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Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2021 June 1

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June 1

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Confusing AfD instructions

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Hello, I admit that, although an old Wikipedia editor, this is one of my first attempts to nominate an article for deletion, and I have been having some difficulties understanding the step III in the Wikipedia:Articles for deletion#How to nominate a single page for deletion. When I went to [1], it turns out it doesn't work exactly how I expected it to work by inserting {{subst:afd3 | pg=NominationName}} to the top of the log at: [2]. Any ideas what I am doing wrong? Thanks! --- ❖ SilentResident ❖ (talk ✉ | contribs ✎) 00:09, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

First I tried {{subst:afd3 | pg=Turkish Genocide}} but its preview was broken, before deciding to give a try with {{subst:afd3 | pg=Turkish Genocide (2nd Nomination)}}, which too has broken preview and doesn't show up on the log properly. My impression from reading the AfD instructions, is that {{subst:afd3 | pg=Turkish Genocide}} is the one that has to be added to that log, but it doesn't appear to work. What am I missing? --- ❖ SilentResident ❖ (talk ✉ | contribs ✎) 00:17, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Evidently something is not working properly with the procedure. Adding the {{subst:afd3 | pg=Turkish Genocide}} to the log: [3], results into a log entry that has its format broken and messed up: [4] (broken formatting i.e. missing section title, etc) --- ❖ SilentResident ❖ (talk ✉ | contribs ✎) 00:30, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@Nizolan:Thanks for helping with the AfD. Despite your welcoming efforts, it still doesn't show up properly (still missing section title). Any ideas what may be causing that?--- ❖ SilentResident ❖ (talk ✉ | contribs ✎) 00:34, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Edit: Purging the cache, solved the display issues with the missing section title and such! Nevermind and again thank you very very much. --- ❖ SilentResident ❖ (talk ✉ | contribs ✎) 00:37, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
(edit conflict) @SilentResident: There were two problems: you linked the 1st nomination at the main AfD page, rather than your own, and your nomination page was missing the {{Afd2}} structure. It should be fixed now. The details of how to format a nomination are at WP:AFDHOWTO, in parts II and III of the orange table. —Nizolan (talk · c.) 00:39, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@SilentResident: I always preview each step of an AfD nomination before posting and reread the instructions if it doesn't work. If that fails you are welcome to come here again. Wikipedia:Twinkle users say that it makes the process easy, but I haven't tried it myself. TSventon (talk) 00:47, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Oh, I see. I thought linking the 1st nomination was remedied by my next edit linking the 2nd nomination. Was caught by surprise to find that the article used to exist at some point in the very distant past (2004), already having been nominated for deletion back then. Hence I hasted to repeat the procedures but with the 2nd nomination instead. Thanks to both of you for your help and advices, and sorry if this whole progress got me confused. I have seen some editors using that Twinkle thing, perhaps it is time for me to give it a try too. Good day --- ❖ SilentResident ❖ (talk ✉ | contribs ✎) 00:52, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Four out of five deletionists surveyed endorse Twinkle. (The fifth is on a Wikibreak.) It saves a tremendous amount of time and trouble. Clarityfiend (talk) 06:45, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
We absolutely do. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 12:28, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Use Twinkle for this kind of stuff. Seriously, I would not even attempt to nominate a page for deletion without Twinkle - that also goes for making a report to somewhere like WP:ANEW or WP:SPI. It presents you with a form, you will in the boxes it can't work out for itself, and presto - job's done. GirthSummit (blether) 12:40, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@SilentResident: not a Twinkle user myself, and I have always found the instructions confusing. I've been working on a replacement doc, at least for the core part of the steps, but have had to set it aside for a while, due to other pressing matters. But here's a sneak preview:
Deletion process cheat sheet for Turkish Genocide
Disclaimer: this is still in test, and should be used with caution until verified.

This is a step-by-step summary of how to nominate a single page, Turkish Genocide, for deletion, using the Wikipedia:Articles for deletion procedure. For additional details, see WP:AFDHOWTO.

The article "Turkish Genocide" does not exist. You cannot nominate it for deletion. It has been nominated for deletion before under this name. Consider using Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Turkish Genocide (third nomination)[a] as the NominationName, but see this important caveat.
  1. Place the deletion tag on the article:
    • First, sign in; you won't be able to complete the process if you don't. IP users are unable to use this process.
    • Insert {{subst:afd1}} at the top of Turkish Genocide. (no parameters)
    • Include in the edit summary: AfD: Nominated for deletion; see [[Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Turkish Genocide (third nomination)]].
    • Do not mark the edit as minor. Save page. View the page again, and look for "Preloaded debate" link.
  2. Create deletion discussion page: (see WP:AFDHOW)
    • click "Preloaded debate" in the AfD page to create Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Turkish Genocide
    • Add {{subst:afd2 |pg=Turkish Genocide |cat=Category |text=Deletion reason}} ~~~~
    • Use edit summary Creating deletion discussion for [[Turkish Genocide]] and save.
  3. Add article to deletion log:
    • find the current deletion log,[b] and open it for editing.
      right now, the current log is: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Log/2024 December 3[c]
    • add {{subst:afd3}} to the top of the list at the current deletion log
    how do I do that?

