Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Humanities/2006 October 7

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types of espresso drinks

There is a type of espresso drink made by the usual method, but the barrista yanks the receiving cup off the machine halfway through the normal volume of flow. Frequently this would be ordered as a double, probably to provide adequate volume (the normal volume of a single). I think the intent is to have a better-tasting result, based on the idea that the first part of the flow tastes better than the latter. Does anyone know what this is called? I used to get requests for it 25 years ago when I worked in a cafe'. Thanks for your help!

71.236.231.238 00:18, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

See Ristretto.

Thank you very much!

Average age of goverments, based on goverment form

Think I read something about how long different goverment forms survives on average, but didn't manage to find back to it. I'm wondering how long do different goverment forms survive on average? That is how old is the average democracy, autocracy, monarchy, junta, etc, when it's changed to a different goverment type? And more genereally: are some goverment forms more "stable" than others? And by how much? I think maybe democracies are most stable, but I dont have the numbers.

Wondering because if:
1) democracies are more stable than others, and new goverments are just as likely to be democratic as something else.
2) democracies never or almost never go to war against each other
3) democracies never or almost never suffer famine

Then:
1) someday every country will be democratic
2) we will have world peace
3) and no hunger

By calculating creation/upheaval of democracies it would then be possible to calculate apporximatly when world peace will happen. So when do we have world peace I guess is my real question? :) --Kristod 01:40, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

You think the U.S. has no hunger?! Clarityfiend 02:12, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

You're damn right. Compare tables for starvation rates in the United States and in other countries. —

Hunger in the sence of famine. --Kristod 10:36, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

X [Mac Davis] (SUPERDESK|Help me improve)10:04, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Democracies go to war with eachother. The Kargil War was between democratically elected governments, I believe. Plus, those ancient Greek city-states had elected governments that fought eachother, If I recall correctly. And I'd bet that, on average, juntas have the shortest lifespan, with Burma (and yes, I called it Burma) being an exception. Picaroon9288 02:21, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

There is also the case of the War of 1812, between the more-or-less democratically elected governments of the US and the UK, or the cases in which the United States overthrew or helped overthrow democratic governments, as in Iran in 1953, Guatemala in 1954, and in Chile in 1973. Marco polo 00:31, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

Lebanon and Israel are both democracies. User:Zoe|(talk) 03:18, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

• Lebanon is more of an anarchy, and anyway is (1) overrun by foreign militias and (2) occupied by Syria on and off. --Uncle Ed 16:39, 29 January 2007 (UTC)

World Peace? Next week sometime, I think. White Guard 03:21, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Israel and Lebanon are both democracies, but as far I understand it, the war was against Hezbollah, not Lebanon. I don't think any Lebanese soldier participated in the fighting.Evilbu 15:08, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Hezbollah is an official, legal, democratically-elected participant in the democratically-elected government of Lebanon. User:Zoe|(talk) 01:47, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

There's an article on Democratic peace theory... AnonMoos 14:54, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

I would like to point out that-even if the theory that democratic countries never go to war with each other is true- there could still be war. Think of Spain, France (with Corsica).. and yes : Belgium. Who says everyone within that country is happy with its structure?Evilbu 15:08, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Civil war? 惑乱 分からん 15:21, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

There must be a long list of democratic countries that have experienced famine and gone to war (the US was of course the first example given, but it is by no means the only one). But you seem to assume that 'once a democracy always a democracy'. Now democracies probably have a pretty strong staying power, but don't let that lull you into too strong a feeling of safety. Don't forget Hitler came to power by democratic means. In a democracy, if the people want war and denial of basic rights they will have it. Just look at what is happening right now. They think the state will only misuse its powers against other people. That's what they thought in Germany in the 1930's too. When they realised they had given away too many of their rights it was too late. DirkvdM 07:19, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for this astute observation, Dirk. I think that all three of Kristod's assumptions about democracy are doubtful, including especially the assumption that democracies are stable. In fact, historically, democracies in general have been very unstable. When democracies fail to contain public unrest, or when they hamper military or other elites in the pursuit of some agenda, they tend to fall, often in coups. Marco polo 00:31, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

