Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Humanities/2014 September 6

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September 6

Big and poofy dresses, corsets, and the need to go to the bathroom?

A long time ago, how did women use the bathroom or defecate/urinate with all those clothes plus the corset? Did they have to take the clothes off? What would happen if a woman had diarrhea and needed to expel waste frequently? 71.79.234.132 (talk) 02:48, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

First of all, she stayed at home or went home immediately if she had diarrhea. Remember that back in Victorian times (when those "big poofy dresses" were worn) medicine was in its infancy and there were still lots of serious infectious diseases (like typhoid and cholera) that had diarrhea as a symptom. They didn't take the chance: they stayed in bed at home in a nice comfy nightgown.

Second, the "big poofy clothes" you're imagining were worn only by the upper crust - maybe 0.5% of the population - and even then only in certain situations. They had boatloads of servants to help them get out of those layers if need be. The overwhelming vast majority of women wore practical clothing that really wasn't much harder to handle then clothing today - in fact, they might even have had it easier because with floor-length skirts there was no need for panties. The regular corset didn't reach low enough to pose an obstacle - and in fact could be quite comfortable if not laced fashionably tight (which most women didn't do - again, that was more common among the rich). --NellieBly (talk) 03:17, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

They used a "bourdaloue". --TammyMoet (talk) 10:17, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

I found INTERESTING UNDERPANTS: Victorian Women Could Pee Standing Up to which I will only add that the first public lavatories in the modern world seem to have been at The Great Exhibition in London in 1851, so there must have been a discrete way for ladies to "splash their boots" before that. Alansplodge (talk) 16:13, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

A tip for modern times, from a wedding dress supplier (via my wife, recently a bridesmaid at a friend's wedding): Get a large (unused!) bin bag, with drawstring if possible, and make a hole in the bottom sufficient to encircle the waist. The bride - or anyone else wearing a voluminous dress - steps into the bag, lifts the bag up to enclose the dress and hold it safely above the waist while excreting. 106.68.35.13 (talk) 09:33, 7 September 2014 (UTC)

I assume by "big poofy dresses" the OP means crinolines. In fact these were worn by people of all classes. Even streetwalker Maggie May is wearing one in a version of the song. And other members of her noble profession are also depicted in the same dresses (see File:Punch 1857.jpg). Far from creating a problem for "relief", they were the ideal garment for getting away with it with minimum visibility. In this period undergarments were shifts and petticoats. There were no knickers that wrapped between the legs. So, yes, a woman could pee standing up, and the puffy dress could conceal the evidence long enough for the lady to move on without too much embarrassment. There is a lot of evidence of public urination in the era. There are many cartoons of women squatting in the street. The Victorian sexologist Havelock Ellis recalls that as a child he often kept watch while his mother dipped behind a tree in the park. Rembrandt depicted such a scene two centuries earlier in this print. Paul B (talk) 20:11, 8 September 2014 (UTC)

Yokohama's 100 Steps

• https://www.flickr.com/photos/okinawa-soba/2409631100/in/photostream/

This was Yokohama's famous "100 Steps" (百段坂) taken in the 1880s.

If you download the picture in full resolution and check out the details, you may notice there's a sign on the house at the foot of the stairs that probably reads "WATCH, MARCH" or something like that.

Was that a clock store?

The kanji on the sign seems to read "？計時". Read from right to left, it means a clock in English. -- Toytoy (talk) 05:19, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

I think that it more likely reads 'WATCH MAKER'. AndyTheGrump (talk) 05:30, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

The third character may be 師. -- BenRG (talk) 19:11, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

How did you all manage to read the kanji from a few blobs of grey pixels? --Bowlhover (talk) 07:39, 7 September 2014 (UTC)

I can't really read them, but the English text is WATCH-MAKER, the right and center kanji blobs are shaped like 時計, 時計師 means watchmaker, and the left character isn't obviously not 師. (It looks more like 師 than like 店 or 屋, at least.) -- BenRG (talk) 06:19, 8 September 2014 (UTC)

Publishing

Hi, how many people would it require to set up a publishing house, and what would the basic costs be? Would I need a lawyer to negotiate contracts? Could I do it on my own? Are there any recommended books to read? Thank you! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.190.99.219 (talk) 21:06, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

There are whole books devoted to this subject, such as this one (which I'm not necessarily recommending, as I've not read it; it just appeared high in a Google search). You might try getting your hands on one, perhaps through your local library. There are plenty of one- or two-person publishing operations out there—the ones I'm most familiar with happen to be in the supernatural-fiction line, such as Ash-Tree Press and Tartarus Press—and for the real inside info on costs, etc., you might try contacting some, particularly those in the niche you're interested in, to see if they might help you out with information. Hopefully, they'll view you as a fellow enthusiast (almost all small publishers are enthusiasts about the kind of works they publish) rather than a potential competitor. Deor (talk) 10:57, 7 September 2014 (UTC)

I'm somewhat involved in publishing myself, through Paradise Press, which acts as a collective for gay UK authors, and I'll be bringing out Diverse Performances (http://www.foxearth.net/diverseperformances/) later this year. Two hints:

• don't expect to make any money out of it
• you'll probably need to do your own copy-editing: an absolutely essential book is New Hart's Rules published by Oxford University Press (mainly UK-based, but with many notes on differences between UK and US usage). --rossb (talk) 19:52, 7 September 2014 (UTC)

did any singers start their "careers" in karaoke?

so, this is kind of a dumb quest. I've heard of singers (or other musicians) whose first 'public' performances were as busking. But have there been any who started out with their first 'public' performances being karaoke bars? (as amateurs). I've heard some quite good singers at one local bar - I'm sure they could record! I wonder if any famous singers have come from that path. Justabud23 (talk) 23:59, 6 September 2014 (UTC)