    <!-- Add new entries to the TOP of the following list -->
    {{subst:afd3 |pg=NominationName}} <!-- YOUR ENTRY HERE -->
    {{Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Underground basket-weaving}}
    {{Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/History of Outer Slobovia}}
    {{Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Bar coaster flipping}}

    • use edit summary: Listing [[Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Turkish Genocide]], and save the page.
  4. Notify users and WikiProjects:
  5. Update deletion log:
    • go back to the same deletion log[g] you added the article to earlier
    • add one {{subst:delsort|Topic|~~~~}} template to the nomination for each WikiProject you notified.
      This lets log viewers know what projects were notified, and prevents duplicate effort.

Notes

  1. ^ This nomination name should be a red link. Is it blue? Then there's a problem; see documentation.
  2. ^ Deletion logs have the filename format [[Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Log/yyyy Month dd]]. The day is not zero-padded; so the log filename on New Year's Day ends "January 1" (not, "January 01").
  3. ^ You may wish to refresh the page, to ensure you are pointing to the correct log.
  4. ^ The page creator can be found by examining the page History, and clicking the 'oldest' link at the top of the page.
  5. ^ The main editors of the page can be found by going to the History tab, and clicking Page Statistics at the top of the page; then 'Top editors'.
  6. ^ Which WikiProjects should you notify? The ones listed (usually) at the top of the Talk page of the article.
  7. ^ The deletion log has today's date on it, and rolls over to the next day at midnight UTC; be sure to use the same log as you did before.
SilentResident, I *really* need suggestions from other users who are new to the Afd process, and what they find confusing. You are perfectly placed to do that. If you can please go through this, and note anything which is unclear, or any needed additions to make it more understadable, I'd appreciate it. Please make them at the talk page of the Draft, or at my Talk page. Thanks, Mathglot (talk) 18:05, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Mathglot, serious question: is there something stopping you using Twinkle? For me it's a no-brainer, but I know you have a brain so I'm interested to hear your take on this. Twinkle allows me to nominate any article for deletion without worrying about any technical steps - the only steps that require thought are typing up the rationale and choosing the deletion categories. I assume there's a reason people don't use it, but I don't know what it is. GirthSummit (blether) 18:12, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Girth Summit, probably the same reason I have AWB downloaded (for some purpose that I'll have to check my own notes about) but haven't used it yet; just general overload, I guess. In the case of Afd, at some point I worked out how to do it, using a text-based cheat sheet I created for myself, and became comfortable with that. But I always thought the instructions were confusing, and started to play around with how to fix that; at some point, it became an exercise in improving my template skills. In any case, you're right; it sounds a whole lot easier on Twinkle, and we should probably just encourage users to do that. The Afd page does currently have a mention of Twinkle, but I'm not sure if I really paid any attention to it before; I probably skimmed right over it, heading straight for the instructions. Maybe it should be boxed up, or otherwise highlighted, to make it stand out more, at least for new users who don't have banner blindness from the page yet. Thanks, Mathglot (talk) 18:27, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Mathglot, in that case, please take my recommendation: try it. I am not very technically minded, but installing and using Twinkle is a doddle. Like, much easier to figure out than doing any of this stuff manually. It's not a separate application, you just enable it and your browser gives you another drop-down menu allowing you to do stuff like nominate to AfD, add CSD tags, etc. (If you have a mop, it will even block users r protect pages for you, filling in the paperwork automatically every timr). I honestly can't imagine doing my daily tasks without it, and I promise it's not a big deal to start using. Come over to the dark (but twinkly) side... GirthSummit (blether) 18:37, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, of course, I can gladly help simplifying the descriptions in the AfD tutorial, by making a draft with the points I felt (at least for me) to be the most confusing and will ping you once I am done. --- ❖ SilentResident ❖ (talk ✉ | contribs ✎) 18:42, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
(edit conflict) @SilentResident:, thanks. Just to be clear, I'm looking for feedback on the wording in the Draft:Template that you see above, when you click "show" on the collapse bar. I had the same problems as you with the original tutorial at Afd, that's why I fiddled with it to create a new version at Draft:Deletion process cheat sheet, which is the generic version of the new version without a specific article in mind. The "power" version is when it's tailored for a specific article, like "Turkish genocide", as you can see in the collapse bar above. You can leave comments at Draft talk:Deletion process cheat sheet in a new section. (Needless to say, if the original tutorial at WP:AFDHOWTO is better than the Draft in some aspects, feel free to say that, too.) Thanks, Mathglot (talk) 19:11, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

