Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2011 September 24

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September 24

Reference question

Did either David H. Koch or Charles G. Koch ever serve in the military? At the time they would have been eligible for military service, late 1950s and early 1960, there was a universal draft. If they did not serve, why didn't they? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.32.124.37 (talk) 02:46, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

Have you tried Wikipedia's Reference Desk? They specialize in knowledge questions and will try to answer just about any question in the universe (except how to use Wikipedia, since that is what this Help Desk is for). Just follow the link, select the relevant section, and ask away. I hope this helps. Singularity42 (talk) 03:03, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

an edited post was submitted

I tried to edit a post and I was removed... I am sorry about that. can you please tell me exactly what I did wrong so i do not do that again? (Redacted)Thank you very much it was to do with LED lights and grow lights. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dan Wilcox (talk • contribs) 04:09, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

Wikipedia is not a platform for advertising LEDs.Jasper Deng (talk) 04:12, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

Assistance with Being Born Again Couture article - it seems that everybody doesn't know how to help

Hi Wikipedia Help desk,

Obsidian Soul suggested I contact you regarding the banners on http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Being_Born_Again_Couture_Fashion_Show Apparently only you can remove the tags once you've ascertained that the issues have been dealt with, says Obsidian Soul. I have asked Bonadea for help, but they have't answered my messages which were written 3 weeks ago, 2 weeks ago and 1 week ago. MarcusBritish has said that he doesn't know enough about fashion and art to comment on the show. I posted a message on the Wikipedia arts board, but no-one has edited the show.

I have addressed these questions fully, but I'm just copying and pasting the text so you can see:

This is addressed to whoever wrote the big banners with the "may contain wording that merely promotes the subject", "a major contributor to this article appears to have a close connection with its subject" and "may contain inappropriate or misinterpreted citations that do not verify the text": As per Bonadea's comments: "...put in the "A major contributor to this article appears to have a close connection with its subject" tag, what are their reasons for believing this - I don't like "hit and run" tagging - they need to open up a dialogue in the discussion page and express their concerns, otherwise the tag serves no purpose other than to deface the article. Can you please address this matter in their talk page as they appear to have added a few of these 4 banners, which suggests they know more about the topic than they're willing to contribute - which is a waste of time if they don't intend to give clearer feedback."

A major contributor to this article appears to have a close connection with its subject. It may require cleanup to comply with Wikipedia's content policies, particularly neutral point of view. Please discuss further on the talk page. (August 2011)

RESPONSE: I am very knowledgeable about this topic and hence am writing the wikipedia page for it. Short of one of the fashion designers or artists or models writing the page and giving it their "spin" and giving it their promotional point of view, I am writing the page from what I feel is an objective point of view and a very neutral point of view. Ma®©usBritish and Bonadea have helped me edit out all the things which are inappropriate and not to do with the article.

This article may contain wording that merely promotes the subject without imparting verifiable information. Please remove or replace such wording, unless you can cite independent sources that support the characterization.

RESPONSE: I have referenced it properly and taken out all descriptive words. Ma®©usBritish and Bonadea have helped me. Please take out "This article may contain wording that merely promotes the subject without imparting verifiable information. Please remove or replace such wording, unless you can cite independent sources that support the characterization."

This article may contain inappropriate or misinterpreted citations that do not verify the text. Please help improve this article by checking for inaccuracies. (help, talk, get involved!) (August 2011)

RESPONSE: I have cited all references properly and you can check - there is nothing that can be misinterpreted or misinformed. Ma®©usBritish and Bonadea have noted that there is little they can do considering that they have limited knowledge about fashion shows.

I would like to have these 3 banners removed please. When will they be removed?

Thank you.

Domenico.y (talk) 04:32, 24 September 2011 (UTC) Domenico.y

It obviously is not written in a neutral tone - it seems your conflict of interest is indeed becoming a problem there. I'm not knowledgeable otherwise, so I cannot check source accuracy.Jasper Deng (talk) 04:40, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

Hi Jasper Deng,

In my opinion, it is written in a neutral tone and I have cited the reasons why above. Please ask somebody to view it and edit it if need be and remove the unsightly banners. When could I expect the reviewer to contact me please? Many thanks. Domenico.y (talk) 05:41, 24 September 2011 (UTC) Domenico.y

Unfortunately, that is the problem with a confluct of interest; you think it is written in a neutral tone, but other editors disagree. Remember that this is a encyclopedia and one of the core policies is that articles should be written from a neutral point of view. Another core policy is that articles should be based on information that already appears elsewhere in reliable sources; that often means that primary sources like http://www.beingbornagain.net/ are treated with suspicion (in my opinion, that doen't mean you cannot use them, but if you can find the same thing in the Sydney Morning Herald or The Age for example, that would be preferred). The banners may be unsightly, but until the problems with the article are fix, they will hav to stay. Astronaut (talk) 13:59, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