Historically, the least-stable form of government is a junta or other power-sharing dictatorship, while the most stable are kingdoms and other hereditary governments. Elective democracies tend to fall somewhere in the middle of things. --Serie 23:03, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

Clarification
I do not believe "world peace" will happen soon or even at all. The question was maybe a bit to controversial to get a reasonable answer (but did encourage debate...). I do not either believe that democracies are "unstoppable", contrarily, they change quite often (Thailand coup), but some of the oldest continuous governments are democracies (US, UK). And I think the numbers would be quite interesting. For the hunger and the war, ok that is quite controversial. Let's just say it would happen to a lesser degree:

• Compare hunger in communist China with the more democratic India, for instance Amartya Sen[1] has written some books on this.
• Wars between democracies so far are few and mostly borderline cases. List of possible exceptions to democratic peace theory for a full discussion.
• Civil war is of course possible in democracies to, but again there is less large scale violent conflict and genocide in democratic countries (Russian gulags and Pol Pot come to mind)

I'd like any sources to the statistics of what percentage of new governments are democracies, and how long they on average last versus other forms of governments. I think maybe it would be possible to calculate a rough estimate on the eventual democracy/non-democracy ratio. This would be quite unscientific, even if these number were possible to find, they would still change with time and technology (for instance monarchies dominated the world 200 years ago, but not any more). --Kristod 08:46, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

The numbers on democracies v non-democracies change on the basis of broad-brush ideological factors, and so are difficult to draw inferences from. Over the 20th century, the ratio of democracies changed as follows: the breakup of European empires (up); the Great Depression and the rise of Fascism (down); the end of African and Asian colonialism (up); the gradual establishment of one-party states in those newly free colonies (down); and the fall of the Berlin Wall and the End of History (up). So we can't calculate an eventual democracy ratio without predicting big future changes like that, which is very difficult indeed. Freedom House has a historical database of which countries are 'free', though I have severe problems with their POV. Hornplease 10:23, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

Sarah Vaughan was also addicted to crack at the age of 10 and faught this addiction until she was 16. i pop bottles

Sarah Vaughan

What style of jazz did Sarah Vaughan do? Keep the answer simple i.e. 'swing'.

This sounds like homework. John Riemann Soong 01:40, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

I really doubt some teacher asked of her students "what style of jazz did Sarah Vaughan do?" This may be related to a musical biography of Sarah Vaughan, but I don't believe it is a homework assignment in itself. Hyenaste ^(tell) 01:42, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Why else would a simple answer be wanted? What use would that be? I could envision this as part of a fill in the blank question. John Riemann Soong 02:51, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Oh, dont be so cynical, if you're goin to be like that about things just about everything on here could be homework. Its perfectly reasonable for someone to wonder what sort of style of jazz a song is, and if that song is by Sarah Vaughan so be it. We do not need a backstory. And anyway the rule is we dont do peoples homework for them, i.e. if posted with homework we dont do it, not that we dont help people with homework, i.e. if they have done all they can, then used wikipedia as a resource, then come to the refdesk if the article is not adequate, then we do help. Philc _T^E_C^I 20:26, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Maybe the OP seeks a short phrase to describe her taste in music? Even if it was a fill-in-the-blank question, the no homework policy is intended to discourage users from asking lengthly homework questions, like Describe the impact of Sarah Vaughan's vocal style on the jazz movements of the 1950's. How do modern artists also affect their respective genres of music? rather than fill-in-the-blank trivia. Hyenaste ^(tell) 03:09, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

IT IS NOT HOMEWORK. I just can't seem to find out what kind of style she does (if it was homework, it would already be due).

Death penalty

I always hear that there are prisoners who are murders.Criminals who murders another person goes straight to the death penalty or has life in prison. How does that work? How does one decide if it should be life in prison or death? For example a man explained and admitted/caught that he killed a man like he was getting a glass of milk from the frigde, like it no big deal and he gets life in prison.