+1 to what Girth Summit is saying. You don't have to know anything the least bit technical to use Twinkle for deletion nominations or tons of other stuff. It's a great tool and super easy to use. Beeblebrox (talk) 18:52, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Mathglot, I checked your Draft, above, and I dare to say it is WAY better than the old AfD tutorial, as it makes the procedures easier to understand and follow. Frankly, it is your draft that helped me now clear the confusion over AfD's procedures, and particularly the 3rd step which was the one that had me confused the most. Thank you very much! Edit: and I can't think of any feedback to provide to you, since the draft already seems good to me as is. --- ❖ SilentResident ❖ (talk ✉ | contribs ✎) 01:37, 3 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Template creation

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How do I create a template? Wallglobemat (talk) 00:45, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Wallglobemat: There is a lot of information at Wikipedia:Templates, but it would help us provide a better answer if you could let us know what type of template you are interested in creating. GoingBatty (talk) 02:03, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Election fraud

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In some countries, false claims of electoral fraud are used to undermine democracy and legitimate elections. Examples would be Donald Trump in the 2020 USA presidential election and the 2021 coup in Myanmar.

What is this phenomenon called? Does Wikipedia have an article on it? I was looking for more information and examples on Wikipedia, but could not find, so I tried to add a sentence to the Electoral fraud article but the sentence got deleted. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 219.74.217.15 (talk • contribs) 04:04, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know of a general term, but there are more specific articles like Republican reactions to Donald Trump's claims of 2020 election fraud. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 09:29, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Your addition was reverted by Rosguill, who wrote "if you can provide sources detailing this phenomenon, it would be a good addition to the body of the article, but isn't appropriate to add without a citation to the lead at this time". See Wikipedia:Citing sources and Help:Referencing for beginners. Kleinpecan (talk) 10:44, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
The nearest term that I can think of is Delegitimisation - X201 (talk) 13:06, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
219.74.217.15, Following up on X201's suggestion, a search for delegitimisation of elections turns up plenty of good sources, including one which possibly yields a good, general title that could fit the bill for what you are talking about, i.e., "Election interference". Here are some sources for that term:
Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL
The current article on Delegitimisation could certainly have a brief section on "Delegitimisation of elections", and then be cast as the parent article for a new, more detailed article on the topic, to be entitled Delegitimisation of elections or "Election interference" or similar. If there isn't already something like that in the encyclopedia, it would make a great addition. Note that Election interference is currently a redirect to Foreign electoral intervention, but you could usurp the redirect for an article that covered both domestic and foreign interference; the latter as a brief summary, with a {{Main}} link to the existing article. Mathglot (talk) 19:53, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks. I added it to the "Delegitimisation" article. I cannot create a new article but better for others who are more familiar with Wikipedia and this issue to write it. Will try asking for more information at the reference desk link that I see in the banner. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 219.74.217.15 (talk) 06:59, 3 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

You're going to have to add a citation to a reliable source or someone will probably remove it. Mathglot (talk) 06:03, 4 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Yes someone removed it. I think no point contributing it to Wikipedia. I am just looking for more information about this phenomenon, not an expert on it.