Thanks Astronaut. I was wondering who can assist me rather in editing this page http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Being_Born_Again_Couture_Fashion_Show Can you suggest someone please? Thanks. Domenico.y (talk) 14:06, 24 September 2011 (UTC) Domenico.y

Really, it's best if you do it yourself then have someone else look it over to see if the problems have been fixed. If they have, they will remove them. The tags all have instructions on what the problems are and how you might be able to fix them. Unfortunately we are all volunteers with limited time, scattered interests and expertise, and there really are far more pressing problems elsewhere.-- Obsidi♠n Soul 14:17, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

After going in to see what I could do for the article, I am coming to the opinion that it is unsalvageable spam: see my journey on the talk page. If somebody else thinks they can mend it, be my guest. --ColinFine (talk) 16:31, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

Uploading pictures

I have looked everywhere on the website to upload pictures but I can't find out how. How do you upload pictures to wikipedia? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Voyager8907 (talk • contribs) 04:53, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

We have Special:Upload for that. However, you will have to become confirmed or autoconfirmed before you can upload pictures. FYI, the vast majority of images on the Internet aren't acceptable for Wikipedia. See WP:NFCC for instructions on copyrighted content. You will have to specify a license under which the picture you upload may be used under.04:58, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

life duration of an article. Can an article be removed?

Hi What is the life duration of an article? Two years ago I posted an article about the Belgian photographer Oscar Schellekens. When I look now it has suddenly disapeared. I can't find it though the wiki search... Am I doing something wrong or is it possible that articles can be removed from Wikipedia Thanks Daniel — Preceding unsigned comment added by Danielschellmus (talk • contribs) 08:19, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

Articles can be removed for various reasons as described in the Wikipedia:Deletion policy. But the deletion log says there has never been an article with the exact name "Oscar Schellekens" at the English-language Wikipedia. There was one at the French-language Wikipedia, though, which was deleted after this discussion. Could that have been the page you submitted? -- John of Reading (talk) 08:36, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

Copy right infringement?

I am being asked to create a wikipedia page on my chosen topic by my college professor. we are to only use scholarly databases ie ebscohost/google scholar. ALL the articles are specifically marked that "Copyright of (publisher name)is the property of (publisher name) and its content may not be copied or emailed to multiple sites or posted to a listserv without the copyright holder's express written permission. However, users may print, download, or email articles for individual use." if i use this article is it copyright infringement if i post it on wikipedia with a reference to the article publisher and authors. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.63.249.3 (talk) 17:02, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

Yes, it is, if copied verbatim or closely paraphrased. You need to put the information in your own words, then cite the paper. —Jeremy v^_^v ^{Components:V S M} 17:04, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

You would do well to read your first article. It may be a challenge to satisfy your professor's requirements and those of Wikipedia. --ColinFine (talk) 18:14, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

I disagree with that latter statement, Colin. One of the goals of the assignment is to see how well you write, not just how well you can find references. It's trivial to write a paper based on scholarly research without cut'n'pasting from those source articles. The goal is to write on a topic that can be supported (or debated) by multiple authors' analyses and collections of data rather than just to collect a "X says Y" set of bullet-points. Students and professionals alike do this type of task all the time and have since the dawn of academia. On the flip side, copyright infringement is copyright infringement and it makes no difference if the target assignment is a wikipedia article for the public or just an essay or term-paper that nobody but the prof would see. Wikipedia:School and university projects involves dozens or maybe hundreds of students writing cited (but non-infringing) content on all sorts of topics every semester. DMacks (talk) 18:33, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

Let me mirror what DMacks has said: What you should always do is

1) Read the scholarly works to find out what they say, and get the ideas they are talking about in your head

2) Write in your own words, not merely by copying the words of others, or changing minor word order, but your own completely and genuinely new text which you have wholly created all by yourself, about the ideas you read about

3) Then cite the scholarly papers where you got the ideas.

That is, you need to BOTH write your own text which is your own creation (to avoid copyright violations) and you need to also cite the scholarly works where the ideas originated (to avoid plagiarism). Text needs to be original, and ideas need to be identified with who came up with them. While this is also important to Wikipedia, it should be how you write literally everything you write in your studies, whether it is something you submit on paper to your professor, or as a Wikipedia article. --Jayron32 02:25, 25 September 2011 (UTC)

I agree with everything which DMack and Jayron have said, but I think they have both omitted an important point. In academic writing generally you are expected to present at least a synthesis, if not full-blown original research, and while these will perhaps not be required in an undergraduate paper they would be looked on favorably. In Wikipedia they are not permitted. This is what I meant when I said it may be challenging: for a student paper OR and synthesis are permitted, even encouraged: in Wikipedia they are not. --ColinFine (talk) 11:55, 25 September 2011 (UTC)