Depends on the nature of the offence and the laws of that particular country. Suggest you read Wikipedia's article on the death penalty.--Shantavira 08:06, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Thank you for your help

French distrust

Where does the distrust of the French in the US and UK come from? — X [Mac Davis] (SUPERDESK|Help me improve)10:05, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

• French perfidy - Nunh-huh 10:09, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

• There are articles on Francophobia and anti-French sentiment in the United States... AnonMoos 14:48, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

The most recent incident was when the French campaigned for Israel to stop their fight against terrorists (Hezbollah) in Lebanon, with the promise of a robust UN peacekeeping force in it's place. Then, they only initially volunteered a pathetic token force as their own contribution. From the US, it would appear that they are working in support of Hezbollah. StuRat 19:40, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Before that it was the French opposing the unilateral invasion of Iraq. Damn these French, always trying to prevent wars! DJ Clayworth 21:31, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

And before that, there was Philippe Pétain, opposing any war between France and Germany. You're right! Damn those French for always trying to prevent wars! Loomis 23:28, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

There is a long, long history of rivalry, warfare and mutual mistrust between the UK and France, which really only came to an end in the early part of the last century, when Germany began to be preceived as the greater threat. The rapid collapse of French resistance in 1940 and the subsequent hostility between the Vichy authorities and the British government created a new mood of resentment. This was compounded after the war by General de Gaulle's distrust of the 'special relationship' between the UK and the US, which caused him to veto British entry into the European Union. White Guard 23:46, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

He also called for Quebec independence from Canada. On Canadian soil. User:Zoe|(talk) 01:48, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Ssssshhhh .... Canada is not the US. Better run before a bunch of Canadians jump on your neck. DirkvdM 07:23, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Not at all, Zoe is right. DeGaulle was a prick when he came up here to Montréal. "Vive La France, Vive Le Québec, Vive Le Québec LIBRE!!!!" Oh shut up Chuck. Leave your brown French nose where it belongs. Loomis 01:52, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

Read the question again. It's about the UK and the US, not Canada. DirkvdM 06:58, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

It also, if I'm not incorrect, seems to involve France a bit too, n'est ce pas? :) Loomis 09:24, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

Oui, la perception des Francais dans les États Unis et le Royaume Uni. Pas dans Canada. (Excuse my French.) DirkvdM 06:44, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

Well, excuse my French but "You've got no fucking idea what you're talking about"! :-) Ok sorry, I just couldn't help it. I'm not sure if it's the same in Europe, but in NA when someone is about to swear, they often preface it by saying: "Excuse my French". I've never really understood how that's originated. En tous cas, Zoe a introduit le Canada et le Québec. Je pense que j'ai eu le droit de repondre. Loomis 06:33, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

That was a follow-on to There is a long, long history of rivalry, warfare and mutual mistrust between the UK and France. User:Zoe|(talk) 21:06, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

There is not much of a problem with distrusting the french in the UK, though some of their mannerisms and things cause an above normal level of people to think they're assholes, I think when push came to shove, people would trust them. Philc _T^E_C^I 20:21, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Regarding the UK and France, people seem to have forgotten about the Auld Alliance which ran for about 2 and half centuries. Bwithh 22:11, 14 October 2006 (UTC)

This reminds me of a funny story I once heard. At one point the French requested of the British if they would allow them to erect a statue of Charles deGaulle somewhere in London, with his the words "Vive la France!", for which he was so proud of saying, written under it. The Brits were perfectly ok with it, but requested that they in turn be permitted to erect a statue of Sir Winston Churchill somewhere in Paris, with his famous "We Shall Never Surrender!" quote written underneath. For some inexplicable reason, the whole plan was shelved. Loomis 21:47, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

