Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/2018 February 7

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February 7

Spanish pronunciation of Giovanni

Is Giovanni in Spanish pronounced [dʒoˈβani, ɟʝo] or [dʒjoˈβani, ɟʝjo]?

Giovanni Lapentti: [1], [2], [3]

Giovanni Moreno: [4], [5], [6], [7] LoveVanPersie (talk) 16:02, 7 February 2018 (UTC)

Forvo: [8]

@LoveVanPersie: Definitely [ɟʝoˈβani]. There's no [j] and [dʒ] is just a regional variant of [ɟʝ] which shouldn't really be mentioned (per Help:IPA/Spanish). The correct place for discussing [dʒ] is Spanish phonology. Mr KEBAB (talk) 16:30, 7 February 2018 (UTC)

@Mr KEBAB: Thanks! Do you know Giovani's Portuguese IPA? LoveVanPersie (talk) 23:44, 7 February 2018 (UTC)

@LoveVanPersie: Nope. Mr KEBAB (talk) 10:13, 8 February 2018 (UTC)

Rhyming in English

Hi all,

How do you call words that are used together in English because they rhyme? Like space race, real deal, pay to play and so on. This concept is not found in some other languages. 2001:EE0:4041:47E2:B0AD:5A8:A755:D88A (talk) 16:07, 7 February 2018 (UTC)

The term you're looking for is Reduplication. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 17:37, 7 February 2018 (UTC)

Looking at the examples in the English section of the Reduplication article, I am unconvinced that they match the examples given above. I suggest Assonance as a closer match. Wymspen (talk) 22:30, 7 February 2018 (UTC)

There are some examples in each article. I take the OP's question to cover expressions like higglety-pigglety, willy-nilly, hare-um scare-um, fancy-schmancy, etc. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 00:09, 8 February 2018 (UTC)

That's wikt:harum-scarum. AndrewWTaylor (talk) 15:16, 8 February 2018 (UTC)

Aside from the typo (now fixed), I was thinking specifically of Hare-um Scare-um. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 19:00, 8 February 2018 (UTC)

Yes, Bugs. --70.29.13.251 (talk) 03:37, 11 February 2018 (UTC)

There once was a bishop of Salisbury … —Tamfang (talk) 08:20, 10 February 2018 (UTC)

Spanish pronunciation of Hugo Dellien

Is it [ˈuɣo ðeˈljen]? [9], [10], [11] LoveVanPersie (talk) 20:50, 7 February 2018 (UTC)

That looks right to me, except that the final /...ljen/ should be /...ljẽn/. —Stephen (talk) 22:09, 7 February 2018 (UTC)

You mean [-ljẽn], right? Nasalization isn't phonemic in Spanish. It's also not listed on Help:IPA/Spanish, so LVP should transcribe it simply as [ˈuɣo ðeˈljen]. Mr KEBAB (talk) 10:13, 8 February 2018 (UTC)

It's not phonemic, but Spanish phonology makes use of /ẽ/ and so on to show nasalization. I had not seen Help:IPA/Spanish before. It's a very simplified page. I think that Help:IPA/Spanish is only meant for casual use, for those who know very little about Spanish and who are just trying to approximate the pronunciation of a word or two. —Stephen (talk) 07:46, 10 February 2018 (UTC)

Either way, transcriptions enclosed within IPA-es link to that guide so we should have a consensus to add [ẽ] etc. to it before using those symbols in transcriptions of Spanish. Maybe you should raise the issue on Help talk:IPA/Spanish. Mr KEBAB (talk) 15:14, 10 February 2018 (UTC)

I usually do not edit en.wikipedia, so I don't want to raise an issue. For years on en.wiktionary, our IPA key has linked to the Wikipedia phonology page for a language (such as Spanish phonology), so that's what I'm accustomed to. I'm surprised that your Wikipedia IPA links to "Help:IPA/xx" pages instead of the regular phonology pages. However, now I see that en.wiktionary has recently changed its IPA link, which now links to a simplified wikt:Appendix:Spanish pronunciation page. I think these simplified pages are unhelpful. I don't remember seeing a discussion about changing the wiktionary IPA link, but I assume there must have been one. —Stephen (talk) 11:04, 11 February 2018 (UTC)