How to determine if an article is in a category

Is there a parser-function or template to test if an article is in a certain category? For example, I'd like to say at the top of a featured article:

 {{#if:{{ArticleInCat|All articles with unsourced statements}}
   |{{Ambox|text=Please help improve the sourcing of this featured article}}
 }}
 

DMacks (talk) 17:09, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

This cannot be done. It would for example require mw:Extension:CategoryFunctions or mw:Extension:CategoryTests but Special:Version shows they are not installed. PrimeHunter (talk) 00:34, 25 September 2011 (UTC)

Thanks. DMacks (talk) 07:58, 25 September 2011 (UTC)

Question

Would Template edits that do stuff like this one does usually need consensus? LikeLakers2 (talk | Sign my guestbook!) 18:24, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

I think that provided you know what you are doing, Bold, Revert, Discuss holds even in template space. Two other suggestions:

• You posted at Wikipedia:Village pump (idea lab); I think a better venue for template issues would be Wikipedia:Village pump (technical), since that page is watched by the template experts who would be more likely to have an opinion.
• You posted your idea by editing the template and then reverting it. A better plan for next time would be to post the new version in a sandbox, perhaps Template:Table/sandbox, so that interested editors could try the new version out for themselves. -- John of Reading (talk) 08:53, 26 September 2011 (UTC)

Difficulty setting up my wikipedia account

I tried to set up a wikipedia account for myself. I tried using two different e-mail adresses that I have for myself. I could not set up the account because it kept saying"there is no user by that name.YES, THERE ABSOLUTELY IS A USER FOR THESE TWO NAMES-ME!!! I have used these two e-mail accounts to sign up for other things on the internet,so why did it say "there is no user by that name?" Please give me a SIMPLE AND EASY WAY to set up a wikipedia account. I hate all this confusion and things being complicated.Please respond. Thank You.18:32, 24 September 2011 (UTC)~

Go to Special:UserLogin/signup, enter a username and password you want to use, maybe enter some other information, then click "create account". It sounds like you are assuming that a login you created on some other site would automatically work on wikipedia, which is not the case--very few websites share login information or have any other sort of synchronization between each other. DMacks (talk) 18:41, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

If it says "there is no used by that name" then it thinks, for some reason, that you are trying to reference an existing account, not create a new one. Please check which options you are picking. --ColinFine (talk) 11:58, 25 September 2011 (UTC)

Alternatively request an account at WP:ACC. Maybe you get more help there! mabdul 17:04, 27 September 2011 (UTC)

grammatical correction needed

The "crime school" page, has a dangling modifier in its last sentence: "Once the kids are back at the school, and the police arrive, Braden delivers evidence about Morgan's fraud, and he is then arrested". To whom does "he" refer, Morgan or Braden?

I would correct it if I knew the answer, but I don't know the answer, and I don't have time to watch the movie to figure out the answer. Hiasmanaha17 (talk) 20:04, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

I found this site via Google and it says both are arrested. I don't know if the information on that site is correct though or if it can be regarded as a reliable source. Toshio Yamaguchi (talk) 08:26, 25 September 2011 (UTC)

I suggest you either put a comment on the talk page, or add the tag {{Clarify}} to the article itself, just after the sentence which is unclear. (Or both). --ColinFine (talk) 12:07, 25 September 2011 (UTC)

Friday Night Club

Wikipedia

May someone put in a request for a page for the "Friday Night Club"? I tried to navigate through the wikipedia website myself to find out how to put in a page request, but I found it difficult to do so.

Thank you

(Redacted.) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.113.232.170 (talk) 20:10, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

You can submit a request at Wikipedia:Requested articles. Simply follow the instructions on that page to submit your request. And try to include reliable sources with your request, as this will increase the chances to have the topic included in Wikipedia. Toshio Yamaguchi (talk) 08:48, 25 September 2011 (UTC)

Translating a wiki article into another language

Hello, I am the creator of the Siegfried L. Kratochwil page and was hoping to receive some help with translating this page into German. Since Siegfried L. Kratochwil is an Austrian painter it is obvious that this page also be available in German. Since I originally wrote the page in German, I have an exact translation ready to go. Everything else remains the same. Should I simply create a new article entry under the German Wikipedia or is there a way to just translate the existing page? Is this done in the "contributions" tab after I log into my account? Thank you for your assistance. The Wikipedia explanation for translating a page is not the clearest and it appears to be geared towards third party translators only and not for creators of the page.Aryanassadi (talk) 15:55, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

Since you already have the German version of the page, paste it here to create "Siegfried L. Kratochwil" on the German Wikipedia. Goodvac (talk) 23:07, 24 September 2011 (UTC)

Thank you for your help. Everything worked out except for the links to my images. Any idea why that is? Since the images are in the Commons file shouldn'y I just be able to reference the same file name? Thanks again!Aryanassadi (talk) 15:26, 29 September 2011 (UTC)