Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2023 August 8

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August 8

problem moving an article

I have moved articles before.
I wanted to move VV ZOB to vv ZOB because that's how it's commonly spelled/capitalised in the Netherlands and the footballclub calls itself that on it's homepage, see bottom right underneath contact here: https://www.vvzob.nl/
Somehow it was moved to Vv ZOB. Naturally I assumed I screwed up and tried to do it again. WP didn't allow this. No matter what is typed in the searchbox, it always goes to Vv ZOB. Dutchy45 (talk) 04:50, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

• @Dutchy45: This is a technical restriction of our wiki software. See Wikipedia:Naming conventions (technical restrictions). This will likely require use of a displaytitle command, but I am unsure if this would meet our naming conventions in general. You may wish to ask someone at Wikipedia:WikiProject Football. Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 05:17, 8 August 2023 (UTC)
  • Specifically in this case you can use the {{lowercase title}} template. Caeciliusinhorto-public (talk) 09:35, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

Missing TOC

My question was first put here but not yet answered. How can one generate a missing TOC in this situation, please? Bjenks (talk) 08:46, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

Bjenks I clearly see the standard ToC - which Wikipedia version and wikipedia skin are you using? - (The answer to your earlier question is 2023_Ashes_series#Fifth_Test) - Arjayay (talk) 08:59, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

@Bjenks The relatively new vector 22 skin which is now the default for reading Wikipedia places the section headers/links to the left of the article: any article, not just the one you referred to. Likewise on this Help Desk. If you want to return to the previous look, there's a menu item to do that at the upper left here: see "Switch to old look". Mike Turnbull (talk) 10:40, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

@Bjenks: If you don't see the ToC to the left of the screen as Michael D. Turnbull pointed out and you're on the default Vector 2022 skin, it may be hidden under a dropdown menu that may be accessed by clicking the icon next to the article's title. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 14:12, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

I have been using the vector 22 skin with (I now see) the limited-width option. Since I work on a desktop and never a smartphone, I've now dropped the responsive and limited-width modes but find that I still cannot see a ToC in that or any other article! (This is a recent phenomenon, since I regularly use ToCs.) OK, next move is to revert to vector legacy (2010) and . . .Alleluia. . . the ToC is back!! So, many thanks, Mike Turnbull and Tenryuu, for suffering my bewilderment and helping out. Bjenks (talk) 14:33, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

new article

ask to be new article created Narayansaurabh (talk) 13:37, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

This needs to be more specific. See also Your first article.--♦IanMacM♦ ^{(talk to me)} 13:42, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

You can visit Requested Articles, but it is backlogged to the point of uselessness. The best way to see an article created is to do it yourself, though it is not an easy task. Please see the new user tutorial and the article wizard. 331dot (talk) 13:44, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

several sources that can be taken as a reference for more than one statement

hello everyone, I am currently working on the following draft: Draft:Franz Wilhelm Peren - Wikipedia as i would like to make the list of sources clearer i would like to find out how to refer several statements to the same link instead of giving the link several times. thank you!Akropolis17 (talk) 13:50, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

Akropolis17, you can use named references, see WP:REFNAME. TSventon (talk) 13:55, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

@Akropolis17 The link above goes to the advice about using an existing reference multiple times. I suspect you want to bundle together several references into a single citation number (in the article text) that leads to multiple sources backing that statement up. That's a more advanced usage described at WP:BUNDLING. Mike Turnbull (talk) 14:31, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

Akropolis17, you are currently using bare URLs as references, you may wish to read Help:Referencing for beginners and add some more detail to the references. TSventon (talk) 15:02, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

Akropolis17, there is a tool you can use that will convert your bareurl references into full citations, in many cases: see Wikipedia:reFill. Mathglot (talk) 04:42, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

Login and editing issues

I tried to log in but none of my passwords were accepted. I used my email so I'm assuming that was accepted. How can I get a password that'll be accepted. I also made some changes to the information about my dad's family but there were some citation problems and I need to know how to fix those 2601:14B:4600:BE50:756:415A:7C01:D5B5 (talk) 17:56, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

Hello. Help:Logging in should help you with the first issue, and Help:Referencing for beginners should help you with the second issue. Cullen328 (talk) 18:27, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

Incorrect attribution of photograph

Hello--I saw a photograph in a Wikipedia article that appears without appropriate credit. How can this be corrected? I'm not asking for it to be removed, but rather to have the photographer properly credited. Thank you. 2600:1700:ABB1:1F10:4885:C1DA:D44E:7727 (talk) 18:16, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

Which article and which photo? RudolfRed (talk) 18:17, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

The only place where the creator of an image should be credited is on the File description page for the image, not in any article that uses it. See WP:WATERMARK, last sentence.