Answer these questions

• 1.Name of Muslim women belongs to Iran recently visited space.
• 2.Name of person recently won the noble prize in Physics belongs to America
• 4.Next Hockey Cricket and Footbal world cups will held in which countries
• 5.Name of first noble prize winner form Asia
• 7.Name of Thai General who took over the powers in Thailand
• 8.Name the Planet recently discovered which replaced Pluto
• 9.Name Richest person of world
• 10.The powerful candidate for next UN secretary general belongs to China name
• 11.When National security council was established in Pakistan
• 12.Macmohan line is boundry between.........and ...........
• 13.International litracy day is celebrated on............
• 14.Name the Chinese Ambassader to UN
• 15............ is called land of rivers
• 16.Who is Pakistan's Ambassader to UN

thanks

This would appear to be a quiz. Do your own homework! (Try searching at Wikipedia and Google etc. for a start...) By the way, which were questions 3 and 6? 惑乱 分からん 10:42, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Well, some thoughts, but check the answers.
1.Name of Muslim women belongs to Iran recently visited space.

Anousheh Ansari

2.Name of person recently won the Nobel prize in Physics belongs to America

John Mather and George Smoot

4.Next Hockey Cricket and Football world cups will held in which countries

perhaps someone who cares will answer

5.Name of first Nobel prize winner from Asia

probably Rabindranath Tagore in 1913

The first Asian scientist to win the Nobel prize was Chandrasekhara Venkata Raman, 1930

7.Name of Thai General who took over the powers in Thailand

Sondhi Boonyaratkalin

8.Name the Planet recently discovered which replaced Pluto

nothing replaced Pluto; Pluto became a dwarf planet, and so did Ceres and Eris. Of these, only Eris was recently discovered (2005).

9.Name Richest person of world

William Gates III, according to Forbe's Magazine

10.The powerful candidate for next UN secretary general belongs to China name

Ban Ki Moon is the Secruity Council's nominee; he is Korean, not Chinese. China had pushed hard for an Asian; tradition dictates that the Secretary General not be from any of the five veto-holding security council members, so a Chinese candidate would be unlikely.

11.When National security council was established in Pakistan

National Security Council of Pakistan 2004

12.Macmohan line is boundry between.........and ...........

India and China

13.International literacy day is celebrated on............

8 September

14.Name the Chinese Ambassador to UN

Yingfan Wang?, Liu Zhenmin?

15............ is called land of rivers

India, but so are other places, historical and present: Nairi, Jotbath, Kerala....

16.Who is Pakistan's Ambassador to UN

Munir Akram?

- Nunh-huh 10:48, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

The next IIHF Ice Hockey World Championship will be held in Russia in 2007, if that's what you mean... but by grouping it with cricket and football, perhaps you mean field hockey, in which case our Hockey World Cup article doesn't say. It's not until 2010 so maybe they haven't picked a country yet. The 2010 FIFA World Cup will be in South Africa, and the next Cricket World Cup will be in 2007 in "the West Indies" in general, not one specific country. Adam Bishop 15:42, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

About france

1. Which Place in France is Known as little Venice?
2. The players of french football team wear a little emblem on their Jersey,What is it?
3. Who decreed that January 1 shud be the start of the new year?

Please sign your questions, with ~~~~.

1. Don't know
2. France national football team
3. Gregorian calendar (what's that got to do with France?)

--ColinFine 12:09, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Despite popular belief Gregory didn't decree that January 1 was the beginning of the new year in 1582. I think Nunh=huh is right that whoever asked the question is looking for Napoleon, but as a point of reference Julius Caesar did declare January 1 to be New Year's Day back in 45 BC, just after he conquered Gaul. --70.72.19.133 14:37, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

1. Colmar; 2. the Coq Gaulois (Gallic rooster); 3: well, most recently, Napoleon I when he abolished the Revolutionary Calendar, which had a year that started in September. - Nunh-huh 12:10, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Article Search

Several years ago Good Housekeeping published an article on what one should read to be considered "well read." It gave book titled to be read over 10 or so years. Can you help me with the article?