How to create an article

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Hey there, Wikipedia! I'm confused on how to create an article here. Can you kindly put me through the works? Imdofficial69 (talk) 10:25, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Imdofficial69 Creating a new article is one of the hardest tasks to perform on Wikipedia. It takes much time, effort, and practice, and often those who attempt it and fail in doing so end up disappointed and with hurt feelings as their work is mercilessly edited and deleted by others. I don't want you to have bad feelings, so I would suggest that you first spend much time editing existing articles in areas that interest you, to get a feel for how Wikipedia operates and what is expected of article content. Using the new user tutorial will also help you.
If you still want to attempt to create a new article now, please read Your First Article, and then use Articles for Creation to create and submit a draft for review, so other eyes look at it before it is formally part of the encyclopedia, instead of afterwards.
If you are associated with the subject you want to write about, please review conflict of interest and paid editing for information on required formal disclosures that may need to be made. 331dot (talk) 10:29, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
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On the diff view page (e.g. this one), is there a quick way to get the internal link (Special:Diff/1026186689) without having to manually copy the diff number from the URL? Rublov (talk) 11:29, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Rublov: You can add a script to your common.js to make this easy. If you follow the instructions at User:Enterprisey/diff-permalink, each diff page will have an extra box at the top with the text "Special:Diff/<whatever>" and a button to copy that to your clipboard. -- John of Reading (talk) 12:53, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you. That is exactly what I was looking for. Rublov (talk) 13:03, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@Rublov: and if you add User:BrandonXLF/ShowRevisionID.js to your common.js, then all the diff numbers will show up on the history of every page, and you don't have to go to the diff page at all to get it. Mathglot (talk) 19:34, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Mathglot, thanks for pointing out this script to me. I ended up adapting it into my own little script that adds a button to each entry on the history page to copy that entry's diff link to your clipboard. Rublov (talk) 02:22, 2 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@Rublov: Nice! Mathglot (talk) 02:31, 2 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Redirecting to a new page

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I would like to create a page for Samsung Electronics in Czech language. Unfortunately the keyword cs:Samsung Electronics is redirected to cs:Samsung (in Czech) therefore the link is not red and I cannot create a new page for SA Electronics.

User:Testestos, this helpdesk is for the English Wikipedia, you could ask at the Czech equivalent, cs:Wikipedie:Potřebuji_pomoc. TSventon (talk) 12:12, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
On the assumption that there's no regulatory or other (non-technical) problem related to your starting such an article, just click this and go. However, TSventon is correct. If you have a follow-up question about editing Czech-language Wikipedia, please ask there, not here. -- Hoary (talk) 12:16, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astha_Agarwal

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Hello,

Astha Agarwal is a renowned actor with her earlier wiki page https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astha_Agarwal Her page is no longer viewed. Can you please restore her page https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astha_Agarwal

Ashta Agarwal has verified Instagram handle @asthaagarwal2018

Thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by Avanish08 (talk • contribs) 12:55, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Deletion explained at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Astha Agarwal. - David Biddulph (talk) 13:29, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Actually, David Biddulph, the deletion discussion doesn't really help as the person who nominated it for deletion has been blocked as a UPE sock. I can't comment on the original article but some fuller explanation might be warranted. Mike Turnbull (talk) 14:06, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@Michael D. Turnbull: Although the nominator was a sock, the decision of the AFD was to delete as there were no reliable sources independent of the subject. An Instagram handle is not independent of the source, so would not change the situation. The AFD gives a link to Wikipedia:Deletion review, which explains the circumstances under which that process can be used. @Avanish08: Have you studied Wikipedia's definition of notability, and if so can you provide reliable sources independent of the subject? --David Biddulph (talk) 15:08, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Avanish08 I've started a deletion review here, as the only editors to that deletion discussion were sockpuppets of each other (who shouldn't have been editing Wikipedia). In the meantime, I would look into finding more independent, reliable sources about them. Joseph2302 (talk) 15:23, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@Joseph2302: The SPI said not socks of each other, I believe. But as both were blocked independently for sockpuppetry I'm happy to let your DRV run its course. --David Biddulph (talk) 15:43, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Is it possible to "un-submit" a draft for review?

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I genuinely don't know if this is actually possible, I haven't found anything by googling or any other way.

Would the draft get "un-submitted" automatically if gets rejected? Can I "un-submit" it myself? CordiBordi (talk) 14:16, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@CordiBordi: you can remove the submission templates from the page, which i think will automatically remove it from CAT:PEND. versacespaceleave a message! 14:19, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@CordiBordi: Yes, if you remove the submission template, the draft will become unsubmitted and you are allowed to do that yourself. If your draft is declined or rejected, it will also no longer count as submitted, which means that you need to resubmit it (only if it got declined, if it was rejected you don't) after you made the corrections. Victor Schmidt (talk) 15:12, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@VersaceSpace: The draft has been declined (not rejected) and that moves it from CAT:PEND to Category:Declined AfC submissions. Once a submission has been reviewed we do not recommend removing the submission template; we leave the feedback there for the benefit of the author(s) and subsequent reviewers. --David Biddulph (talk) 15:16, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Mass media in Ethiopia

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Can you remove an isolated name called "ENN" out of the table in Mass media in Ethiopia#Television and radio channels. It is undone by me. The Supermind (talk) 18:28, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Could you elaborate on this? I don't understand your question, but at a glance it seems like it should actually be right where it is. Beeblebrox (talk) 18:55, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
I have placed it in the table by putting in the character that starts a line, which was missing. Britmax (talk) 18:56, 1 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]
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