However, this sort of question often points to a more serious problem. Has the owner of the copyright (usually the photographer) explicitly released the image under a licence such as CC-BY-SA, that allows anybody to reuse or alter it for any purpose, commercial or not, as long as they attribute it? If they haven't (and assuming the image is not being used under the very restrictive non-free content criteria) then the image should be removed. ColinFine (talk) 19:10, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

The article is on Steve Roper (a climber). Here is the link to the image file: File:Steve Roper.jpg. This photo was actually taken by/copyright by Glen Denny. Please see link to it on Glen's website: http://www.glendenny.com/Portfolios/076.html. There are 2 figures in the original photo, but you can see that the image of Steve Roper is taken from the original photo. At least one other image by Glen Denny is currently in use on Wikipedia, and in that case it has been properly attributed. See File:Warren Harding by Glen Denny.jpg. Glen Denny died in October 2022, and I am the executor of his estate, including intellectual property. I am not requesting removal of the image; rather, I am asking for it to be attributed in the same manner and under the same conditions as the Warren Harding (climber) image. (Also not asking for credit to appear in the article itself but in the File Description page.) Thank you. 2600:1700:ABB1:1F10:2157:68AA:8DF8:4B43 (talk) 00:30, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

Thank you for bringing this to our attention. I've deleted the image. Unlike Harding, Roper is still alive, so our non-free content policy doesn't allow us to use an image for his article unless it's freely licensed (barring certain extremely rare circumstances that don't apply here). —Cryptic 05:38, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

Hello again. The image has been deleted because it does not show any evidence that the legal owner of the copyright has licensed it in a way acceptable to Wikimedia.

I'm not sure whether an executor has the legal power to dispose of assets (which is effectively what would be required). If so, then you have the power to license the image in an acceptable way by following the procedure in donating copyright materials, and then upload it again. But be aware that in doing so you will be explicitly and irrecvocably granting permission to anybody to alter or reuse the image for any purpose, including commercial, as long as they attribute it. This may not be what you want, but it is required by Wikimedia policy, because the purpose is to provide a freely reusable resource.

If you do upload it, the photographer should be acknowledged on the file description page, but not normally anywhere else: in particular, not in an article (unless there is some reason relevant to the subject article why the photographer is significant). ColinFine (talk) 10:35, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

This was never about attribution in the article, and it wasn't the ip who uploaded the image. It was another user, who'd cropped and resized it (badly), and claimed it as their own work. —Cryptic 13:59, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

Ah. I didn't look at the Image description page. Thank you. ColinFine (talk) 15:48, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

WP won't let me publish my edit

I was working on this article, Impact of The Eras Tour, and everytime I hit publish changes, it says "Something went wrong" and then below a red box that says "⧼No stashed content found for 1167952273/5c5b2bc2-2f20-11ee-8c71-b04f13be4f10⧽"

What do I do?

｡ 🎀 𝒫𝓊𝓇𝓅𝓁𝑒𝓁𝒶𝓋𝑒𝓃𝒹𝑒𝓇𝓂𝒾𝒹𝓃𝒾𝑔𝒽𝓉𝓈 𝟣𝟩 🎀 ｡ (talk) 18:35, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

I'm not entirely sure when this happens, but rest assured it is a purely technical issue, and does not in any way depend on the content of your edit. I suggest saving the edited text off-wiki (in a file on your computer) and refreshing the article then trying again; and if that doesn't work, clearing your browser cache. ColinFine (talk) 19:11, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

@Purplelavendermidnights 17, this seems to happen when the Visual Editor is kept open for a long time - reading this previous report and the last replies to it may help. 199.208.172.35 (talk) 19:42, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

I found out my problem. I cited Wikipedia as a source.

｡ 🎀 𝒫𝓊𝓇𝓅𝓁𝑒𝓁𝒶𝓋𝑒𝓃𝒹𝑒𝓇𝓂𝒾𝒹𝓃𝒾𝑔𝒽𝓉𝓈 𝟣𝟩 🎀 ｡ (talk) 19:51, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure that's not the reason. Keep searching. Mathglot (talk) 04:37, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

I'm absolutely certain that is not the reason. As I said, the error is deep down in the software stack, and has nothing to do with the content of the edit. ColinFine (talk) 10:37, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

Why does the main page featured picture credit the creator?