No, but I bet someone on the Good Housekeeping Messageboards can. Try posting your question there. Anchoress 19:17, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Please, please do not rely on Good Housekeeping or any other such source to determine for you what it is to be 'well-read'. This is not a recipe, for goodness sake. To be truly 'well-read' is to be beyond any such guidance or manipulation. White Guard 23:32, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Oh, good grief, there's nothing wrong with acknowledging that what being "well-read" means is determined by others, or in accepting guidance from them towards the goal of becoming well-read one's self. - Nunh-huh 23:51, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Regardless of whether or not Good Housekeeping is a source of enlightenment or not, here's a list of must-read literature I picked up many years ago:

• Adventures of Huckleberry Finn
• The Aenid
• Age of Reason
• Alice's adventures in Wonderland and Through the Lookingglass
• All quiet on the Western Front
• The American
• Andersonville
• Animal Farm
• Anna Karenina
• Arrowsmith
• Babbit
• Bell Jar
• Beowolf
• The Bible
• Big Sky
• Billy Budd
• Brave New World
• Brothers Karamozov
• Caine Mutiny
• Call of the Wild
• Candide
• Canterbury Tales
• The Castle
• Catch-22
• Catcher in the Rye
• The Chosen
• Complete Stories of Edgar Allen Poe
• Color Purple
• A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court
• Count of Monte Cristo
• Crime and Punishment
• Cry, the Beloved Country
• Daisy Miller
• Darkness at Noon
• David Copperfield
• Death Comes for the Archbishop
• A Death in the Family
• The Dollmaker
• Don Quixote De La Mancha
• Dracula
• Dune
• Emma
• Ethan Fromme
• Fahrenheit 451
• A Farewell to Arms
• Farewell to Manzanar
• Fathers and Sons
• The Fixer
• Flowers for Algernon (David & Lisa)
• For Whom the Bell Tolls
• Frankenstein
• French Lieutenant's Woman
• Germinal
• Giant
• Giants in the Earth
• Go Tell it on the Mountain
• Gone with the Wind
• Good Earth
• Grapes of Wrath
• Great Expectations
• Great Gatsby
• Great Short Works of Joseph Conrad
• Geeen Mansions
• Grendel
• Gulliver's Travels
• Heart is a Lonely Hunter
• Hiroshima
• Hobbit
• House of Seven Gables
• Hunchback of Notre Dame
• I Heard the Owl Call My Name
• I Never Promised You a Rose Garden
• The Iliad
• In this Sign
• Invisible Man
• Ivanhoe
• Jane Eyre
• The Jungle
• Jungle Books
• Kidnapped
• The King Must Die
• Kristen Lavransdatter
• Last of the Mohicans
• Little Women
• Look Homeward Angel
• Lord Jim
• Lord of the Flies
• Lord of the Rings (toke a spliff or two)
• Madame Bovary
• Magic Mountain
• Main Street
• Mayor of Casterbridge
• Metamorphosis
• Mill on the Floss
• Les Miserables
• Moby Dick
• Moll of Flanders
• Le Morte D'Arthur
• Mutiny on the Bounty
• My Antonia
• Native Son
• The Natural
• Nausea
• 1984
• Nectar in a Sieve
• Northwest Passage
• The Odyssey
• Of Human Bondage
• Of Mice and Men
• Old Man and the Sea
• Oliver Twist
• On the Beach
• The Once and Future King
• One Day in the Life of Ivan Denisovich
• One Hundred Years of Solitude
• The Oxbow Incident
• Painted Bird
• Pearl
• Le Pere Goriot
• The Picture of Dorian Grey
• Pilgrim's Progress
• The Plague
• Portrait of a Lady
• Portraid of the Artist as a Young Man
• Power and the Glory
• Pride and Predjudice
• Quo Vadis
• Rabbit Run
• Rebecca
• The Red and the Black
• Red Badge of Courage
• Red Pony
• Return of the Native
• Robinson Crusoe
• Roll of Thunder, Hear my Cry
• Saturday Night Fever
• Scarlet Letter
• Separate Piece
• Shane
• Sherlock Holmes, the Complete Stories
• Siddartha
• Silas Marner
• Sister Carrie
• Slaughterhouse-Five
• Song of Roland
• Sons and Lovers
• Sound and the Fury
• Star Wars
• Stranger
• Sun Also Rises
• Tale of Two Cities
• Three Musketeers
• Time Machine
• The Tin Drum
• To Kill a Mockingbird
• To The Lighthouse
• Tom Jones
• Treasure Island
• A Tree Grows in Brooklyn
• Turn of the Screw
• 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea
• U.S.A.
• Ugly American
• Uncle Tom's Cabin
• Vanity Fair
• Walkabout
• War and Peace
• Wind, Sand, and Stars
• Winesburg, Ohio
• Women in Love
• Wuthering Heights
• The Yearling
• You Can't Go Home Again
• Zorba the Greek

