo

what are pygmes and bantu negrors —Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.163.9.107 (talk) 10:17, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Have you tried Wikipedia's Reference Desk? They specialize in knowledge questions and will try to answer any question in the universe (except how to use Wikipedia, since that is what this Help Desk is for). Just follow the link, select the relevant section, and ask away. I hope this helps. Algebraist 10:19, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Comments finding their way to /Comments

Why do anonymous users leave comments at /Comments pages, eg Talk:Philip Henry Gosse/Comments?--Commander Keane (talk) 11:57, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Hmm, it's probably a test page I proposed that subpage to be removed under criteria CSD G2 and have left a deletion template on it. Dark Mage 12:09, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

It's not a test page. It's transcluded into the talk page by {{WPBiography}}. The anon must have clicked on the 'leave comments here' link. Algebraist 12:27, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Specifically it is a sub-page for comments about the article assessment only. I am going to blank that comment as it is not related to such assessment. – ukexpat (talk) 16:10, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Communicate before editing

I am a new as a member but a regular user. In looking at the page for my hometown, Cumberland, MD, I find the history section to be very lacking. I'm a long time history buff of the area and would like to rewrite the history section. BUT I don't want to just jump in and do that. I would rather communicate with whoever created the page and ask their blessing. And also since I'm new I was hoping that person would help me with the technical part as well. How can I find out who I should try to communicate with? Or should I just go ahead and do my edit and see if anyone objects? —Preceding unsigned comment added by WoofOH (talk • contribs) 13:24, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

You can find out the page creator and major contributors from the page history. Remember that you have to add references to the information you're adding. You can discuss about your edits at the article's talk page. For further help, you can go to WP:WikiProject Maryland, WP:WikiProject Cities or WP:WikiProject West Virginia and ask for any help and guidance on the talk pages. Cheers. Chamal ^Talk ± 13:40, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

The jury's still out on this one. What happens if you post your recommendation on the talk page and no one responds after a week? Me, I prefer the Wikipedia:BOLD, revert, discuss cycle. Zain Ebrahim (talk) 14:13, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

You should at least check the discussion page to ensure that what you want to enter hasn't been discussed and removed previously. -- kainaw™ 14:26, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

As Zain Ebrahim111 notes, in some cases, posting recommendations and waiting for feedback can take a week or more. On the other hand, in some cases being bold can lead to acrimonious discussions that sap the time and energy of editors for weeks. It depends a lot on the nature of the article and the edits. Also on whether you have the patience to wait for feedback or prefer the "acrimonious discussion" route. Wanderer57 (talk) 15:09, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

smile: don't worry - talk page discussions aren't always acrimonious! and a sort of "compromise route" that i find works pretty well is to read the talk page, then explain my proposed changes there, then wait a day or two to see if there are any reactions before going ahead and making my changes to the article itself. works for me ... usually 8) Sssoul (talk) 16:01, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Sssoul is correct that not all discussions are acrimonious. Most are not, fortunately. Those that are can be doozies. In the case of the history of your hometown, you are likely in a very good position to know if there is potential for controversy. Wanderer57 (talk) 16:32, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Acrimony is more of a risk when a topic is controversial (e.g., Abortion, Creationism, almost any Religion, much of Politics, etc.), or when your edits substantially change or remove someone else's edits. Filling obvious gaps in an article with new content which is well-sourced and clearly relevant content is less likely to fan anyone's flames - but of course you never know until you try. It's almost always better for new users to discuss what they want to do before plunging ahead. If you get no response to your talk page comments in a week, that may mean nobody with an interest in the article is watching that talk page. You could then look at the article's history to identify some other substantial contributors to the article, and leave notes on their user talk pages asking them to look at your article talk page comments. Be aware that as a new user editor, there is probably much you won't know yet about the inner workings of Wikipedia. One of the most important things to learn early is how to provide sources for the content you add to Wikipedia. Additions that come with reliable sources are less likely to arouse other editors in a bad way. See: WP:RS, WP:V, WP:CITE, WP:FOOT, and WP:CITET. Read those pages carefully, and don't expect everything to make sense right away. Understanding Wikipedia requires study, practice, and persistence. --Teratornis (talk) 16:44, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Sadly, often enough, you can attempt to discuss a change to a low traffic article on the talk page, only to be unanswered for weeks or months, then as you finally go ahead with the plan, someone wakes up and reverts within two minutes with two words in the edit summary ... Many editors out there seem to assume as long as you're not actively edit warring, then whatever you say on the talk page can be safely ignored and the content of the article is not in dispute. Equendil Talk 11:19, 24 September 2008 (UTC)

glass icons

how do i go about finding out what it is regards —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.35.177.148 (talk) 14:14, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Have you tried Wikipedia's Reference Desk? They specialize in knowledge questions and will try to answer any question in the universe (except how to use Wikipedia, since that is what this Help Desk is for). Just follow the link, select the relevant section, and ask away. I hope this helps. Algebraist 14:18, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Before asking the Reference desk, you could try asking {{Google}}:

• Search the Web with Google for: glass icons

That finds a number of Web pages which contain this phrase. The first thing to note from the search results is that you need to clarify what sort of icons you mean. Icon can refer to several different things, including: religious artwork, or a graphical user interface component in computing. If you mean the latter, you must specify (or perhaps decide on) an operating system which provides these glass icons, or on which you may install them. That is, it probably doesn't make sense to talk about those sorts of glass icons in isolation, but only as components in a specific operating system (for example, Mac OS X, or maybe you refer to Windows Aero). At the moment, Wikipedia does not appear to have an article specifically about Glass icons, which is why those words appear as a red link. Searching Wikipedia finds a few articles which contain the two words separately:

• Search Wikipedia with Google for: glass icons

--Teratornis (talk) 16:27, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Introduction of Potato in India

I am keen to know when and who introducted the farming of potatoes in India? There is sopme confusion of the use of batata (the local term for potato and also for sweet-potatoes).