Follow up to the question above regarding giving credit to a photographer in an article. The Wikipedia practice for using an image in an article is to only have the credit in the image file description and not give credit within the article itself. Why does the practice on the main page featured picture differ for that: I always see the photographer given credit on the main page. Shouldn't the credit just be in the file page like we do everywhere else? RudolfRed (talk) 20:05, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

@RudolfRed: My opinion: credit in the file description meets our ethical and legal obligations. The decision to also provide credit in the location that uses the image is an editorial judgement, and you should do it when it will increase the value to the reader. In almost all cases, when the image itself is the subject, the identity of the photographer is in that category, and this included main page featured picture. -Arch dude (talk) 20:18, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

@RudolfRed:, the "Today's featured picture" on the Main Page is about the picture, it's not just using the picture to illustrate something in an article. So providing details of the picture's source is appropriate. Maproom (talk) 07:44, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

Regarding Population Density of Counties/Parishes/Burroughs with a Significant Percentage of Water for their Total Area

I joined Wikipedia with the specific intent of altering how Wikipedia seems to calculate how population density is calculated. Specifically, it seems to calculate it based on the total area of a county/county equivalent (which includes its water area), not merely its land area. Since people don't really live on open water in most cases, and there are many counties with a sizeable percentage of total area that is water, I think that measuring population density by total area gives an inaccurate measure of how densely populated those counties are.

I had initially tried editing those counties' densities manually, but after most of those had been effectively reverted, I realized that wasn't the right way to go about this. I figured I needed to convince the staff as a whole on this change (or have them convince me not to further pursue this). I am also not sure if this is the right place to ask this, but this seems the closest to what I'm trying to ask. Rameal (talk) 20:20, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

I'm not seeing any instances of your edits being reverted, but I do agree that there's a better way you could be doing this. Rather than modifying each page individually, you could make an edit request at Template Talk:Infobox settlement to use the land area in the automatic density calculation rather than the total area. It looks like someone else already asked about the same thing there, but didn't get any response. WelpThatWorked (talk) 20:40, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

Per Wikipedia:No original research, we have to go by what the sources say. AndyTheGrump (talk) 21:02, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

Istro-Romanian-language sources

Tracked in Phabricator
Task T343922

Hello, I've already brought this up at Help talk:Citation Style 1 but it went ignored.

Istro-Romanian is one of the Balkan Romance languages. The others are Romanian, Aromanian and Megleno-Romanian. Adding a parameter |language=ro/rup/ruq in a citation template will produce (in Romanian/Aromanian/Megleno-Romanian), but |language=ruo does not produce (in Istro-Romanian). An example is reference 50 at Istro-Romanians. I fixed it manually with |version= but I don't see why Istro-Romanian should be excluded from Wikipedia's technical code, or whatever the root of this is. Note that there is already Template:Lang-ruo so it's not a problem of "ruo" or of the language not being integrated anywhere within Wikipedia's code.

How can this be fixed? Super Dromaeosaurus (talk) 21:50, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

Yep, you did, but for some reason, I did not see it. Module:Citation/CS1 ({{cite book}} etc) gets its language support from MediaWiki. MediaWiki does not know about all language tags and language names. One language tag that MediaWiki does not know about is ruo:

{{#language:ruo|en}} → Istro Romanian – if ruo were known, this would have returned the language name; cf.

{{#language:ro|en}} → Romanian

The only fix is to write the language name in full:

|language=Istro-Romanian

Your misuse of |version=(in [[Istro-Romanian language|Istro-Romanian]]) corrupts the citation's metadata. Don't do that.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 22:31, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

Is there not a way to incorporate it into MediaWiki? Super Dromaeosaurus (talk) 09:23, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

If you can make a persuasive argument for it, WP:Phabricator.

An alternate option is to append {{in lang}} after the end of the {{cite book}} template.

{{cite book|title=Title}} {{in lang|ruo}}

Title. (in Istro Romanian)

—Trappist the monk (talk) 13:05, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

Thanks. I initiated a request (or "task" or whatever) there. Super Dromaeosaurus (talk) 19:21, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

Who to complain about chauvinism?

My article, with a bunch of references, was completely deleted: sh:Dečji logor Sisak. 77.46.186.235 (talk) 22:18, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

Hello. The Teahouse provides assistance with the English Wikipedia only. You will have to raise your concerns on the other language version, which is an independent project. Cullen328 (talk) 22:23, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

Specifically, you should bring up the matter at Serbo-Croatian Wikipedia. -- Hoary (talk) 23:28, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

Possibly at the Marketplace (sh:Wikipedija:Pijaca) or at AFD (sh:Wikipedija:Članci za brisanje). Good luck, Mathglot (talk) 04:31, 9 August 2023 (UTC)