Ah, yes; the perfect list for the aspiring autodidact of today. It must have taken so much time and effort to compile; I'm impressed. Now, get going. Questions will be asked. White Guard 01:31, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

Geez, that was a huge list. I've only read about a fifth of them. 192.168.1.1 8:55PM, 7 Rocktober 2006 (PST)

Have you read Star Wars? What was it like?  freshofftheufoΓΛĿЌ  06:06, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

I haven't even heard of most of those titles. And Star Wars is a must read? That has to be a joke. Of course that is all matter of taste and anyone who would take this list seriously and starts reading all the books should think about getting a mind of their own. That said, I do recommend reading 'Brave new world' and '1984' in tandem. It's a great comparison. DirkvdM 07:35, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Also, all the above are novels it seems. What about some works of science? 'The origin of species' is a classic. DirkvdM 07:39, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Yes, all are works of fiction: the list comes from the local public library system here, and is a list of all those works of literature you should have read in school but didn't. That's why it doesn't contain any non-fiction or scientific works. I do have a list of recommended books on the history of science somewhere, I think. (Oh, and yeah, I slipped a couple ringers in there too... I wouldn't seriously ask anyone to read The Aenid. It was late when I typed it, and I'd been sipping a nice single-malt Scotch.) -- 192.168.1.1 9:45, 8 Rocktober 2006 (PST)

Why not the Aeneid? I personally think it should be required reading for any educated person. At least more so than most of the books on this list. It was extremely influential (especially among poets) and will add greatly to one's appreciation of later literature — Dante's Divine Comedy in particular, another work that is conspicuous in its absence from this list. --dm ^(talk) 05:32, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

Oil Painting by Alexandre Jacobs

When I search for Alexandre Jacobs, the result is Marius Jacobs. I am searching for the painter. I am wondering what an oil painting by him would be worth.

Leslie

Any work of art is worth only what someone is prepared to pay for it. Since your Alexandre Jacobs seems not to be well known, it would be best to take the painting along to specialist.--Shantavira 18:25, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Name this song & artist

I'm trying to remember the artist in this song. It has a male singer during the chorus singing in a somewhat high-pitched voice to start something along the lines of "hold me close love, its all me, its all me... gotta ask yourself one question, where are you now?"... Croat Canuck Go Leafs Go 18:54, 7 October 2006 (UTC) isn't that the song with which James blunt broke through?dont remember the exact name Graendal 17:24, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

That would be Wisemen (song). High-pitched voice, hah. Hornplease 10:28, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

Nostalgia Collection

I posted this on miscel. earlier but didn't get what I wanted. I am looking for an audio or video file containing famous quotes or scenes from history, movies, and/or television. For example an audio file with "No, I am your father," "To infinity and beyond," and "E.T. phone home." I just want the most famous scenes from the most famous movies and TV shows all in one place. Or perhaps small clips of famous music. Thanks! Reywas92^Talk 20:38, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Deletion of New Artist Stub 'Lee Woods' Artmaid 20:36, 7 October 2006 (UTC)Artmaid

I've returned from holiday to find my first contribution to Wikipedia deleted by User 'SiGarb'. The article was about Plymouth born (UK) artist Lee Woods and the reason cited by 'SiGarb' was the absence of any reference to a critical review in a national newspaper of this artist which, it seems, would alone justify inclusion in Wikipedia.