Any inputs are welcome. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.183.150.97 (talk) 16:18, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Have you tried the Humanities section of Wikipedia's Reference Desk? They specialize in answering knowledge questions there; this help desk is only for questions about using Wikipedia. For your convenience, here is the link to post a question there: click here. I hope this helps. Algebraist 16:21, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

But first you could read the Potato article, specifically Potato#History which mentions the first unambiguous reference to potato cultivation in India. (This talk of potatoes makes me hungry.) --Teratornis (talk) 16:31, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

How to use Template:Newdelrev?

How the heck do I use the Template:Newdelrev for an article in the main namespace? The information given at WP:DRV says:

{{subst:Newdelrev|pg=PAGENAME|ns=NAMESPACE of page (optional)|reason=UNDELETE_REASON}} ~~~~

If I try to use this as {{subst:Newdelrev|pg=Entirely non-notable article|reason=Undelete this because I say so!}} ~~~~, it gives:

====[[:

Entirely non-notable article]]====

Entirely non-notable article (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (restore | cache | AfD)

Undelete this because I say so!

On the other hand, if I try to use it as {{subst:Newdelrev|pg=Entirely non-notable article|ns=Article|reason=Undelete this because I say so!}} ~~~~, it gives:

Article:Entirely non-notable article

Entirely non-notable article (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (restore | cache | AfD)

Undelete this because I say so! JIP | Talk 17:10, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

The link to Article:Entirely non-notable article is not the same as Entirely non-notable article. Is the template broken or do I simply not know how to use it? JIP | Talk 17:10, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

I played around a little and I can't figure it out either. Maybe the template is broken. The history shows recent work. Complex templates are very easy to break, for example when an editor is adding a specific feature or fixing a specific problem, but does not check all the other cases to insure they still work. One way to see how to use a template is to check the backlinks, in this case Special:WhatLinksHere/Template:Newdelrev. Ordinarily one looks at some transclusions of the template to see how other people are using it. Unfortunately, {{Newdelrev}} doesn't have any transclusions at the moment, most likely because the template insists that you substitute rather than transclude it (this is yet another reason why I dislike template substitution - it destroys the audit trail by which you can learn how to use a template by inspecting actual examples). You could try asking some of the other editors who have recently tweaked the template; either ask on Template talk:Newdelrev, or ask on the user talk pages of the most recent editor(s). You could also try copying an old revision of the template to a user sandbox page and see if it used to handle the article namespace correctly. --Teratornis (talk) 18:31, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Is "Article:" technically a namespace? That parameter is optional, after all. --Alinnisawest,^{Dalek Empress} (extermination requests here) 20:54, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

The last time I tried to use it I had to edit the DRV page again after subst the template to properly format the DRV, so it's either broken or I have the same user error problem with it that you do! – ukexpat (talk) 21:10, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

For undeleting an article your first try is the way to go; did it not work for you? “Article” is not the name of the main namespace: ns would be something like User, Wikipedia, or Image; those are names of namespaces. —teb728 t c 00:26, 24 September 2008 (UTC)

This is a good point. The template breaks for articles. Stifle (talk) 09:37, 24 September 2008 (UTC)

Delete an account

How do I delete my account? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jimmer book (talk • contribs) 18:37, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

For GFDL reasons, I am afraid you cannot. You can however exercise your right to vanish. – ukexpat (talk) 18:44, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

economy

if countries in the middle east stopped producing oil,how might that affect the economy in the united states? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.193.185.211 (talk) 20:36, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

The Help Desk is for asking questions about Wikipedia, but you could ask your question here, at the Humanities Reference Desk. Remember, however, that we don't do homework for you. --Alinnisawest,^{Dalek Empress} (extermination requests here) 20:56, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

If petroleum is a finite resource (as the vast majority of geologists believe; only a tiny minority believe in an Abiogenic petroleum origin, whereby the supply of oil might be vastly greater than mainstream geology claims), then it's not a question of "if," but "when" the oil-exporting nations will stop exporting oil. (The countries of the Middle East do not actually "produce" oil, they extract it from the ground. Common industry parlance refers to oil "production" but this is a bit of a misnomer.) For example, Indonesia was for decades an important oil exporter, but its "production" has declined and its domestic consumption has increased, and Indonesia is no longer a net exporter of petroleum. See Peak oil, Mitigation of peak oil, 2000s energy crisis, Hirsch report, and Export Land Model. As to how a (sudden) Middle East oil shutoff would affect the United States, consider that the U.S. imports more than half of the oil it consumes (although much is from nations outside the Middle East, such as Canada and Mexico), about 70% of U.S. oil consumption goes to transportation fuel, and transportation in the U.S. depends on petroleum for more than 95% of its energy. Because oil is a fungible commodity and is economical to ship in supertankers, the global market for petroleum is one of the more efficient and interconnected markets. This means that a severe shortage of oil in one part of the world impacts the rest of the world. The first result of a sudden, sustained Middle East shutoff would be a skyrocketing increase in the price of oil, and this would probably have dire effects on the global economy, not just in the U.S., although the U.S. would certainly feel the bite due to its heavy automobile dependency. For an example of a country that has already gone through this kind of traumatic reduction in oil supply, see Cuba's Special Period, which Peak oil enthusiasts cite as a harbinger for what everybody else may go through eventually as world oil "production" begins its inevitable decline - unless people can rebuild their economies quickly enough to run on something other than petroleum. --Teratornis (talk) 22:17, 23 September 2008 (UTC)