I have a background as a lecturer in art history at undergraduate and post-graduate level, with a particular interest in artists of the 20th century, specifically those from the South West of England area; (St.Ives school, Newlyn School etc). Lee Woods is generally acknowledged as one of the most significant 'popular' artists currently hailing from this area of the UK and is one of the founder members of the new 'folk-art revival' movement which has been sweeping the UK since the early 1990's. I avoided the inclusion of such primary research (which I intend to include in a book I'm having published next year), however, all of the remaining information contained in the article is already very much in the public domain. The widespread nature of Lee's 'genetic zoo' series for example can be verified simply by searching the terms 'lee woods' and 'genetic zoo' together in google, or any other search engine. Prints and posters of his work are on sale from Vladivostock to Vancouver! As for the only other piece of information which might be percieved to be 'contentious' and need substantiation (the mass media coverage of the first genetic zoo exhibtion) one only need do a simple search of the reuters and associated press database for the date given in the article to verify the plethora of articles that this exhibition generated across the world.

The whole point of artists like Lee Woods and other members of the 'folk art revival' is that they are often self-taught, POPULAR artists, who paint and sell direct to their public and therefore frequently do not register on the established, public-subsidied art radar! They would not be the original, cult, folk-artists that they are if they received 'high-art' critique in national newspapers!

My Question is, how is wikipedia ever going to become an authoritative source of information if the submissions of interested academics like myself are so easily and speedily deleted by people of unquantifiable background knowledge, apparently limited ability to research and who are able to invoke/ invent apparently arbitrary and -in my opinion -ill-informed inclusion criteria? I have tried to contact the user 'SiGarb' in order to put these questions but he/she has chosen not to give a valid email address. How can this article be re-instated? If it can't be, I see absolutely no point wasting my time making future contributions. Yours Artmaid 20:36, 7 October 2006 (UTC)Artmaid

The reference desk is the wrong place to deal with this sort of issue. Try Wikipedia:Deletion review. —Keenan Pepper 21:58, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

BTW, I agree that the speedy deletion was out of order, and I can make the deleted text available to you if you'd like. —Keenan Pepper 22:06, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Hello, ArtMaid. I suspect the problem was that you were not around to argue the case. I have several times proposed articles for deletion, even on subjects I am not knowledgeable on, on the basis that the article as it stood did not give sufficient reasons to continue to exist. I'm not sure that deletion has resulted even once - what it has done is stimulated discussion and, hopefully, caused the articles to be improved. People do not usually reveal email addresses on Wikipedia: the way to contact SiGarb is by posting on his talk page User talk:SiGarb. --ColinFine 17:38, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Conjoined twin autobiography

Has a member of an unseparated pair of conjoined twins ever published an autobiography (or diary or journal or whatever)? —Keenan Pepper 22:05, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Would you count A Few particulars concerning Chang-Eng, the united Siamese brothers : published under their own direction., New York : J.M. Elliott, 1838? - Nunh-huh 22:24, 7 October 2006 (UTC) - And Daisy and Violet Hilton wrote an autobiography in 1942. - Nunh-huh 22:28, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

If the Germans had won WWII and the Final Solution had been completed

Do you think there would now be peace in the Middle East and worldwide, in terms of Islamic terrorism? Just playing devil's advocate here. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.65.142.31 (talk • contribs) 23:35, 7 October 2006

No. What effect would a German conquest of Europe and elimination of the European Jewry have on Sunni vs Shiite violence? Moderate Sunni vs Islamist Sunni violence? Muslim vs Christian violence? It would have no effect on such things. And all of these conflicts have created Islamic terrorism; therefore, the world would still have Islamic terrorism, even if there was no Israel. Picaroon9288 00:45, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

The Nazis would then move on to killing all the Muslims. They had no objection to killing off anyone who gave them trouble (even if only in their fevered minds). StuRat 03:26, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

But would they really turn on their good friend, the Grand Mufti? (Actually, I expect so.) Picaroon9288 03:36, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

No big deal. So many Native American tribes were eliminated from this planet. Life goes on. Nothing is the end of the world. -- Toytoy 03:45, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

I'm sure to the Native American tribes that were "eliminated", there certainly was an "end of the world". I'm not sure what you're trying to say with that statement.  freshofftheufoΓΛĿЌ  03:48, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

If Hitler made it, in a few years, people would visit Berlin as if nothing had ever happend. They would not be unlike people who visit today's New York, Boston, Los Angeles ... . History is written by the winner. -- Toytoy 03:59, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

True. It depends on whether you think that Hitler and those who followed after him would have continued to be as ruthless as they had been during the war, and after his death reflect on the atrocities that had been committed during his reign. Free society is not an inevitable precipitate.  freshofftheufoΓΛĿЌ  06:01, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

World peace in terms of terrorism (islamic or otherwise)? Terrorism is negligible compared to the destructive power of wars. Don't believe the hype. DirkvdM 07:44, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Terrorism has been practiced since the 19th century by dissident groups too weak to field an army to achive their aims. The Germans called the European Resistance movements terrorism. It is not purely a muslim invention or phenomenon, and while it was used by jews in the formation of Israel before they had an army, it wasnt invented by them either. So if you imagine a history as radically different as one in which Germany won WWII, you can spin any story you want about which group that might be today's terrorists in an alternate universe. alteripse 14:01, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Although I have to agree with Alteripse, I would like to point out that guerilla warfare is a form of terrorism and has been and still is one of the more ffective techniques. Graendal 17:27, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

The term "terrorism" has always been extremely difficult to define. Many, like alterprise, assert that the Irgun was a terrorist organization. To me, I define "terrorism" as the gratuitous killing of innocent civilians. I just can't equate the Irgun's retaliations against Arab attacks and its attack on the British "military, police and civil headquarters" at the King David Hotel, with the attacks on the entirely civilian WTC on 9/11. Note that I'm not quite sure if I'd regard the attack on the Pentagon as "terrorism", as the Pentagon, being the headquarters of the US military, is a bona fide military target. An attack on a bona fide military target is to me an act of war, not of terrorism. Loomis 22:05, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

The person who asked this question seems to assume that the root cause of unrest in the Middle East and Islamist terrorism is the existence of the Jewish state of Israel. If this were all or most of the cause, the questioner might be right that the Middle East would be at peace. But I would suggest that a leading cause of unrest and Islamism in the Middle East is the effort by western nations, and particularly the US and the UK, to control the region's oil and oil wealth, which has required repeated military intervention, sometimes with Israel serving as a US surrogate. Now, let's suppose that Hitler had conquered the Soviet Union and forced the UK to surrender and pledge neutrality or join the Axis. His next move would likely have been to take over the countries under French, British, or Italian influence or control that then covered most of North Africa and the Middle East, in order to secure their oil supply. He would probably also move to bring Iran under his control. This would have put Germany into conflict with Muslim (and perhaps Islamist) resistance and into conflict with the US and his erstwhile ally Japan. Or suppose that Hitler had somehow subdued the US as well. Germany would still face conflict with the Islamists and Arab and Iranian nationalists, as well as Japan, which would want to break the German stranglehold on oil supplies. It is hard to imagine Hitler agreeing to share Middle Eastern oil with Japan freely. Although he agreed to partition Poland with the Soviets, this was tactical and not a long-term commitment. Marco polo 00:59, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

Another point: To be successful with the Final Solution, meaning eliminating all Jews, Hitler would have had to conquer most of the Muslim world, at least from Morocco eastward into Persia, a region of the world where thousands of Jews lived. How would Islamic Salafists and other fundamentalists have reacted to Christian/pagan/infidel Nazis conquering the Muslim world? Not with flowers and kisses. dm ^(talk) 05:44, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

He could have just asked,most of the Muslim countries would destroy their own Jews for him.There was no need for him to conquer any of Muslim countries,because they hate Jews more then he did.

Um, yes. Sure. Good to know that even after the Holocaust, casual racism is still cool. EamonnPKeane 21:29, 10 October 2006 (UTC)